Purebred V fullblood

[Nured]

environment can make a difference, our red angus came from nebraska ,with harsher pastures. bring them to michigan and our flusher pastures and their size has increased 2to3 hundred pounds, and 1 to 2 size larger frame score .We sold on cow that weighed 2050# at the sale barn. with the daughter's cow that weighs 2000# and a frame score of 7or more ,we could use the right bulls and increase that weight and score even higher

 

[robert]

In the 60's the vast majority of Angus cattle in the US were small or relatively small framed. I find it interesting that in less than a ten years the Angus breed had significantly increased the frame size of a large percentage of the Angus cattle.

In 1960 the average size of a professional QB was about 6'2" and 200 lbs. and linemen weighed 240-250. Now a QB is 6'6" and 250 and the linemen are 300 and up. What happened??

Got a lttle Chi in em too!

 

[ALACOWMAN]

and a whole lot of chi----tlins

 

[Old_man_emu]

black Limo and black simmental are by definition crossbreds, the black gene did not exist in either breed until introduced through either angus or black baldies. On paper all Angus trace to their Scottish ancestors, in all probability there are some that likely do not in practice. The Wye cattle were a major source of size when the fashions changed in the late 60's, Wye cattle were never small, however by todays standards many people would call them smaller framed, Wye didn't change but the breed sure did. Many herds in the western states (montana in particular) were at the forefront of performance testing in the late 50's and early 60's, again they never did make the cattle belt buckle and served as a resource for larger genetics when the time came, as did western Canadian herds. Frame score is probably the easiest single trait to select for if you ignore every other consideration so progress can be very rapid, in either direction up or down.

I had a quick look at the Wye cattle the other day and thought they might have something to offer. I didn't recognise any of the pedigrees so perhaps they would be good over the many of the popular cattle around today.
Who else could I look to for a similar Angus operation?

 

[robert]

The Wye cattle definately produce a type in the sense of being a breed. Given your location I'd recommend you take a look at the Pinebank / Waigroup cattle in New Zealand. Not a linebred herd but certainly they have allowed phenotype to express itself without prejudice to show of college standards of judging.

Overall I think as an Angus breeder I have determined which cattle lines and sires work for me and those lines will be the basis of my in herd breeding program utilizing home raised sires for the most part. There are certain cattle and certain breeders that I will not introduce into my program. What was done in the past can probably not be undone at this point so the best I can do is be particular about who and where I source genetics.

 

[Old_man_emu]

I think you're spot on in regards to the past, whats done is done and we all can make our own choices going forward.

And I agree the Pinebank cattle are worth looking at, my only concern being that I would like just a bit more frame than what they seem to have on offer as my experience with my last bull being moderate to small when crossed on moderate small cows only made smaller, thicker progeny that were finishing/maturing to early for operation.

I think I continue to focus on breeding my "ideal" females and the steers should come along with that.

And at the end of the day I suppose its all "swings and round-abouts". Its my job to minimise the peaks and troughs along the way and try to keep to the middle of the road

 

[andybob]

According to the British registry, there are less than 100 heritage Aberdeen Angus, and 700 heritage Hereford, all other Angus and Hereford have some part of their registry untraceable Laverstoke has a high percentage of both these native strains;
http://www.laverstokepark.co.uk/cattle.aspx

 

[robert]

According to the British registry, there are less than 100 heritage Aberdeen Angus, and 700 heritage Hereford, all other Angus and Hereford have some part of their registry untraceable Laverstoke has a high percentage of both these native strains;
http://www.laverstokepark.co.uk/cattle.aspx

No, not untraceable, simply some imported blood from somewhere in the world where Aberdeen Angus were exported to in the past, mainly Canadian, NZ or US genetics.