Old cow

[Anonymous]

It seems that this years calf from our oldest cow (12 years old) just doesn't have the growth andc"pop" that her previous calves have had. Also it appears that somewhere in her 4th month she must have slipped her calf. She was in standing heat last week. She's alwasy settled first service, as she did this year, and has never had a problem before. This is her first bull calf so maybe that's the reason this one isn't as impressive. The thought that I have had is that possbily she's getting to the age that she is dipping into poor quality and low vitality eggs. We're working them tomorrow so we'll know for sure if she is open or not, but it's a thought that I've had and was curious if anyone has noticed older cows having poorer calves then she has traditionally had.

dun

 

[Anonymous]

Do you have anything that shows the eggs aren't as good as the cow gets older? That doesn't make sense to me, but would be interested in whatever info you can come up with. Our oldest cow is 13 and for several years she's had the lowest indexing calf (bull or heifer) in our AHIR data. Part of that might be our fault. We used a bull younger than we usually do and he was a great disappointment. His calves were very successful in the show ring, though. This year, she has a better heifer than in several years. In our case, I think we've improved genetics from year to year so those older cows just can't keep up. Two years ago we kept some of our own heifers instead of selling them and buying bred cows. Their calves were as good as the calves the mature cows raised, better than some.

> It seems that this years calf from
> our oldest cow (12 years old) just
> doesn't have the growth
> andc"pop" that her
> previous calves have had. Also it
> appears that somewhere in her 4th
> month she must have slipped her
> calf. She was in standing heat
> last week. She's alwasy settled
> first service, as she did this
> year, and has never had a problem
> before. This is her first bull
> calf so maybe that's the reason
> this one isn't as impressive. The
> thought that I have had is that
> possbily she's getting to the age
> that she is dipping into poor
> quality and low vitality eggs.
> We're working them tomorrow so
> we'll know for sure if she is open
> or not, but it's a thought that
> I've had and was curious if anyone
> has noticed older cows having
> poorer calves then she has
> traditionally had.

> dun

 

[Anonymous]

The egg deal is just a concept. I've never see4n anything about it. We used the same bull for this bull claf that we had used the year before and got a real eye popper heifer. Her heifer from the year before was really inpressive also. Maybe she just doesn't have good steers, maybe she's a cow mother, I sure don't know. Her slipping the calf (possibly) is the upsetting part, if she did slip it she'll be heading down the road. She's been the matriarch of the herd for years. Others have come and go, but "ole granny" has always done a great job, she's almost an institution here. I figured she'ld outlast me. I'm just trying to figure out what may have happened and had wondered if others had seen anything of the sort.

dun

> Do you have anything that shows
> the eggs aren't as good as the cow
> gets older? That doesn't make
> sense to me, but would be
> interested in whatever info you
> can come up with. Our oldest cow
> is 13 and for several years she's
> had the lowest indexing calf (bull
> or heifer) in our AHIR data. Part
> of that might be our fault. We
> used a bull younger than we
> usually do and he was a great
> disappointment. His calves were
> very successful in the show ring,
> though. This year, she has a
> better heifer than in several
> years. In our case, I think we've
> improved genetics from year to
> year so those older cows just
> can't keep up. Two years ago we
> kept some of our own heifers
> instead of selling them and buying
> bred cows. Their calves were as
> good as the calves the mature cows
> raised, better than some.

 

[Anonymous]

> It seems that this years calf from
> our oldest cow (12 years old) just
> doesn't have the growth
> andc"pop" that her
> previous calves have had. Also it
> appears that somewhere in her 4th
> month she must have slipped her
> calf. She was in standing heat
> last week. She's alwasy settled
> first service, as she did this
> year, and has never had a problem
> before. This is her first bull
> calf so maybe that's the reason
> this one isn't as impressive. The
> thought that I have had is that
> possbily she's getting to the age
> that she is dipping into poor
> quality and low vitality eggs.
> We're working them tomorrow so
> we'll know for sure if she is open
> or not, but it's a thought that
> I've had and was curious if anyone
> has noticed older cows having
> poorer calves then she has
> traditionally had.

> dun

Yes I have. My older cows calves have a different look that I have termed the "old cow look". They also tend to grow slower and have a rough look to them. I know the feeling to have a good cow start doing this. I guesse good things never lst forever.

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[Anonymous]

We track all the cows and how the offspring do. We have some that continue producing a good calf into the teens and others that drop out before then. If your breeding program is working the daughters and their offspring should be better than parent. Alot of this depends on the genetic compatibility of the parents of the offspring. Then you occaisonaly get a dud calf that just inherits all the wrong genes.

 

[Anonymous]

It may be more of a milk production issue than an egg issue. Older cows may spend more energy maintaining themselves rather than giving it all to the calf as they once did.

Cows that are in their teens have been flushed successfully and these eggs in recip cows do just fine, while the natural calf on the donor may not look as good (although this can happen in young cows too).

 

[Anonymous]

As is her usual, she is feeding another calf, at least one, besides her own. And true to form she's putting on condition when all the others a loosing it. Her bull calf just never has had that pop that we've come to expect from her calves. Of course, as I said, this is her first bull calf. Depending on what the vet says tomorrow, it will be her last also.

dun

> It may be more of a milk
> production issue than an egg
> issue. Older cows may spend more
> energy maintaining themselves
> rather than giving it all to the
> calf as they once did.

> Cows that are in their teens have
> been flushed successfully and
> these eggs in recip cows do just
> fine, while the natural calf on
> the donor may not look as good
> (although this can happen in young
> cows too).

