Lutalyse

[MF135]

After my Gpas recent mess with the Gelbvieh bull AMGV1102462 (Have pulled every calf) we're going to give all our yearling heifers a shot of Lutalyse. I dont' know that any of them are bred but with our recent luck, better safe than sorry. We have purchased an Angus bull (AAA#15332659) to bred to the heifers that Ide like to turn in with them, but like I said, I want to abort any calf that could be from the Gelbvieh beforehand. I have already purchased the Lutalyse but what about the dexamethasone... is this necessary? What protocal would yall suggest to assure any pregnancies are eliminated and when should I then turn the new bull in with these heifers?

Thanks

 

[dun]

If they may be only a couple of months bred Lut by itself is the standard. The dex is included for later pregnancys.

 

[angus9259]

If they may be only a couple of months bred Lut by itself is the standard. The dex is included for later pregnancys.

How late?

 

[dun]

If they may be only a couple of months bred Lut by itself is the standard. The dex is included for later pregnancys.

How late?

Around 3-4 or more

 

[BC]

Wait until after Thanksgiving to turn the bull out unless you don't mind summer calves.

 

[3waycross]

What makes you think that the Angus bull is any more user friendly when it comes to Calving ease. You just jumped out of the frying pan into the fire.

You use a Gelbvieh bull with a horrible CE number and terrible BW epd then of course you have to make sure you mention that it was a GELBVIEH like the breed itself did that to you.

Then you go find an angus bull with epd's behind him that are just as shyty as the Gelbvieh. The angus assn lists no epd's for him directly but his sire is a 3 for CE and his Dam is a 2. What makes you think you are better off than before.

Oh and by the way did you notice that both his sire and dam are a -6 epd for DOCILITY :shock: SO YOU GET NOT ONLY MORE CALVES THAT ARE HARD TO BIRTH BUT WHEN THEY GROW UP THEY WILL MOST LIKELY TRY TO KILL YOU. :help:

But by Gosh, at least they won't be a Gelbvieh...........don't put those pullin chains away yet :cowboy:

For what it's worth you asked what protocol to use: you might want to use the Burdizzo or Buck knife protocol if you don't want any more problems. Or you could go dig up that daMNed GELBVIEH bull , name him George Bush and blame all your calving problems on him for the next 4 years.

Now that I am done being a smarta$$ let me tell you how seriously bad I feel that you were sold that sorry POS(Gelbvieh) to begin with. He should have never had chance to breed anyones cattle much less your heifers. I am seriously questioning the Angus bull though with the numbers being what they are on his Sire and Dam. The BW numbers are not terrible but the CE is bad and the docility scares the he[[ out of me. Surely you can find a bull with better CE than that. I really do wish you luck.

 

[Alan]

Dun has given you good advice, but.... Call a vet or better yet Texas A&M veterinary college. Don't relay on internet advice. It's a simple phone call.

Alan

 

[Stocker Steve]

to abort any calf tI have already purchased the Lutalyse but what about the dexamethasone... is this necessary? What protocal would yall suggest to assure any pregnancies are eliminated and when should I then turn the new bull in with these heifers?

Lute is not very reliable in my experience. I would give a second lute shot, or palpate, unless I saw signs of an abortion.

 

[Roadapple]

I would go with Estrumate, as it's stronger and last longer. 10 doses for $29.95 compared to 6 doses of Lute for $16.79 plus your Dex.

 

[OLD DUSTY]

My vet recommends 5cc lut at least 10 days past breeding. Sometimes it takes a while for them to get straightened out and ready to breed, in my experience.

 

[hillsdown]

To abort heifers I use 2 cc's estrumate and 12 cc's of dex , watch for heats, if they do not have a heat repeat . Wait 10 days after pulling the bull to abort.

Why on earth would you ever let that bull near any heifers ,his calving ease EPD's are absolutely horrid ! 98 CE with an acc of .19 as well as BW of 4.8 . He is horned, has a high birth weight and a very shytty ween and yearling weight .
787, adj 746 for a YW .

