Radical Islam

[KenB]

ISLAM: "Religion of Peace?"

Unfortunately, most people aren't aware of Islam's murderous philosophy or they find it too monstrous to believe. However, a brief review of recent history and current events should make you doubters out there re-think your position. Two articles in the L.A. Times wrote about Muslims in Indonesia forcing Christians of all denominations to convert to Islam or get their throats slit. Thousands upon thousands of Christians were first converted and, according to rigid Islamic religious dictate, forced to undergo sexual mutilation of their foreskin or clitoris (with kitchen knives and razor blades) to make them conform to Muslim standards. Then they were are enslaved to their local Muslim chieftain. This was not some aberration of Islam but rather business as usual for all but the so-called "moderate" factions. This is Islam's sad legacy of murder, terror, lies and brainwashing to advance their cause of global conversion and subjugation... their so-called "personal struggle"... THEIR "Jihad!"


Other examples: Algeria is wracked by bitter fighting between Islamic Fundamentalists and the military. Death toll, 100,000 over a ten year period! Nigeria is in the midst of a war in which Muslims are murdering Christians and burning down their churches. Moslems against Christians. It doesn't take much to trigger an angry mob of Muslims. The Miss Universe Pageant was help there at the end of 2002. Muslim opposition to the pageant boiled over after a local journalist wrote that the prophet Mohammed would have approved of the contest and might even have wanted to marry one of the contestants. The ensuing riots in Kaduna left 220 dead and 400 wounded. In Kenya the Islamic Party has declared Holy War on the government. In Turkey the secular Muslim government is being challenged by the militant Refah Islamic Party. A civil war rages in the Sudan between Muslims in the north against the Christians in the south. Sudan's militant Muslim regime is slaughtering Christians who refuse to convert to Islam. In recent years, more than two million Sudanese have been killed out of a population of 35 million as its government used bombings and famine in its war on its own people. Read this shocking June 2, 2004 World Net Daily article.

A war also raged between Muslim Eritrea and Christian Ethiopia. The result of fighting between Muslim Azerbaijans and Christian Armenians was 35,000 casualties. Armenia was shrunk because of territory "gained" by the "breeding-with-a- vengeance" Muslims population. Serbian Moslems looted Christian treasures in the process of destroying 107 churches and monasteries, both ancient and modern. In the former Soviet Union, breakaway Muslim republics (and their 55 million Muslims)... Chechnya (click HERE), Daghestan, Turkmenistan, Tajikistan and Uzbekistan... have sparked insurrection against Orthodox Russian regimes and by the year 2050, Russia will be forced out of Central Asia by Islamic invaders from without AND within (Muslims have a birth rate 5 times that of non-Muslim Russians). The Great Russian Bear will be driven into permanent hibernation!

ISLAM: "Religion of Peace?"

Ten thousand Lebanese Christians were massacred in 1860s, while over 100,000 were killed in the Lebanese civil war of 1975-1990. Thousands of women were raped. That war was provoked by Yasser Arafat's PLO. Damour was once a thriving Christian Lebanese village until 500 (primarily young boys) were massacred and its population was expelled. This sort of violence and intolerance symbolizes treatment of Christians by Muslims in the Middle East. And, instead of an international arrest warrant Arafat received a Nobel Peace Prize!

Even non-Muslim Christians under Palestinian-controlled areas ["West Bank" and Gaza] are not faring so well. Bethlehem was 70 percent Christian in the 1970s. Today it is close to 70 percent Muslim. The growing Islamization of Palestinian society makes Christians very uncomfortable. The size of the Christian Arab community in the West Bank may have fallen as low as 10,000, a drop of 50 percent since the mid-1990s.



Most of the so-called "moderate" Arab nations are scared to death of radical Islamic movements for they represent a most real physical threat to their continued absolute rule. For that reason alone, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Kuwait and all the other fictitious kingdoms throughout the Middle East gladly pay cash AND lip service to the most vicious of the Arab, Palestinian and Islamic Fundamentalist terrorists. The United States government, the State Department and other apologists may call them "friends" and "allies" but, in reality, they have nothing whatsoever in common with America. They are theocratic, backward and share NONE of the democratic traditions so valued in the West. "Friends" and "allies?" Hardly!

