Prolapse question ?

[hillsdown]

Reading the thread by "rulintheroost" about the prolapse and how it turned into a complete uterine prolapse 2 days after calving...Just how common is this ?

The only uterine prolapses I have seen have been right after calving (like 1-2 hours after and the cow has been straining and is usually in a bad position laying down. Also they did not have a vaginal prolapse before. I have personally only had I vaginal prolapse(touch wood) ,the vet did a purse string so I could open it when calving (the delivery would have opened it had she calved alone) and zipped it back up after she calved ...All went normally.

 

[Keren]

You know hills, I was surprised too.

My experiences with prolapses have been:

- complete uterine prolapse within two hours of calf delivery, without prior vaginal prolapse

- vaginal prolapse prior to calving, stitched up, unstitched when laour began, calf delivered no further prolapse, no further stitching required

- as above, but uterine prolapse after calving

- I havent actually had a vaginal prolapse both before and after

And I've never heard of a uterine prolapse so long after calving.

 

[I luv herfrds]

All the ones that I have seen, except for 2, have happened almost immediately after the calving.
#1 had her calf with no problem, no sign of vaginal prolapse before hand. Put her out with the rest of the pairs and 2 days later she had a uterine prolapse.
#2 showed signs of vaginal prolapse before hand. When she got up and walked around it went back in. She did a uterine prolapse and a rectal prolapse 24 hours after the calving. Her vaginal wall had a large tear in it and the vet believes that the irritation caused her to continue to strain.

We have done the purse string also. Glad for that little thing.

 

[aussie_cowgirl]

Sorry if this sounds stupid but could it have come from passing the after birth. Even though the bulk of it was passed within 24 hours, if she was still trying to pass something could that have attributed to a late prolapse?

 

[Keren]

thanks aussie and luvhfs, interesting

 

[K2011]

You know hills, I was surprised too.

My experiences with prolapses have been:

- complete uterine prolapse within two hours of calf delivery, without prior vaginal prolapse

- vaginal prolapse prior to calving, stitched up, unstitched when laour began, calf delivered no further prolapse, no further stitching required

- as above, but uterine prolapse after calving

- I havent actually had a vaginal prolapse both before and after

And I've never heard of a uterine prolapse so long after calving.

We had one about 2 years ago she had it about 2 weeks before calving and then about 1.5 to 2 months after calving....

 

[rockridgecattle]

I am only guessing here, but...
i think, presuming here, it might be one of the reasons our vet perscribes oxytocin with hard births, multiple births, and big calves. It helps to shrink the uterus, maybe reducing the chance of a uterine prolapse.

 

[hillsdown]

Sorry if this sounds stupid but could it have come from passing the after birth. Even though the bulk of it was passed within 24 hours, if she was still trying to pass something could that have attributed to a late prolapse?

That makes sense Aussie the straining of trying to expel the afterbirth..Now I wonder if a better mineral program would make all the difference ?

I will have to ask my vet about that the next time I talk to him .

Great one more thing for me to be paranoid about during calving season... :???:


K2011 I think you are referring to a vaginal prolapse 2 months later not uterine.

ILH the cow that had the Up 2 days later how old was she ?

Right RR but this was unassisted easy delivery and calf/cow were up right away. That is why I am thinking mineral program..

 

[aussie_cowgirl]

I found a journal article, Hillsdown, but it's about buffaloes and mineral deficiency and the correlation between that and prolapse. This is the abstract.

"In the present study, 20 buffaloes suffering from genital prolapse and 10 normal pregnant (control group) buffaloes were used to investigate clinical and haematological changes and serum macro mineral contents. Blood samples of all animals were collected aseptically in two portions i.e. with and without anticoagulant. Haematological parameters were determined from samples containing anticoagulant. Serum was separated from the other portion for determination of calcium, phosphorus and magnesium concentrations with spectrophotmetric kits. The results showed that there was a drastic decrease in serum calcium (6.42 ± 1.05 v 10.96 ± 0.95 mg/dl), phosphorus (2.90 ± 0.85 v 5.50 ± 1.61 mg/dl) and magnesium (1.50 ± 0.53 v 2.40 ± 0.53 mg/dl) levels in prolapsed animals as compared to the controls (P<0.01). There was also a significant decrease in PCV, Hb concentration, lymphocytes and monocytes, while an increase in ESR, WBC counts and neutrophils was observed in prolapsed animals as compared to controls. However, there was no difference in haematological and serum macro mineral contents between vaginal prolapsed and uterine prolapsed buffaloes. It was concluded that deficiency of calcium, phosphorus or magnesium might be possible causes of genital prolapse in these buffaloes."

