My Cows are Docile

[Bigfoot]

I've seen pics of a heeler at your place. He might end up getting charged, with you in the way.

 

[regolith]

I agree with Dun.
Get you another hundred cows and treat them all *equally*. They'll still be quiet. But they'll be real cows, not pets, and you'll be a hundred cows more enthused.

Very good comments regarding light, dogs. It took me a while to realise that the light that allows me to see at night often blinds the animal I'm looking at.
My dog has learned the meaning of 'out' which is useful... still keep an eye on her to make sure she's obeying, but I'm able to check the calving cows with her on the other side of the fence instead of having to put her on a chain somewhere. My previous dog could never get it about leaving cows and calves alone.

 

[Kingfisher]

You can lead a horse to water......I'm really not sure why you think your special but in Texas we got a saying " you keep messing with the Bull and your going to get the horn. I've read about 3 post today and one of em had you speaking poorly about females again. I sure hope the young ladies in 4h or FFA stay clear of your post. I'm with Mr Dun. Get some cows to mow your yard grass farmer....

 

[Chuckie]

I have tried to keep my cattle calm around me because it makes them easier to handle. I can stand close to them, but they do not want me to touch them. They are Angus, and have never been halter broke, etc.... and the mamma's have been the same way. I have one that liked to kick, and I would carry a piece of PVC pipe in the pen with me when I was feeding. After I poured the feed in the troughs, I would check the girls that were due to calve. This one cow that like to kick, would wail her several times until she got away. She learned that I was probably the lead cow, and could kick worse than she could. I can call them and they will follow me to the barn. They know their names. There are a few that want nothing to do with me. They are very disruptive and when it comes time to getting everyone up, if they are the first up around the gate, they can destroy an easy task. This is why I like my cows to be a bit more docile. And...it is so much easier to check them for a problem standing next to them, than to get them all up, and single one cow out, and run it up in a chute.

People like the fact that they can walk up close to the bulls I sell, and they are not aggressive, and stand there and mind their own business. They do not want a crazy bull. They can get within 8-10 feet of them, and the bull may look, but he then goes about what he is doing. They can choose not to stand that close when they get the bull home. I have had to knock a bull or two in the head with a feed bucket when they were smaller for thinking I was something to play with, and it got their respect.
Anytime I have gone to purchase a bull at a sale, if I cannot stand fairly close to the bull to check him out, or if he is flighty and runs away, I do not want him. He must be calm.

 

[inyati13]

chuckie, I am trying to manage my risk of injury/death. I have about 20 cows, calves and bull right now. There is only one that I cannot put my hands on. By the time a calf is 3 months old, I can play with it anywhere. In fact, calves are the easiest because all they know is me being around them since they were born. When I purchase a bred heifer, they are shy for about 6 weeks. When I can get them to come to a pan of feed, I start handling them. I work up to being able to scratch around their tail which is one of their favorite spots. The three favorite spots are: 1. Around the tail and anus. 2. The lower part of the neck and jaw line. 3. The belly. They do not like to be touched on the shoulder although I can but you can see and feel them flex the subcutaneous dermal muscles to shake you off.

The danger of what I am doing is real. There is a benefit. I have no frustrations about handling my cattle. I have become very clever about tricking cows to do what I want.

I can move my cows anywhere I want. Here is the three most important approaches: 1. I work alone, they are more difficult when someone else is around. (they are not shy of my dog) 2. Patience, Patience, Patience. The cow has to process information slowly. Don't press them. If they are close to a gate you want them to go through and they balk, just stand there with them in front of you. Give them space and time. 99 times out of 100 when they process that they are moving into a safe spot, they will go right where you want them. 3. Don't hit and crowd them. If they imprint on their brain that you are a loud hitting predator, you are in for grief, frustration and failure.

I am efficent and effective with this methodolgy. It could go without being said but this is not going to work for everyone. First, I have more time than most people do. I enjoy the way I do this. It is my own game that I play by myself with my cows. I don't have a big herd and never will. I am about 5 cows shy of where I plan to be long-term. Last, my cows love my singing and you can not find a sweeter wet kiss that one from a cow.

 

[greybeard]

chuckie, I am trying to manage my risk of injury/death. I have about 20 cows, calves and bull right now. There is only one that I cannot put my hands on. By the time a calf is 3 months old, I can play with it anywhere. In fact, calves are the easiest because all they know is me being around them since they were born. When I purchase a bred heifer, they are shy for about 6 weeks. When I can get them to come to a pan of feed, I start handling them. I work up to being able to scratch around their tail which is one of their favorite spots. The three favorite spots are: 1. Around the tail and anus. 2. The lower part of the neck and jaw line. 3. The belly. They do not like to be touched on the shoulder although I can but you can see and feel them flex the subcutaneous dermal muscles to shake you off.