With all of the killing going on in Africa(and I know it is a fact)why in the he!! are we in Iraq? We have a good reason to be helping the Christians in Africa, not trying to save a bunch of Muslums in Iraq.

 

[Alice]

Again, aplusmnt, you are no Christian. I would like to say I will pray for your hate filled soul, but right now, as far as you are concerned, my forgiveness meter just ran out.

Alice

 

[badaxemoo]

With Muslims you think of Terror, Genocide, Hate, Killing and Oppression. Not very good fruits for Gods organization to be known for.

You're right. Because of the connection between the worlds Muslim and terrorist in th media, those things do sometimes come into my mind when I hear the word "Muslims".

I guess the difference between you and me is that I know enough about Islam that I know those instantaneous thoughts are not grounded in fact. I know that in the deeper part of my mind that Islam is a religion of 1 billion people worldwide, the vast majority of which have as much to do with terrorism as you or I.

On this topic, you and several other posters are showing a great deal of ignorance.

Why don't you travel to some place in the Islamic world and spend a month? Why don't travel to a mosque in an American city and meet some practicing Muslims?

I guarantee if you got to know a group of people who adhere to Islam, your views would change.

 

[badaxemoo]

I was hoping this thread would die soon, but I'm about to feed the fire. I found this article on what is generally considered a very conservative website.

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/default.aspx

Second column by Frank Pastore

Thank you, Van.

Mainstream conservatives and liberals know that Islam is not the problem.

 

[aplusmnt]

With Muslims you think of Terror, Genocide, Hate, Killing and Oppression. Not very good fruits for Gods organization to be known for.

You're right. Because of the connection between the worlds Muslim and terrorist in th media, those things do sometimes come into my mind when I hear the word "Muslims".

I guess the difference between you and me is that I know enough about Islam that I know those instantaneous thoughts are not grounded in fact. I know that in the deeper part of my mind that Islam is a religion of 1 billion people worldwide, the vast majority of which have as much to do with terrorism as you or I.

On this topic, you and several other posters are showing a great deal of ignorance.

Why don't you travel to some place in the Islamic world and spend a month? Why don't travel to a mosque in an American city and meet some practicing Muslims?

I guarantee if you got to know a group of people who adhere to Islam, your views would change.

If it was truly God religion it would not ever be known for the things it is known for. God would not be behind a religion that's biggest problem is trying to spin the evil that it does worldwide!

As far as going to Some Muslim Nation to hard to find one were a person can feel safe enough even consider it. If I am going to spend my vacation money it will be to support America. I do not need to go spend a month in Iran to see what kind of people they are.

I also do not need to go to a Mosque in America to see how the religion is.

The fruits of the Muslims are there for us to see, sure there is a few Nice ones, but there is way tooooo many evil ones.

We can be PC all we want to and say it is not popular to say a Religion can be inherently bad and they will catch us sleeping.

How many things can we keep burying our heads in the sand over? To just be Politically Correct?

If it Walks like a Duck, Quacks like a Duck then it most likely is a Duck. If a tree bears poisonous fruits then I would call that a bad tree.

Plus lets even say the Muslim faith as a whole is not evil, then show me some good fruits it bares? What are these nice people of the Muslim faith doing to spread their good fruit-age of their religion? How many Muslim Missionaries are they sending to Cambodia to help the hungry? How many Charities have they set up to help the blind in Africa?

I would love to see how many of these Good Muslims would do something nice for the Jews? Wonder how many of these billion Muslims do not harbor hatred for a Jew?

 

[aplusmnt]

Again, aplusmnt, you are no Christian. I would like to say I will pray for your hate filled soul, but right now, as far as you are concerned, my forgiveness meter just ran out.

Alice

Pretty strong statement to say about an individual just because they recognize and abhor the evil fruit-age of a specific Religion.

There is many Religions in the world, many different sects of those religions. Just because the word Religion is used to describe them does not mean they are inherently good.

Do you know how many religions over the years have existed that did human sacrifices, animalistic rituals or preached Prejudice and intolerance? Would these all be Good Religions just because many people practiced it or because they did it in the name of God?

The Muslim Religion has the Koran, you can read for yourself and see if it teaches good things I gave you some scriptures to look up what you do with them is your choice.