Your new bull (if I have found him right) is 5 years old and has no EPD info on him , how is he any better than the last bull.

 

[KNERSIE]

After all this problems you've had the TMW you keep harping on about my cattle seems rather insignificant....

 

[RD-Sam]

What makes you think that the Angus bull is any more user friendly when it comes to Calving ease. You just jumped out of the frying pan into the fire.

You use a Gelbvieh bull with a horrible CE number and terrible BW epd then of course you have to make sure you mention that it was a GELBVIEH like the breed itself did that to you.

Then you go find an angus bull with epd's behind him that are just as shyty as the Gelbvieh. The angus assn lists no epd's for him directly but his sire is a 3 for CE and his Dam is a 2. What makes you think you are better off than before.

Oh and by the way did you notice that both his sire and dam are a -6 epd for DOCILITY :shock: SO YOU GET NOT ONLY MORE CALVES THAT ARE HARD TO BIRTH BUT WHEN THEY GROW UP THEY WILL MOST LIKELY TRY TO KILL YOU. :help:

But by Gosh, at least they won't be a Gelbvieh...........don't put those pullin chains away yet :cowboy:

For what it's worth you asked what protocol to use: you might want to use the Burdizzo or Buck knife protocol if you don't want any more problems. Or you could go dig up that daMNed GELBVIEH bull , name him George Bush and blame all your calving problems on him for the next 4 years.

Now that I am done being a smarta$$ let me tell you how seriously bad I feel that you were sold that sorry POS(Gelbvieh) to begin with. He should have never had chance to breed anyones cattle much less your heifers. I am seriously questioning the Angus bull though with the numbers being what they are on his Sire and Dam. The BW numbers are not terrible but the CE is bad and the docility scares the he[[ out of me. Surely you can find a bull with better CE than that. I really do wish you luck.

The AAA considers a +3 CED to be safe for heifers, whether or not the bull has a +3 is hard to tell, but the linebred N Bar 5522 would go a long way to getting him there. Looks like whomever bred the bull was trying to fix the calving ease problems in the lines, sure hope they did for his sake. One thing about EXT being that close, you don't have to worry as much about predators getting the calves.

 

[3waycross]

What makes you think that the Angus bull is any more user friendly when it comes to Calving ease. You just jumped out of the frying pan into the fire.

You use a Gelbvieh bull with a horrible CE number and terrible BW epd then of course you have to make sure you mention that it was a GELBVIEH like the breed itself did that to you.

Then you go find an angus bull with epd's behind him that are just as shyty as the Gelbvieh. The angus assn lists no epd's for him directly but his sire is a 3 for CE and his Dam is a 2. What makes you think you are better off than before.

Oh and by the way did you notice that both his sire and dam are a -6 epd for DOCILITY :shock: SO YOU GET NOT ONLY MORE CALVES THAT ARE HARD TO BIRTH BUT WHEN THEY GROW UP THEY WILL MOST LIKELY TRY TO KILL YOU. :help:

But by Gosh, at least they won't be a Gelbvieh...........don't put those pullin chains away yet :cowboy:

For what it's worth you asked what protocol to use: you might want to use the Burdizzo or Buck knife protocol if you don't want any more problems. Or you could go dig up that daMNed GELBVIEH bull , name him George Bush and blame all your calving problems on him for the next 4 years.

Now that I am done being a smarta$$ let me tell you how seriously bad I feel that you were sold that sorry POS(Gelbvieh) to begin with. He should have never had chance to breed anyones cattle much less your heifers. I am seriously questioning the Angus bull though with the numbers being what they are on his Sire and Dam. The BW numbers are not terrible but the CE is bad and the docility scares the he[[ out of me. Surely you can find a bull with better CE than that. I really do wish you luck.