The danger of what I am doing is real. There is a benefit. I have no frustrations about handling my cattle. I have become very clever about tricking cows to do what I want.

That's just WAAY too much information Inyati. :lol2:

 

[Alan]

All my cattle are calm and relaxed, I walk through the herd regularly. I'm within a couple of feet of them but don't try to touch them. They know if I walk toward them they move off, calves take off running at first, but after a while they calm down also and just walk away. I have one bottle raised heifer that won't walk away if she doesn't feel like it ...... She is the one I fear the most even more than I fear the bull. I'll keep a very close eye on her every time she calves.

 

[inyati13]

You can lead a horse to water......I'm really not sure why you think your special but in Texas we got a saying " you keep messing with the Bull and your going to get the horn. I've read about 3 post today and one of em had you speaking poorly about females again. I sure hope the young ladies in 4h or FFA stay clear of your post. I'm with Mr Dun. Get some cows to mow your yard grass farmer....

I may be crude but I am not rude. I don't think I spoke "poorly about females". I am sure you are referring to the post about mammary glands. Ok, I should be more careful. But that is inappropriate due to the subject matter, not because I spoke poorly of women. In fact, I have great respect for any woman that is as well endowed as she was.

BTW, I like everybody. I just ain't so dead azz serious as some are. Thanks for the recommendation on getting more cows. I will. I will, just let me do it at the rate I can handle. Thanks. Now, what the he$$ do you mean about the leading the horse to water part of your statement. :?

 

[glacierridge]

I'm with chippie.
We treat our cattle well and I give attention to many, but there is a bubble.

When we move them from yard to yard, if we aren't using a halter we usually will have a fork or something in the hand to guide or prompt them to get going and heaven forbid, to prevent from getting run down. Typically it's to guide and get them moving. The running down thing hasn't been an issue and I hope it will never be.
Sometimes we have to work on something (ie. a watering tub or cup) while we are within their reach, if they bother or try to be a pest, they will get a slap in the face to back off.
Our cattle are pretty easy to handle but we are always aware of them.
Just due to their size they can injure without intent.
I know when I wash cattle for the fair and have to scrub their feet I always keep a hand on them or lean on them so I can feel when they may paw a little or even just move on me by their other muscles of their body flexing, readying to move a leg.

 

[herofan]

Inyati,

Please exercise great caution with your gentle cows. Your are well aware of the power and strength they can put forth in an instant. Accidents do happen and the more time I spend with our cattle the more I have come to appreciate that fact.

Oh my, they are powerful creatures. I like strength, it attracts me to them. I have been pushed around a bit. They can move quickly too. The guy I got my angus bull from keeps about 12 herd bulls. When I was there breeding was over and he had them all together. We walked right out with them. He said his mother was walking with them when she was in her 90s. He told me the only scare he had was when a couple started pushing when he was right in the middle. Nothing like 2000 pounds of bull coming at you sideways. :lol2:

I don't usually feel qualified to actually give advice; I'm usually the one asking questions. But I agree with everyone, BE CAREFUL! It's not the ones that are obviously mean and wild that hurt you, but the gentle ones. It's not intentional, but can just be part of their natural behavior. It seems like there are times when an atomic bomb could go off and they don't even flinch; other times, a sudden shuffling in some nearby weeds causes a few seconds of chaos.

 

[Nite Hawk]

I definately like docile animals that can be scratched or doctored without a rodeo, however most cows out weigh me by alot more than a 1000 pounds so like Chippie said I want them to respect "my bubble zone" too, and not step all over me, and think of me as "boss" and not challenge my authority.
I worked on one dairy farm where the cows probably averaged 1500 pounds and I wasn't interested in getting squished by them, so carried a peice of PVC pipe, which sometimes made them move over.
They weren't mean, they just kind of blundered along and you had to get out of their way, when it should have been they get out of your way.
There was a very very small fellow who worked there, maybe about 4'9", and maybe 90 # at themost, but boy those cows respected him! Weren't afraid of him but moved out of the way when he waved or hollered. I asked him what his secret was and why those cows had a whole lot of respect for him. He kinda chuckled and and told me he carried a 4" nail in his pocket.
Now that will horrorify some people, but this fellow was so small he couldn't take any risks, and the cows knew he had "bite" and gave him about a 4'- 6' bubble and never knocked him around, whereas i had to watch out I didn't get knocked flat with my PVC pipe.
Those cows and [iwatched out for him and moved out of his way, not the other way around. They weren't afraid of him, but they were watching out of the corner of their eyes and treated him sort of like an electric fence--don't get too close-
I will scratch our critters, but i also will bopp them good and hard if they get too pushy.
Nothing wrong with being kind or scratching them, but they must
respect you, they are just too big to let them step all over you.