As far as praying for me, please refrain from doing this. I am not sure we pray to the same God, the God I pray to would hate and abhor the things that these people do. He also teaches me that as a Christian it would be my obligation to point out and teach others of such false religions.

 

[Alice]

Again, aplusmnt, you are no Christian. I would like to say I will pray for your hate filled soul, but right now, as far as you are concerned, my forgiveness meter just ran out.

Alice

Pretty strong statement to say about an individual just because they recognize and abhor the evil fruit-age of a specific Religion.

There is many Religions in the world, many different sects of those religions. Just because the word Religion is used to describe them does not mean they are inherently good.

Do you know how many religions over the years have existed that did human sacrifices, animalistic rituals or preached Prejudice and intolerance? Would these all be Good Religions just because many people practiced it or because they did it in the name of God?

The Muslim Religion has the Koran, you can read for yourself and see if it teaches good things I gave you some scriptures to look up what you do with them is your choice.

As far as praying for me, please refrain from doing this. I am not sure we pray to the same God, the God I pray to would hate and abhor the things that these people do. He also teaches me that as a Christian it would be my obligation to point out and teach others of such false religions.

I started a response to this garbage several times...and then it hit me..."Hey, Alice, you don't owe this yoyo squat, much less a response." However, you crossed the line with your garbage about my grandchildren.

You failed Sunday School 101, 102, 103, 104, etc., and you've failed humanity in general. The God I pray to is not hate filled...apparently the one you pray to is. You are not a Christian...what you are is what I was taught, in my First United Methodist Sunday School classes from the day I could comprehend the spoken word, to avoid...and to warn not only Christians, but all people of this world, against.

Alice

 

[ollie']

You are not a Christian...

I don't see anywhere in scripture where we as humans have the right or ability to say someone who claims to be a Christian , isn't one. If aplus has recognized himself to be a sinner and turned to Christ for the atonement of his sins, he's a Christian. Because your political persuasion is different than his doesn't make him a non christian.

 

[Alice]

You are not a Christian...

I don't see anywhere in scripture where we as humans have the right or ability to say someone who claims to be a Christian , isn't one. If aplus has recognized himself to be a sinner and turned to Christ for the atonement of his sins, he's a Christian. Because your political persuasion is different than his doesn't make him a non christian.

That's right...but his continuous propagation of hate does...and so far I haven't seen any atonement of that...especially when he drags my grandchildren into the mix just to yank my chain...and you can bet your sweet a$$ it worked.

Like I said...drag me all across he11 and half of Georgia with hatefull rhetoric, but leave my grandchildren out of it.

Alice

 

[Alice]

You are not a Christian...

I don't see anywhere in scripture where we as humans have the right or ability to say someone who claims to be a Christian , isn't one. If aplus has recognized himself to be a sinner and turned to Christ for the atonement of his sins, he's a Christian. Because your political persuasion is different than his doesn't make him a non christian.

Oh, and by the way, because my political persuasion is different than his does not make me a non Christian. Nor does it make me anti American...nor does it make me a traitor to my country! I am not filled with hate...and I refuse to be...but, right now I am filled with anger against those that are trying to infuse hatred into the minds and souls of their fellow man...all in the name of Christianity. That is sacriledge!

Alice

 

[Cheyenne]

I'm sorry to interupt this thread, but while all ya'll are fighting about religion and politics and such Iran is sneaking in the back door. Now what are ya'll gonna do?

For those who don't believe this, my husband saw this first hand. Iran has had their hands in this mess for along time. The president of Iran has figured out how to go to "war" with the US and the Sunni's without having to declare it and he doesn't have to fight us in his country. (for now).

 

[aplusmnt]

You are not a Christian...

I don't see anywhere in scripture where we as humans have the right or ability to say someone who claims to be a Christian , isn't one. If aplus has recognized himself to be a sinner and turned to Christ for the atonement of his sins, he's a Christian. Because your political persuasion is different than his doesn't make him a non christian.

That's right...but his continuous propagation of hate does...and so far I haven't seen any atonement of that...especially when he drags my grandchildren into the mix just to yank my chain...and you can bet your sweet a$$ it worked.