And the entire article if you are interested is here:
http://pvj.com.pk/pdf-files/25_4/167-170.pdf

 

[rockridgecattle]

HD,
agree with the unassisted part, but how do we know that it was easy. No disrespect to rulin, but being a newbie, would she be able to tell the difference unless it was "really apparent" that it was difficult? I mean, really, how much straining was going on and for how long? And she has been prolapsing before birth, maybe it was a bit more serious, and there had been some straining going on for a while, and possibly some inflamation going on. These are things we don't really know cause we did not see the animal in question. For the most of us, we would see what was going on and know what to do because experience is a good learning tool, costly but good. Rulin' had yet to have that experience and know when to and why to get help or not, or assist earlier or not. So many variables here.
And yes, the mineral program would have a great effect i think

Rulintheroost, no, none, totally no... NO disrepect intended with this post.

 

[rockridgecattle]

I just read Rulin's first post on the cow. April 24 she writes about the cow prolapsing when she lays or pushes
April 26 later in the day she calves. Two days of prolapsing and pushing. Might have been some swelling, and discomfort for the cow that she was still pushing after expelling the after birth. Kind of like a bladder infection in humans. Just random thoughts

 

[showmomof2]

Anyone ever heard of or had an unbred heifer with a small prolapse? (not uterine)-Goes back in when standing up, doesn't happen all the time.

 

[showing71]

We had a cow this year have a uterine prolapse, but it was after the calf was pulled and the pull was a hard one. Right after the calf came the uterus. Thank God the vet was there already. The cow had continued to push after the calf came out. She hadn't had any signs of other prolapse before then. To the mineral part, I don't know... Our cows have mineral available all year long

Hope this doesn't hijack the thread too much HD but....
Is a vaginal prolapse hereditary? I've heard some yes and some no.

 

[dun]

We had a cow this year have a uterine prolapse, but it was after the calf was pulled and the pull was a hard one. Right after the calf came the uterus. Thank God the vet was there already. The cow had continued to push after the calf came out. She hadn't had any signs of other prolapse before then. To the mineral part, I don't know... Our cows have mineral available all year long

Hope this doesn't hijack the thread too much HD but....
Is a vaginal prolapse hereditary? I've heard some yes and some no.

Vaginal is hereditary, uterine isn;t. Conventional wisdom is that a prolapse before calving (vaginal) and they will prolapse again, after they calve (uterine) they usually won;t.

 

[K2011]

Sorry if this sounds stupid but could it have come from passing the after birth. Even though the bulk of it was passed within 24 hours, if she was still trying to pass something could that have attributed to a late prolapse?

That makes sense Aussie the straining of trying to expel the afterbirth..Now I wonder if a better mineral program would make all the difference ?

I will have to ask my vet about that the next time I talk to him .

Great one more thing for me to be paranoid about during calving season... :???:


K2011 I think you are referring to a vaginal prolapse 2 months later not uterine.

ILH the cow that had the Up 2 days later how old was she ?

Right RR but this was unassisted easy delivery and calf/cow were up right away. That is why I am thinking mineral program..

I am...

 

[I luv herfrds]

HD she was a first year heifer.
showing71 anything that shows a vaginal prolapse hits the road. Have had cows that had no history in their background suddenly have a uterine prolapse.

 

[hillsdown]

Thanks ILH, so now we have a common denominator both of these animals had their first calves and then prolapsed 1-2 days later. So I think Aussies and RR might have a combined explanation as to how this can happen. Straining to expel the placenta and perhaps a stressed and prolonged labor.

My vet said never keep a VP because it will happen again but a UP if placed back in and she cycles again breed her back it most likely will never happen again. The problem with UP's is that sometime they will not cycle again and the cow has to be shipped anyways.

 

[alacattleman]

We had a cow this year have a uterine prolapse, but it was after the calf was pulled and the pull was a hard one. Right after the calf came the uterus. Thank God the vet was there already. The cow had continued to push after the calf came out. She hadn't had any signs of other prolapse before then. To the mineral part, I don't know... Our cows have mineral available all year long

Hope this doesn't hijack the thread too much HD but....
Is a vaginal prolapse hereditary? I've heard some yes and some no.

Vaginal is hereditary, uterine isn;t. Conventional wisdom is that a prolapse before calving (vaginal) and they will prolapse again, after they calve (uterine) they usually won;t.

that was my experiance with two sister's same season bout a week apart, had one uterine on a big calf pull....you talk about a sight she looked like she exploded thank the lord she was in the chute when she turned inside out

 

[I luv herfrds]

Now I don't agree that a UP is NOT passed along from mother to daughter. Had a cow that did UP, shipped her, but kept her daughter. The daughter did the same thing.
If one does it I look through the history and everything closely related hits the road.

We have gotten it out of our dams, but we got a bull that brought it back in. Just about everything out of that bull is gone.

 

[alacattleman]

Now I don't agree that a UP is NOT passed along from mother to daughter. Had a cow that did UP, shipped her, but kept her daughter. The daughter did the same thing.
If one does it I look through the history and everything closely related hits the road.

We have gotten it out of our dams, but we got a bull that brought it back in. Just about everything out of that bull is gone.

are there certain hereford line's that where bad too prolaspe, are have they been cleaned out....not starting a war just curious..