 

[inyati13]

I definately like docile animals that can be scratched or doctored without a rodeo, however most cows out weigh me by alot more than a 1000 pounds so like Chippie said I want them to respect "my bubble zone" too, and not step all over me, and think of me as "boss" and not challenge my authority.
I worked on one dairy farm where the cows probably averaged 1500 pounds and I wasn't interested in getting squished by them, so carried a peice of PVC pipe, which sometimes made them move over.
They weren't mean, they just kind of blundered along and you had to get out of their way, when it should have been they get out of your way.
There was a very very small fellow who worked there, maybe about 4'9", and maybe 90 # at themost, but boy those cows respected him! Weren't afraid of him but moved out of the way when he waved or hollered. I asked him what his secret was and why those cows had a whole lot of respect for him. He kinda chuckled and and told me he carried a 4" nail in his pocket.
Now that will horrorify some people, but this fellow was so small he couldn't take any risks, and the cows knew he had "bite" and gave him about a 4'- 6' bubble and never knocked him around, whereas i had to watch out I didn't get knocked flat with my PVC pipe.
Those cows and [iwatched out for him and moved out of his way, not the other way around. They weren't afraid of him, but they were watching out of the corner of their eyes and treated him sort of like an electric fence--don't get too close-
I will scratch our critters, but i also will bopp them good and hard if they get too pushy.
Nothing wrong with being kind or scratching them, but they must
respect you, they are just too big to let them step all over you.

Good post and makes a good point. I should let people know that I am established in the herd as the boss. Not to the extent that they move away but when I want something they all know I am boss.

 

[TexasBred]

Good post and makes a good point. I should let people know that I am established in the herd as the boss. Not to the extent that they move away but when I want something they all know I am boss.

When one decides to challenge you just show him your badge. (BOSS)

 

[Ouachita]

Good post and makes a good point. I should let people know that I am established in the herd as the boss. Not to the extent that they move away but when I want something they all know I am boss.

When one decides to challenge you just show him your badge. (BOSS)

:lol2:
inyati,
I consider my cows to be very docile as well. I also have 20 head at this time. I've told the story on here before, so I'm not going to take the time to re-tell it. Maybe you can search for it? My point is, you need to get one of those emergency push button thingy. You know, the "help, I've fallen and I can't get up" device. For you, I also recommend a SPOT; it's an emergency locator device primarily used in aviation, but reasonably priced and very accurate. Do you keep a cell phone with you, and have reception on your entire place? 911 on speed dial?
I don't have any of these things myself, except a cell phone. I only have reception on about 1/4 of my land. But what I do have; one or more of my children and/or wife are almost always with me.
Heard a sermon one time about the difference between knowledge and wisdom, with experience(s) being the teacher. Wise is the man who can learn from another persons mistake

 

[Ouachita]

Wow, I found it......easier than I thought, just to remember a couple key words I used.

From the "This bull is starting to get on my nerves" thread. Lots of good post on topic there inyati. :tiphat:

I guess I've been lucky with bulls. We have a black bull now that I swear has found a pot patch somewhere. Laid back, slow moving, whispers to the ladies..... when I'm out with them, he looks at me like "hey dude, got any Doritos" :lol: .

However, last winter, we had a really cold spell for about 4 days. Snow on the ground, temps down single digits at night, teens and 20's day, 40 mph winds. I was wearing every piece of clothing I had, carharts with the hood, and a scarf (like having on blinders), squinting my eyes because of wind and sleet, with a sack of cubes on my left shoulder. Next thing I know, I'm 4 feet in the air, upside down. To this day I have no idea which one it was. Cracked ribs and had a problem breathing for a few weeks. Lucky they didn't walk on me, cause that bag of cubes busted open around me. I think the whole incident spooked them, and they backed off. I changed my feeding method

 

[inyati13]

Ouachita, that is unnerving to be blindsided like that. Your suggestion on the device is good. Work on a farm is all dangerous and I use a tractor, chainsaw, etc. My phone does have reception on the entire farm. Thanks for the excellent and thoughtful suggestions.

 

[Ouachita]

Ouachita, that is unnerving to be blindsided like that. Your suggestion on the device is good. Work on a farm is all dangerous and I use a tractor, chainsaw, etc. My phone does have reception on the entire farm. Thanks for the excellent and thoughtful suggestions.