Like I said...drag me all across he11 and half of Georgia with hatefull rhetoric, but leave my grandchildren out of it.

Alice

All I said about your grandchildren was

"See how relieve you feel when one of your grandchildren's burnt body gets dragged around behind a jeep while them moderate Muslims cheer and holler!"

I doubt that the parents and Grandchildren of those that have been burnt and tortured by these people would feel very relieved that some Frank Pastore says they all aren't bad.

You see when I see them pictures of kids poking sticks at burnt bodies or those guys they cut the heads off with machetes as they screamed what I do see is my Children and future Grandchildren. I picture how I would feel if that was my son I was watching scream as they sawed his head off and then held it up for the Camera and praised Allah!

I feel anger and sympathy for these Parents and Grandparents. And I want no one else to ever have to watch that done to their family member.

Maybe you should not get so sensitive about someone asking you how you would feel if that was your Grandchildren maybe you should open your eyes and think about it from that perspective, then you can see the kind of evil we face with these people.

As far as Frank Pastore he starts out talking about American Muslims, and I do think their is a difference in some of them. Not Muslims living in America, but American Muslims, you know like Kareem Abdul Jabbar, Muhammad Ali. People that are Americans that become Muslims. But later he inter twines the Millions world wide into that mix and there is where I disagree. I do not think all the Muslims that moved here from Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia are the same as or have the same mind set as say a Muhammad Ali.

You can feel however you want about these people but for me I will follow this scripture

Romans 12:9: Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.

 

[aplusmnt]

Maybe a way to explain this Radical Muslim vs Moderate Muslim would be like this.

Lets say you have Religion say Baptist for example just to pick one. And the Baptist believe that if you are a Sinner evil person lets say. You will go to Hell for eternity.

But lets say you have this Baptist Church in Small town Kansas with the same Preacher from day one for the last 30 years. But this preacher has never once preached about going to Hell, maybe he thinks you should only teach the love and forgiveness side taught in the Bible. And he concentrates on the Positive things of the Bible

Just because this specific Preacher chose not to use the Hell fire doctrine in his Sermons does not mean that it does not exist or that the Baptist do not believe in Hell.

Just because some American Muslim Mosque do not teach hatred and Murder does not mean that it is not part of the Religion as a whole. It is in the Koran, it is part of the Muslim Religion to believe in Killing non believers.

A few Leaders that chose not to read this part of the Koran or teach it to their followers can be commended, but better yet why do they not run away from a Religion that holds such Doctrines as a foundation of their beliefs in the first place?

I will concede that there is Good Muslims in the World but I will not concede that the Muslim Religion is in itself a Peaceful Religion.

I will concede that we are not at War with the Peaceful Muslims. But I do believe we are in a War with the Islamic Religion as a whole.

I just do not have much respect for people that even though they might be Moderate or Peaceful but they stay part of a Religion that by its own definition is not Peaceful. And if they get caught in the crossfires then so be it, they have chose to be guilty by association!

 

[Victoria]

Alice, it is a good read - or listen to- which ever the case may be.

aplusmnt - It was more of a statement than a question. You are right about why Muslims hate us, we say we are Christian nations and don't live by the standards, however they also have a problem with individual Christians. The ones that say they are followers of Christ but don't act like it. One of my favourite quotes is from a song: "The greatest single cause of atheism in the world today… is Christians who acknowledge Jesus with their lips and walk out the door and deny Him by their lifestyle. That is simply what an unbelieving world finds unbelievable." I think that counts with other religions too.

One of the things that really struck me with Brother Andrew (I think it is in the book, may be in the interview I heard with him) was when he was captured by Muslims. They decided not to kill him for whatever reason but were going to kill a fellow Muslim that had done something they felt wrong. Brother Andrew stood up and begged them to kill him instead. The leaders were shocked and amazed, why would he help a Muslim? He said that he knew he was going to Heaven but that the Muslim would not, therefore he needed more time on earth to hopefully change his mind. Both he and the Muslim were spared. That is the power Christ and His love can have. Brother Andrew is fighting the war on terror in a different way.