The AAA considers a +3 CED to be safe for heifers, whether or not the bull has a +3 is hard to tell, but the linebred N Bar 5522 would go a long way to getting him there. Looks like whomever bred the bull was trying to fix the calving ease problems in the lines, sure hope they did for his sake. One thing about EXT being that close, you don't have to worry as much about predators getting the calves.

Really? how many bulls with a 3 for calving ease do you see advertised as a heifer bull. I will leave it at that..... :dunce: :dunce: :dunce:

 

[RD-Sam]

What makes you think that the Angus bull is any more user friendly when it comes to Calving ease. You just jumped out of the frying pan into the fire.

You use a Gelbvieh bull with a horrible CE number and terrible BW epd then of course you have to make sure you mention that it was a GELBVIEH like the breed itself did that to you.

Then you go find an angus bull with epd's behind him that are just as shyty as the Gelbvieh. The angus assn lists no epd's for him directly but his sire is a 3 for CE and his Dam is a 2. What makes you think you are better off than before.

Oh and by the way did you notice that both his sire and dam are a -6 epd for DOCILITY :shock: SO YOU GET NOT ONLY MORE CALVES THAT ARE HARD TO BIRTH BUT WHEN THEY GROW UP THEY WILL MOST LIKELY TRY TO KILL YOU. :help:

But by Gosh, at least they won't be a Gelbvieh...........don't put those pullin chains away yet :cowboy:

For what it's worth you asked what protocol to use: you might want to use the Burdizzo or Buck knife protocol if you don't want any more problems. Or you could go dig up that daMNed GELBVIEH bull , name him George Bush and blame all your calving problems on him for the next 4 years.

Now that I am done being a smarta$$ let me tell you how seriously bad I feel that you were sold that sorry POS(Gelbvieh) to begin with. He should have never had chance to breed anyones cattle much less your heifers. I am seriously questioning the Angus bull though with the numbers being what they are on his Sire and Dam. The BW numbers are not terrible but the CE is bad and the docility scares the he[[ out of me. Surely you can find a bull with better CE than that. I really do wish you luck.

The AAA considers a +3 CED to be safe for heifers, whether or not the bull has a +3 is hard to tell, but the linebred N Bar 5522 would go a long way to getting him there. Looks like whomever bred the bull was trying to fix the calving ease problems in the lines, sure hope they did for his sake. One thing about EXT being that close, you don't have to worry as much about predators getting the calves.

Really? how many bulls with a 3 for calving ease do you see advertised as a heifer bull. I will leave it at that..... :dunce: :dunce: :dunce:

Do you even own any angus? Just a little FYI, I have several cows and heifers with a 3 CED and BW's in the 3 to 4 range and they don't have large calves, and have never had a calving problem. :dunce: I guess you are just another clueless angus basher. :bs:

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

Read a few threads before you write RD Sam. Could be 135 has a bunch of heifers that needed their head cut off instead of trying to make cows out of them.

 

[hillsdown]

Do you even own any angus? Just a little FYI, I have several cows and heifers with a 3 CED and BW's in the 3 to 4 range and they don't have large calves, and have never had a calving problem. :dunce: I guess you are just another clueless angus basher. :bs:

3way does raise blk angus and he just recently posted a pic of one of his bulls on the breeds board. You should check it out ,he has really good proven EPD's and is a great looking bull as well.

Where you see angus bashing on this thread is beyond me Sam, as every post was based on information given by reg #'s and EPD's . :roll:

No one is bashing a breed here but MF135 ! . And I guarantee he got what he paid for , a POS bull that should have had his nuts cut off the day he was born :!: but whf it was cheap so when it doesn't work out bash the breed . :bang:

I bet I am not the only one on here that would LOVE to see some PICs of said bulls ,cows ,and heifers !!!!!!