I do admire your passion for what appears to be a more intement relationship with your cattle, in contrast to some who just treat them as dollars. I find myself in the middle somewhere. I probably care more and have more interaction with my cattle the average person. I walk among them daily. Yes, they have names, and I do talk to them in a regular tone. More for me than them. Although I can walk up an touch or pet all but 2 of my momma's, I do not have an overwhelming urge to do so. I guess you could say the respect for our "bubbles" is mutual. I have never attempted to touch or pet the bull. He has a job and I have a job, both of which are taking care of the herd. (NO jokes here please :lol2: )
I do not consider myself nearly as experienced as others on this CT forum. I have learned a lot here, and will continue. I have also learned a lot on my own, most of which have been from a negative experience; what not to do again :tiphat: I do know it was not the bull that sent me flying. It was one of my docile momma's. She may still be on the place. Maybe not. I have sold some due to drought. I was very lucky they did not make a mud hole out of me. My ribcage still gives me fits on occasion. I expect it will the rest of my life.

 

[inyati13]

Ouachita, that is unnerving to be blindsided like that. Your suggestion on the device is good. Work on a farm is all dangerous and I use a tractor, chainsaw, etc. My phone does have reception on the entire farm. Thanks for the excellent and thoughtful suggestions.

I do admire your passion for what appears to be a more intement relationship with your cattle, in contrast to some who just treat them as dollars. I find myself in the middle somewhere. I probably care more and have more interaction with my cattle the average person. I walk among them daily. Yes, they have names, and I do talk to them in a regular tone. More for me than them. Although I can walk up an touch or pet all but 2 of my momma's, I do not have an overwhelming urge to do so. I guess you could say the respect for our "bubbles" is mutual. I have never attempted to touch or pet the bull. He has a job and I have a job, both of which are taking care of the herd. (NO jokes here please :lol2: )
I do not consider myself nearly as experienced as others on this CT forum. I have learned a lot here, and will continue. I have also learned a lot on my own, most of which have been from a negative experience; what not to do again :tiphat: I do know it was not the bull that sent me flying. It was one of my docile momma's. She may still be on the place. Maybe not. I have sold some due to drought. I was very lucky they did not make a mud hole out of me. My ribcage still gives me fits on occasion. I expect it will the rest of my life.

Ouachita, thank you for those words. I am passionate toward my cattle. I love my cattle and dog. Dollars are just paper. I would rather enjoy the pleasure my little heifer Star gets in a scratch or rub on her butt than have a $100 in my pocket. I take pleasure in her coming to me and putting her butt right in front of me so I can scratch it with my curry comb. She puts her head down and rolls her eyes. I like the smell of cattle. I like the heat their bodies give off. I like how sweet they are. I like my land and sometimes I just sit out in the pasture and watch my cows in the green grass. I have enjoyed watching my cows graze along in the lush green grass in the spring and summer. What does anyone else do that is more peaceful and contentful than your own cattle on your land, sitting with your little dog beside you? I don't want to be hurt and I appreciate every word above. I am a lover of cows and what did Robert Frost say, "One could do worse than be a lover of cows".

 

[Nite Hawk]

Our critters often come up for a scratch, brush or treat, which they are welcome to, and
appear to react with affection.
However when I walk in the barn and they are pushing too close I bark-"GET BACK'!! and 90% of the time they back right up. If they don't they get their ears swatted or nose bopped.
For generations cattle where taught to pull carts by voice commands only, and most of them are smart enough to know a few voice commands, (although there are some that are dumb as stumps, )and they know what "back up" means, or get over, and most of they time listen.
I also ALWAYS have my "antenna" up watching out of the corner of my eye for any sudden movement, ,flip of head, twitch of hind leg, change in expression of the eyes, another animal jumping on the back of another,
or the critter on the other side pushing the one closed to me,- my direction, and this one is reacting and I might get squished.
When leading I am always watching out of the corner of my eye in case something spooks the animal and there is the possiblity of getting knocked around. It is a habit to always be reading the animals body language, even though they are usually affectionate, I know things can happen whether a sting of a bee or sudden apperance of a dog can change the normally calm interaction, and accidents can happen.
Like I said earlier they out weigh me by quite a bit, and even if they are not mean and are often affectionate, I am not in the mood to be squished so am always looking out for possible problems.

 

[orton]

Risk tolerance is almost always based on your own ability to perform a given task. How many would call bull riding, or driving a crop duster, or working on the side of a hill with a tractor, high risk? These tasks are done all the time, and by some who make it look easy. They also live to tell about it when their old. Other people would have, and do have, catastrophic results. If you want to pet and comb your cows, you alone are the one to access the risk involved. If it works for you, then do it. P.S. If I ever had someone working for me, using a nail or any other sharp object on my cows and (or when) I found out, they had better be 10 states over, or hope the bull runs them over first. And no, I don't ride bulls, to dangerous! :mrgreen: Orton