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red black baldy?

cypressfarms

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Moma cow is a commercial brangus, bull was a registered hereford. Moma has only produced black calves so far (this is her 4th calf) - but out popped a baldy - but she's not black. She's a dark red color. Her nose has black markings. Anyone ever seen this? Am I to assume that the moma has the red recessive gene because of this calf???


mama's in the background



 

HOSS

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Cypress, it's red now but may turn black. I've had two calves born red that turned completely black by 4 months old. With the black nose and eye pigment just like yours too. I notice that the legs are a very dark shade the same as my calves. Keep us posted on how it does.
 

cypressfarms

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HOSS":po6xeckk said:
Cypress, it's red now but may turn black. I've had two calves born red that turned completely black by 4 months old. With the black nose and eye pigment just like yours too. I notice that the legs are a very dark shade the same as my calves. Keep us posted on how it does.

Sounds like my arabian horses - they almost always change colors from their birth color. I bred ~10 of my brangus type cows to a hereford bull this past year to produce some black baldies, but wasn't really expecting this one.
 

redcowsrule33

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Mom may have the "wild-type" gene from the Brahma side which can also cause a red coat color. Based on the coloration I would bet she'll turn black eventually but not a true black (look at momma's coat in the pic - similar to that).
 

KNERSIE

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HOSS":3szf5g6g said:
Cypress, it's red now but may turn black. I've had two calves born red that turned completely black by 4 months old. With the black nose and eye pigment just like yours too. I notice that the legs are a very dark shade the same as my calves. Keep us posted on how it does.

The diluter gene she got from the brahman side often causes red calves to appear to turn black. You'll see this very often when you cross jersey and hereford, the calves are born red with white faces and some develope brindle stripes later while others turn almost completely black with just a lighter shade of charcoal along their backs.
 

cypressfarms

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KNERSIEo":1lwxb908 said:
You'll see this very often when you cross jersey and hereford, the calves are born red with white faces and some develope brindle stripes later while others turn almost completely black with just a lighter shade of charcoal along their backs.

Now there's a possibility! Moma cow has a head similar to a dairy cow, and she's not as "big eared" as most brangus'. She might have a little Jersey blood in her. Doesn't have the bag for too much, but you never know what's in the woodpile of a heifer bought from a stockyard.
 

randiliana

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I am betting on the wild type gene. Black is dominant to it, but if she passed it on to her calf, you could easily have a calf born that is reddish, but will darken with age. It won't likely ever be truly black, but it will darken to the point where you will have to look for the lighter areas. That is what this calf looks like to me. With the dark points (ears, nose and legs) I would bet that this calf is carrying the wild type gene from its mama and of course the red gene from the sire. The wild gene is dominant to red.
 

jfranseen

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Many of our Limousin calves are born a burnt red/brown color. They turn black with maturity. However they never look that red. Let's see what it looks like in a couple of months.
 

Rustler9

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That's a nice calf. We have alot of this in our Longhorns. The calves will be born either brown or red, have dark pigmentation around the eyes, feet, dark noses and sometimes dark hooves. We have a nice heifer calf right now that was born a bright red and white paint with dark nose and hooves. She's about four months old and has turned almost black where the red was. Her sire was the same way, born red but had the wild gene. She's out of a cow that's red and white but was the product of a black and white bull and cow. Usually in Longhorns, the animal may look black at maturity but will still have brown or reddish hair inside the ears and alot of times a brown stripe down the back.
 

cypressfarms

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We'll see how she does - I'll post pics in the upcoming months. One thing though, as much as I say I don't like to retain heifer calves because it takes too long to recoup money she may be a keeper. Her moma has an excellent bag and the hereford sire had a really nice looking moma and good maternal epd's. I bred a group of the brangus girls to the hereford bull to see what quality baldies they would throw. Hopefully they'll all be heifers - and I'll sell them as bred heifers down the road.

Thanks to everyone for the comments.

