Opinions on Angus Bull to use for replacements (pics added)

[Arkieman]

Son & I have 6 1st calf commercial Angus heifers that we're thinking about AI'ing to an Angus bull to provide some replacements. We AI'd to the Maine bull Ali for their 1st calves and everything has gone well - no calving problems. They are about a size 6 frame and weigh about 1,000 to 1,100 lbs (guessing dont have scales). What would you guys suggest?

Thanks

 

[Arkieman]

I was wanting a more purebred Angus to keep as a replacement - then use a continental on them.

 

[Jovid]

I would suggest using a continental bull such as Gelbvieh, Salers, or perhaps even maine again to get them another calf. Cross bred cattle are far more productive than purebred. Besides the Gelbvieh, Salers, and or maine would put more muscle, more carcass, and more growth into the calves than a straight Angus bull would.

Or you could breed them to another British breed like Red Polls and then come back with the continental bull for your terminal calves

 

[Arkieman]

No Angus breeders out there??

 

[luckefarm]

Arkie i really like Northern Improvement and TC Freedom 104 both have made excellent replacement females. TC is not real big on calving ease but i haven't had a problem with my heifers also around a 6 frame.

 

[3waycross]

I like the Gelbvieh cross good mommas and good dispositions. Then go back british for carcass traits.

 

[W.T]

If i were to select for a angus bull to produce fault free females. I would go to Ohlde Cattle .com and pick one of his younger bulls. They are loaded with convenice traits, nice udders calving ease,and outstanding dispositions. I started with using the hot bulls and the results were not consistent. When OCC Bulls were used the progress is very noticeable when the first heifers calved. W.T

 

[DOC HARRIS]

If i were to select for a angus bull to produce fault free females. I would go to Ohlde Cattle .com and pick one of his younger bulls. They are loaded with convenice traits, nice udders calving ease,and outstanding dispositions. I started with using the hot bulls and the results were not consistent. When OCC Bulls were used the progress is very noticeable when the first heifers calved. W.T

Arkieman-

The advice by W.T. is the best of all the others here. Solidify your ANGUS genetics with good OCC cattle BEFORE using crossbreeding protocols. THEN, when you get solid EPD's and good Phenotype with Angus genetics, you have a foundation for profitable crossbreeding - which I highly recommend! But - your Foundation Cows must be excellent before you can expect consistency in future breeding - whatever breeds you use for your bulls.

DOC HARRIS

 

[Angus In Texas]

I like Emblazon, or Legend for the OCC breeding but also like New Design 878..... The 878 females are very nice functional cattle.

 

[W.T]

Thanks " DOC" Tim Ohlde has done all the work for you, their are several generations of excellent females behind his bulls. The guess work is done for you. And belive me it is not cheap to breed good cattle. I would use missing link, or moderator,both of these bulls will leave great daughters in any herd.

 

[lakading]

HSAF Bando 1961 is one I'd consider. Another older, more proven choice would be Sitz Alliance 6595.

 

[highvoltagecattleco]

There are a lot of good female making bulls out there. If your looking for low birth, very few faults, and came from good dams. I am partial to CRA Bextor, Sinclair Net Present Value, New Design 878, Boyd Pound Maker. If you don't mind a little extra birth weight. Boyd On Target, SAV Traveler 004, and Grid Maker. All these bulls a pretty good across the board. Have high accuracy.

 

[Arkieman]

Thanks for the suggestions. I really do like the OCC cattle. Went to their webpage and W.T. you're right, they've done the work for you. Before I read your suggestions of Emblazen, Missing Link, Legend or Moderator, I kindof liked the Homer bull. Here are a few of the heifers at calving. This may help with the suggestions.. I might add that these are commercial Angus and the ranch uses registered Gardiner bulls on the herd. Many thanks!

 

[W.T]

Homer is real good I have been very happy with his daughters. But your cows can stand a little birth wt.moderator and missing link are outstanding. But you should call tim and see if judge semen is still avliable. the results will be good.

 

[Arkieman]

There's no pic of Judge, does he look like his sire Emblazen?

 

[EAT BEEF]

There's no pic of Judge, does he look like his sire Emblazen?

I'm not sure but I'd think judge and jupiter would breed similar to emblazon(brother sister mating).They seem to push jupiter more ,but I don't know why maybe they have more semen on him?
I'm going to use one of them a little.

I used echelon (emblazone's full brother)some last year and had no problems calving heifers 50-60lbs calves.

Missing link and moderator might add some power to your calves. I'm not as high on missing link as alot of people are,but I might be this fall

 

[W.T]

Judge died early. I dont think Tim has any pics. I have a couple of daughters and they are very good.Perfect udders and they are quite better than their dams. When you start lining up the 1019 cow you have goof proof genetics for maternal qualities.

 

[EAT BEEF]

Hey W.T. have you ever used jupiter?

 

[DOC HARRIS]

As one would imagine, there have been discussions, arguments, criticisms, condemnations and disapprovals of the beef breeding practices of Linebreeding, Closebreeding, Inbreeding, Father-Daughter matings, Full sibling matings and similar matings of closely related individuals for the purposes of establishing Homozygous Genetics and "purifying" , if you will, desirable genetic characteristics and eliminating UNdesirable characteristics and traits. These back-and-forth quarrels have been in vogue, I guess, since the first livestock breeder got the idea to mate like individuals for the purpose of perfecting patterns or prototype individuals, and then somebody else got the idea that mating closely related "family members" was "not nice", or would result in "sports" or "freaks" or physically impaired offspring, as it usually does when those types of matings occur in human beings.

And so the debates rage - back and forth - pro and con - between the realists and the moralists. But the BASIC ingredient factor of the rhetorical controversies revolve around the "Chicken Little" predictions of "...the SKY is falling...", and that detrimental effects in Genotype and Phenotype will befall the Species which dares to engage in Linebreeding practices for any lengthy period of time! This 'mantra' continues as a result of uninformed breeders MISunderstanding the principles of Linebreeding, and other producers being either too unconcerned or too lazy or indolent to inform themselves of accurate facts and studiously go about improving their breeding practices, and, therefore, their own livelihood.

In any case, the 'proof of the pudding is in the eating', as the saying goes, and that proof is currently going to be demonstrated at the BASIC BLACKS Angus Bull Sale of Ohlde Cattle Co., next Monday, April 21, 2008 at Marysville, Kansas. Those 'disbelievers' and advocates alike may see the finest example of close Linebreeding being practiced in the Angus breed anywhere today by observing this sale. Their catalog may be obtained by logging on to:
http://www.ohldecattle.com It is a textbook unto itself! Do yourself a favor and avail yourself of a fast and fascinating study of "Linebreeding" for fun and profit by contacting Tim and Trudy Ohlde, but do it now! Time is short.

DOC HARRIS

 

[Arkieman]

Funny thing Doc is that I raise rabbit running beagles also. Linebreeding is not only accepted, but encouraged. It is considered the ONLY way to develop consistency in traits such as running styles (fast, med, slow), types of mouths (chop bark, bawl-type howl, etc), degree of hunt or desire, etc.

I guess it is more accepted in the beagle world since most of the owners may be the result of a "family" mating themselves!!! :shock: Just kidding, but it is truly a "redneck" sport (me included!)