 

[Anonymous]

I can't see where age would affect the egg quality. The genetics don't change with age. If she's lost her teeth and can't forage, then she wouldn't raise as good a calf. But that's apparently not the case here. We had several TC Stocman 365 heifers that were very productive. But never had a bull calf that was worth our time. It's a crap shoot every year, even with the same bull. I should know better than to be disappointed when a very good cow raises a sorry calf. But it happens. Good luck. Hope she's bred.

> As is her usual, she is feeding
> another calf, at least one,
> besides her own. And true to form
> she's putting on condition when
> all the others a loosing it. Her
> bull calf just never has had that
> pop that we've come to expect from
> her calves. Of course, as I said,
> this is her first bull calf.
> Depending on what the vet says
> tomorrow, it will be her last
> also.

> dun

 

[Anonymous]

> I can't see where age would affect
> the egg quality. The genetics
> don't change with age. If she's
> lost her teeth and can't forage,
> then she wouldn't raise as good a
> calf. But that's apparently not
> the case here. We had several TC
> Stocman 365 heifers that were very
> productive. But never had a bull
> calf that was worth our time. It's
> a crap shoot every year, even with
> the same bull. I should know
> better than to be disappointed
> when a very good cow raises a
> sorry calf. But it happens. Good
> luck. Hope she's bred.

I keep older cows that do well, however, the breed assocations measure the proformance against an 8 year old cow. They will tell you the 8 year old cow has reached her zenith in milk production. Probability that is why the purebred people sell their cows at 6 years old while they still have value for other purebred breeders.



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[Anonymous]

The vet looked at me lilke I was nuts when I asked about the old egg theory. She had settled and slipped her calf. Ole granny will be growing wheels next week.

dun

> It seems that this years calf from
> our oldest cow (12 years old) just
> doesn't have the growth
> andc"pop" that her
> previous calves have had. Also it
> appears that somewhere in her 4th
> month she must have slipped her
> calf. She was in standing heat
> last week. She's alwasy settled
> first service, as she did this
> year, and has never had a problem
> before. This is her first bull
> calf so maybe that's the reason
> this one isn't as impressive. The
> thought that I have had is that
> possbily she's getting to the age
> that she is dipping into poor
> quality and low vitality eggs.
> We're working them tomorrow so
> we'll know for sure if she is open
> or not, but it's a thought that
> I've had and was curious if anyone
> has noticed older cows having
> poorer calves then she has
> traditionally had.

> dun

 

[Anonymous]

I don't care how jaded and callused you get, sometimes it's hard to sell an old gal who has been there for you, year in and year out. In some ways they are the dumbest animals in the world. In some ways it's a noble life they live.

Craig-TX

 

[Anonymous]

I'll go long with that. We weaned yesterday and I guess she did a better job then I had thought. This years calf only worked out to .03 fewer pounds per day of gain. But she's contributed 3 daughters to the herd so I guess I really can't compalin. It's just d--n (your choice) said for me to see her go.

dun

> I don't care how jaded and
> callused you get, sometimes it's
> hard to sell an old gal who has
> been there for you, year in and
> year out. In some ways they are
> the dumbest animals in the world.
> In some ways it's a noble life
> they live.

> Craig-TX

 

[Anonymous]

I can't answer your question but I have a 12 year old simmental cow that had her 11th calf in may and he is doing as good if not better than the ones from the younger cows. she always raised a good calf but I keep wondering how long she will keep doing I sure would hate to see her go too.



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[Anonymous]

> I'll go long with that. We weaned
> yesterday and I guess she did a
> better job then I had thought.
> This years calf only worked out to
> .03 fewer pounds per day of gain.
> But she's contributed 3 daughters
> to the herd so I guess I really
> can't compalin. It's just d--n
> (your choice) said for me to see
> her go.

> dun I know how you feel Dun, we've got one old cow who has missed only once in 16 yrs. having a calf and she is raising a pretty good calf right now. Its unbelievable, but I wouldn't mind all my cows having an udder that looks as good as hers does today. Don't know her lineage-just an old red brockle faced cow whose time has come. BTW she is very hard to out smart and get in the catching pen no matter what your feeding. Very tame but very smart. TSR

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[Anonymous]

We had a cow like that that had 25 calves in 20 years of production for us according to herd records. She was too smart to ever get caught during my life time so we left the gate open on the pasture she went to every year and she walked herself two miles up the road into the front yard. Too bad the ole girl passed away a couple years ago.

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[Anonymous]

yeah it is hard to let go of a good old pro, but business is business. as they get old and the teeth start to go so does the quality of thier calves.> It seems that this years calf from
> our oldest cow (12 years old) just
> doesn't have the growth
> andc"pop" that her
> previous calves have had. Also it
> appears that somewhere in her 4th
> month she must have slipped her
> calf. She was in standing heat
> last week. She's alwasy settled
> first service, as she did this
> year, and has never had a problem
> before. This is her first bull
> calf so maybe that's the reason
> this one isn't as impressive. The
> thought that I have had is that
> possbily she's getting to the age
> that she is dipping into poor
> quality and low vitality eggs.
> We're working them tomorrow so
> we'll know for sure if she is open
> or not, but it's a thought that
> I've had and was curious if anyone
> has noticed older cows having
> poorer calves then she has
> traditionally had.

> dun



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[Anonymous]

> yeah it is hard to let go of a
> good old pro, but business is
> business. as they get old and the
> teeth start to go so does the
> quality of thier calves.> It
> seems that this years calf from

We have one of them old cows too. She will be seventeen in February and will have her sixteenth calf a couple of months before her birthday. I guess business is business but this old cow is like family. When she goes, her horns will find a place on the wall.I figure as good as she has been to us she deserves to live her life out here. She was the first cow I ever got and I have had her for nearly 16 of those 17 years.

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