I went back and checked on some old notes that I had taken - when the moma cow that had this "red baldy" was a heifer (2002) I had commented that she had some red tinted black hair on her topline - I actually thought she could have been mineral deficient. Seems obvious now that she's carrying the red gene. Good to know down the road - I kind of like this color. Here's a pic of the moma with last years calf:
 

grand chaser09

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cypressfarms":365t8bfx said:
Am I to assume that the moma has the red recessive gene because of this calf???
either she does have a red recessive gene OR both your bull and your cow have dominate genes for each color. this can cause a mixing of the colors.
 

cypressfarms

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This is getting weird; last night when checking on the cows, another cow had a calf sired by the same hereford. To my dismay, this calf was also a "brown baldy". Great coloration around the eyes. I'll get pictures as soon as it quits raining, but this is getting weird!!! The next cow (brangus) bred to him should be due within the next week or so - I'll have a better idea then. What kind of red genes must this hereford carried to overpower that black??? This is really perplexing. Maybe is the "wild" gene surfacing. Anyway the bull was sold to a friend this past April - but I need to let him know any oddities, as he was going to use him to make some baldies as well.

I'll try to post a pic of this second brown baldy as soon as I can.
 

randiliana

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cypressfarms":1kvk0dq4 said:
This is getting weird; last night when checking on the cows, another cow had a calf sired by the same hereford. To my dismay, this calf was also a "brown baldy". Great coloration around the eyes. I'll get pictures as soon as it quits raining, but this is getting weird!!! The next cow (brangus) bred to him should be due within the next week or so - I'll have a better idea then. What kind of red genes must this hereford carried to overpower that black??? This is really perplexing. Maybe is the "wild" gene surfacing. Anyway the bull was sold to a friend this past April - but I need to let him know any oddities, as he was going to use him to make some baldies as well.

I'll try to post a pic of this second brown baldy as soon as I can.

There are only three base colors

Black which is dominant to both the others
Wild type which is dominant to red
Red which is recessive and requires 2 copies to show itself. Red is NEVER dominant to any color.

Your cows must have 1 copy of the red or wild type. If they have brahman in them it is VERY likely that they are carrying the wild type gene, and that they have passed it on to their calves. If they carry the Black gene and the Wild type gene, there is a 50% chance that they would pass either gene on to their calf. It is very unlikely that the bull has the Wild type gene if he is Registered Hereford. I suppose anything is possible though.

If they are carrying the red gene as well, there is a 50% chance of them passing that on to any calf. Bred Hereford, though that should result in a true red calf.

We have a cow here, that was born brown. She is now 8 years old, and she looks black, although she does have some lighter colored areas, such as around her muzzle. She carries the wild gene, and has thrown calves with wild type coloring when bred to Red bulls.
 

cypressfarms

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o.k., although I'm definitely no punute square expert, I have a decent working knowledge of coat color with cattle. It's getting weirder here at cypressfarms. Had a registered hereford bull breed roughly 10 of my commercial brangus to calve black baldies this winter into next early spring. First one came out and voila:


Her moma's background is not certain, so I chalk that up to having some red in the woodpile of moma's.

Second of the baldies hit:


Now this is getting weird. The moma cow here has only had two calves including this bull calf. I got this brangus cow from my dad as a heifer, and I laid my eyes on both the moma and sire of this cow. The sire was a registered brangus, the moma a commercial angus. Both black as coal. So what's going on here??? I've either ran across just a rare coincidence or the registered hereford bull I bred them with is shooting some serious red bullets. Any guesses???

This story will be continued, should have the next baldie (who knows what color) within 2 weeks.
 

1982vett

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cypressfarms":1mmc17fv said:
o.k., although I'm definitely no punute square expert, I have a decent working knowledge of coat color with cattle. It's getting weirder here at cypressfarms. Had a registered hereford bull breed roughly 10 of my commercial brangus to calve black baldies this winter into next early spring. First one came out and voila:

The moma cow here has only had two calves including this bull calf. I got this brangus cow from my dad as a heifer, and I laid my eyes on both the moma and sire of this cow. The sire was a registered brangus, the moma a commercial angus. Both black as coal. So what's going on here??? I've either ran across just a rare coincidence or the registered hereford bull I bred them with is shooting some serious red bullets. Any guesses???.

Any of these can carry the red gene even if the are black and pass it on.
 

dun

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In 17 years of calving bred to a red bull either Hereford or Red Angus Granny has had 2 red calves. Sadly only one was a hiefer.
 

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