Maybe I am just rambling. Calving in -30 weather is tiring. I am off to bed. ;-)

 

[Ryder]

I think you need to admit that the majority of those that have expressed concern, on this post, have done so over "radical Muslims". Most do not have a problem with "peaceful" religions. With this in mind, they are not ignorant at all. Your argument runs both ways; that is, we should not judge the peaceful as we judge the violent radical muslims nor should we treat the violent radical as we treat the peaceful.

Well said Angus/Brangus

 

[Ryder]

Years ago when my wife and I were a young married couple we were neighbors with another young couple. We lived as neighbors should, caring for and helping one another when needed. I have not seen them in a long time, but they are still very much in my heart.

The wife had a younger sister. I never knew the sister, but I do know a little about her. I will name a few of her accomplishments. When I think of them, I am impressed. I think some of you will be.

She completed college at LSU and then did graduate work and earned a master of science degree in genetics. She then went to vet school and earned a doctorate in veterinary medicine.
She studied at the Woods Hole Institute and did an internship at a university in cardiology. She was selected for a fellowship by Children's Hospital in Boston.
She then worked at the Center for Disease Control in Atlanta, where she was Head of the Congenital Birth Defects Section.

She became director of the Carter Foundation in Naroibi, Kenya in the fight against malaria.
She was a pilot and also became a medivac pilot while in Africa in order to help transport people from remote aeas in need of medical attention. She also contributed her time and expertise in working with orphan baby elephants.

She had a husband, two sons, and a daughter.

We have all heard the phrase, "GET A LIFE".
In my opinion, SHE DID!

On Aug. 7, 1998, she was in the U.S. Embassy in Nairobi. Osama Bin Laden blew up the embassy. He murdered her.

Every time I think of this I feel grief and anger at the same time. Partly because of my feelings for her sister. Partly because the life of such an outstanding person was simply destroyed.

We had no troops making war against any Muslims. There were no boys deployed to bring home at that time. For all practical purposes, we did nothing. Time went on. Then they flew airplanes into buildings in our country.

Now we have taken the fight to them. In my younger years I was involved in the martial arts. I think I learned a little. When you have the advantage, press in. When you have your opponent on the ropes, attack, attack, attack.
I think we would be well served for our troops to press on and deny the enemy a free pass to recoup his losses, form more terrorist training camps, and gather strength.

Some of you intelligently and sincerely disagree. We may disagree, and I can still respect you.

Others I think want to deny the reality of the dangers. They cower in fear. They run on with silly word games in an effort to impress themselves. They try to put on a superior and sanctimonious front.
I have no respect for this.
GET A LIFE.

 

[Alice]

You are not a Christian...

I don't see anywhere in scripture where we as humans have the right or ability to say someone who claims to be a Christian , isn't one. If aplus has recognized himself to be a sinner and turned to Christ for the atonement of his sins, he's a Christian. Because your political persuasion is different than his doesn't make him a non christian.

That's right...but his continuous propagation of hate does...and so far I haven't seen any atonement of that...especially when he drags my grandchildren into the mix just to yank my chain...and you can bet your sweet a$$ it worked.

Like I said...drag me all across he11 and half of Georgia with hatefull rhetoric, but leave my grandchildren out of it.

Alice

All I said about your grandchildren was

"See how relieve you feel when one of your grandchildren's burnt body gets dragged around behind a jeep while them moderate Muslims cheer and holler!"

I doubt that the parents and Grandchildren of those that have been burnt and tortured by these people would feel very relieved that some Frank Pastore says they all aren't bad.

You see when I see them pictures of kids poking sticks at burnt bodies or those guys they cut the heads off with machetes as they screamed what I do see is my Children and future Grandchildren. I picture how I would feel if that was my son I was watching scream as they sawed his head off and then held it up for the Camera and praised Allah!

I feel anger and sympathy for these Parents and Grandparents. And I want no one else to ever have to watch that done to their family member.

Maybe you should not get so sensitive about someone asking you how you would feel if that was your Grandchildren maybe you should open your eyes and think about it from that perspective, then you can see the kind of evil we face with these people.

As far as Frank Pastore he starts out talking about American Muslims, and I do think their is a difference in some of them. Not Muslims living in America, but American Muslims, you know like Kareem Abdul Jabbar, Muhammad Ali. People that are Americans that become Muslims. But later he inter twines the Millions world wide into that mix and there is where I disagree. I do not think all the Muslims that moved here from Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia are the same as or have the same mind set as say a Muhammad Ali.

