More on retaining vs purchasing heifers
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Good article dun, thanks for posting.
Stocker Steve
Well-known member
- Lots of info on sync and breeding.
- Some info on getting premiums.
- I always struggled a bit with the calculations on how much more profit early calving cows generate. Based on that we should all sell our late calvers to someone else (who starts calving later) and then we all make more money! 8) What did I miss?
- Some info on getting premiums.
- I always struggled a bit with the calculations on how much more profit early calving cows generate. Based on that we should all sell our late calvers to someone else (who starts calving later) and then we all make more money! 8) What did I miss?
I would like to see an article that shows how many people by junk, what it costs to get rid of them, and how many times they will buy junk before they get some worth keeping around.
When you do all this culling for optimal productivity... it better produce... because it has to produce more that what you culled... plus pick up the loss you took from culling the other animal.
In articles its easy to talk about what produces the most on paper, but they leave out some of the realities of actually operating IMO. I have bought cattle and raised replacement. Each has their purpose. I am leary when some one says its always cheaper to buy. That has more to do with their operation... thats not across the board for every one. After all, if its always cheaper to buy, how do the people who sell replacements make money? Their costs must be lower than yours to raise that animal.
When you do all this culling for optimal productivity... it better produce... because it has to produce more that what you culled... plus pick up the loss you took from culling the other animal.
In articles its easy to talk about what produces the most on paper, but they leave out some of the realities of actually operating IMO. I have bought cattle and raised replacement. Each has their purpose. I am leary when some one says its always cheaper to buy. That has more to do with their operation... thats not across the board for every one. After all, if its always cheaper to buy, how do the people who sell replacements make money? Their costs must be lower than yours to raise that animal.
Mid South Guy
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Stocker Steve":2c06mv88 said:
I've struggled with that too. That assumes you sell all your calves at one time. If that is the case, all it means is the early calves are older and bigger. Whether it is more profitable to wean calves at 8-9 months old compared to 6-7 months old is debatable.
As far as buying or raising replacements, I prefer to raise them because, I know their history and genetics and can make a much better decision about their ablitity to produce than I can with purchased heifers. But that just me. IMO everyone has to evalulate for themselves and decide what works best for them.
Stocker Steve
Well-known member
Mid South Guy":3voywvhe said:
I calved on grass and sold the biggest cut in Febuary the last couple years. Caught part of a rising market but 650# calves tend to be a tweener size here, and I don't think putting the last 100# put on in a MN winter is a great idea. Kept the smaller calves, took them to grass, and they were the most profitable.
So late heifers are the best money makers? ;-)
Caustic Burno
Well-known member
Article has some good point's the thing it doesn't take into account is regional input cost.
If you can maintain a cow on .75 a day retaining may make business sense, where as if your cost run $1.25 a day it most likely doesn't other than genetic's and that comes at a cost. It is about at the end of the year did your employee the cow make money, not your hay or I sold this or that. The cow has to pay her way or she is on welfare.
Again their are many that think a retained heifer is free just like when they get their salebarn check and tell everyone how much the made on their cow's.
If you can maintain a cow on .75 a day retaining may make business sense, where as if your cost run $1.25 a day it most likely doesn't other than genetic's and that comes at a cost. It is about at the end of the year did your employee the cow make money, not your hay or I sold this or that. The cow has to pay her way or she is on welfare.
Again their are many that think a retained heifer is free just like when they get their salebarn check and tell everyone how much the made on their cow's.
Brute you bring up some very good points. I don't think there is a right or wrong answer, it depends on the producer. For me it is definitely better business practice to buy replacements. Simply because that is my business plan, and I have struggled with it in the past because of the difficulty in finding a place for quality replacements. However when I weight the cost of going to a maternal vs terminal sire it just doesn't pay. But your last sentence "Their costs must be lower than yours to raise hat animal", combined with the loss of productive ground to have a sellable calf every year, and the loss of pounds from the Maternal sire means that I personally come out ahead to buy replacements. I certainly don't advocate everyone doing this or producers like me would have no place to find those "quality replacements."Brute 23":2567qnlu said:
OP
OP
dun
Well-known member
Part of the retained vs purchase issue also boils down to how many of the retained heifers stay in the herd for 6 years or more and how many of the bought ones do. For us most of the bought ones only make it about 3-4 years, the retained ones run closer to 10. I'm not near smart enough to figure out which is the best investment but to me it seems like the retained ones are.
I've tried to put a pencil to it. Its a rough estimate at best but always come back to replacements based on risk.
Stocker Steve
Well-known member
Brute 23":1rpuy5m0 said:
I run replacements with the cows (not in a dry lot), and they each eat less than a pair, so I can actually run more head on the same amount of pasture. My replacement direct costs (no OH or labor) are about $0.51 per day for the grazing/breeding season and $0.63 per day for the winter.
Business question is whether the pair or the replacement produces more gross margin per acre (I am projecting $47 more for replacements), and how much of the higher replacement gross per acre is offset by the lower value of the maternal feeder animals (almost all of it Isomade).
So it is a push for me if I have one breed of bulls. I just happen to like fat butted wf heifers and I am willing to do the work to AI them. :cowboy:
The better business question is why aren't we running 6 wt steers rather than cows or replacements???
Stocker Steve":2x46lk07 said:
That is what I have been preaching to some of these old farts around here. We have been watching a guy who buys #4-500, takes them to #700 and direct sells them. They keep talking about that and I tell them when.... if.... it starts raining again don't stock real heavy. Hot wire off some grass for a creap pasture and keep your calves longer. In wet years you will have pleanty of grass and can get more per calf. In dry years you sell them eary and watch every one else cry about not having hay. Its the best of both worlds.
Caustic Burno
Well-known member
JSCATTLE":3k63934h said:
I agree.
I changed my game plan from selling bulls which was a hassle to keep the hateful things out of trouble.
To running an Angus over Hereford's terrible cross for salebarn calves IMO great as F-1 replacement's, as there is always a good market for the heifer's. Don't take the hit on the steer calves like you do with Brahman x Hereford.
James T
Well-known member
Caustic Burno":3rvpwcgn said:
I think that pretty much says it all. Regardless of whatever game your playing it still comes down to the stock paying their way.
With hay prices being what they are in Texas, combined with no certainty of when the drought will end, one has to wonder if sellers will be able to profit enough when folks decide to buy back.