You can feel however you want about these people but for me I will follow this scripture

Romans 12:9: Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.

Abhor that which is evil, which in you case, aplusmnt, is precisely what I intend to do.

Alice

 

[Alice]

I'm sorry to interupt this thread, but while all ya'll are fighting about religion and politics and such Iran is sneaking in the back door. Now what are ya'll gonna do?

For those who don't believe this, my husband saw this first hand. Iran has had their hands in this mess for along time. The president of Iran has figured out how to go to "war" with the US and the Sunni's without having to declare it and he doesn't have to fight us in his country. (for now).

Attention!!!
By now, everyone has seen evidence starting to flow in that many of the explosive devises used to kill American and Iraqi troops are coming from Iran! There are statements being made by our government that this is being supported by the Iranian government.

Sectarian strife in Iran may be the least of our worries now.


Alice: get over it and put things in perspective

In this case, sir, I believe I have.

Alice

 

[badaxemoo]

I have no argument with this. However, I think you need to admit that the majority of those that have expressed concern, on this post, have done so over "radical Muslims". Most do not have a problem with "peaceful" religions. With this in mind, they are not ignorant at all. Your argument runs both ways; that is, we should not judge the peaceful as we judge the violent radical muslims nor should we treat the violent radical as we treat the peaceful.

Many that have posted have contained their criticism to radical Islam. But several, including aplusmt, don't make much of a distinction between extremists and the billion people that make up the bulk of Islam.

Read their posts carefully. I wouldn't have continued posting in this thread if it were simply about violent extremists because I don't have a use for them either.

As I have stated before, I also think the focus solely on the religious aspect of terrorism is a red herring. Religion plays an element in the conflict, but other factors are much more important.

I think that jumping onto anti-Muslim is just an unfair, gross oversimplification of a complex issue, but given the course of human history, one that is to be completely expected.

 

[Caustic Burno]

I have no argument with this. However, I think you need to admit that the majority of those that have expressed concern, on this post, have done so over "radical Muslims". Most do not have a problem with "peaceful" religions. With this in mind, they are not ignorant at all. Your argument runs both ways; that is, we should not judge the peaceful as we judge the violent radical muslims nor should we treat the violent radical as we treat the peaceful.

Many that have posted have contained their criticism to radical Islam. But several, including aplusmt, don't make much of a distinction between extremists and the billion people that make up the bulk of Islam.

Read their posts carefully. I wouldn't have continued posting in this thread if it were simply about violent extremists because I don't have a use for them either.

As I have stated before, I also think the focus solely on the religious aspect of terrorism is a red herring. Religion plays an element in the conflict, but other factors are much more important.

I think that jumping onto anti-Muslim is just an unfair, gross oversimplification of a complex issue, but given the course of human history, one that is to be completely expected.

There is no distinction between them we are at War.
If they were a peaceful why don't you see rallies chanting end the war versus death to America. Never seen one in no country not even this one. You see all opposing views in this country in the news even if they slant or bias . The TV reporters can't find " moderate muslims" with conviction against the acts of terror to stand up and protest against it.
All they can find is those that back it.
As many on here have put this the liberals of the country are scared to death, and figure if they stick there head in the sand this will go away. It's not and a policy of isolationism is not going to work.

You let one dumptruck load of explosives go in to the TSC at Erath county and the people on the pasification board would be screaming for us to nuke them off the earth.


The Islam clerics are using Islam as a political movement not a religion for power. They are doing this no different than the preacher that gets in the pulpit here telling the flock they need to vote on the X ticket and busing them to the polls. Here these zealots are advocating change through the ballot there they advocating change with the bomb. They are no different than Hitler the KKK, Malcom X, etc.

You galvanize the sheep with fear or hatered and they are doing both.
Hitler used the Jews to come to power, the KKK used the blacks, Jews, Malcom X the whites, Islam the Americans, Christians and Jews.
The only way to stay in power with this type of movement is to have an enemy.

You can't remain free without a cost.
We are not fighting a country we are fighting a political movement using a religion to maintain power.