 

[3waycross]

Just this one AAA16085653....who by the way has a CED of 9 and is a REAL heifer bull despite his very respectable carcass and growth numbers. I have been using him for 3 years on all of my cows and about 20 for other folks and he has yet to throw a calf over 72lbs. I selected him from a field of 90 very good yearling Angus bulls for his excellent phenotype and his balanced epd's. The only thing I would change on him is his milk(lower) and his growth numbers(a little higher) Any other questions?
FWIW I have absolutely nothing against Angus either as a breed or individually. Sadly for you I do know how to read both angus and Gelbvieh EPD's and I am telling you here and now an Angus bull with a CED EPD under 5 is not considered a heifer bull by anyone in I know and that includes folks who ACTUALLY own 5000 commercial Angus cows down to some real solid Angus seedstock operators with well managed herds of 100 to 150 head. Not one of them would even consider using a bull with(in this case) a projected CED epd of 2 or possibly 3 on a heifer. I don't care what the AAA propaganda tells you, it's bad business and when you come on here and say things like you did here it just makes more beginners make the same mistakes over and over again.

MY ANGUS BULL who BTW is for sale in case you want to own an ACTUAL HEIFER BULL

 

[MF135]

What makes you think that the Angus bull is any more user friendly when it comes to Calving ease. You just jumped out of the frying pan into the fire.

You use a Gelbvieh bull with a horrible CE number and terrible BW epd then of course you have to make sure you mention that it was a GELBVIEH like the breed itself did that to you.

Then you go find an angus bull with epd's behind him that are just as shyty as the Gelbvieh. The angus assn lists no epd's for him directly but his sire is a 3 for CE and his Dam is a 2. What makes you think you are better off than before.

Oh and by the way did you notice that both his sire and dam are a -6 epd for DOCILITY :shock: SO YOU GET NOT ONLY MORE CALVES THAT ARE HARD TO BIRTH BUT WHEN THEY GROW UP THEY WILL MOST LIKELY TRY TO KILL YOU. :help:

But by Gosh, at least they won't be a Gelbvieh...........don't put those pullin chains away yet :cowboy:

For what it's worth you asked what protocol to use: you might want to use the Burdizzo or Buck knife protocol if you don't want any more problems. Or you could go dig up that daMNed GELBVIEH bull , name him George Bush and blame all your calving problems on him for the next 4 years.

Now that I am done being a smarta$$ let me tell you how seriously bad I feel that you were sold that sorry POS(Gelbvieh) to begin with. He should have never had chance to breed anyones cattle much less your heifers. I am seriously questioning the Angus bull though with the numbers being what they are on his Sire and Dam. The BW numbers are not terrible but the CE is bad and the docility scares the he[[ out of me. Surely you can find a bull with better CE than that. I really do wish you luck.

THE POST DATE WAS IN MAY:

3 WAY, If you'll remember we purchased 2 Gelbvieh bulls from Markes. I bought the Lieutenant Gov son, AMGV1115744, which I have been extremely pleased with and my grandpa bought the Diamond Fortune ET S46 son who's out of an Ozz Hollis cow. Your remarks about my bull:

Great pedigree. I am at John Oswalds right now picking up some heifers and saw some real good sons of the Govenor bull this morning. He has a red grandson of the Cha Michell cow here that will wean 750lbs next week that I want real bad.

I am in no way bashing the Gelbvieh breed. I have 11 calves on the ground from 1115744. The only problem is 9 of em are bulls. Next spring I will get to see a nice contempory group as he's serviced 35 brangus cows and 5 red angus this summer.
Luckily only 4 of my gpas were bred to the Diamond Fortune son last summer. We bought the bulls last July (2010) and the rest of his cows were already bred. I would have never let the DF bull with my heifers. NOTICE The Gelbvieh bull I bought has a CE of of 113. The group I am asking about in the topic were heifers we just weaned that had been on their moms. None should have been old enough to breed but I wanted to give em the lute as a preventative.

We have already sold the Angus bull 1) because of the drought and 2) we only purchased him to breed the 15 heifers as my gpas now runnning my Charolais M786658 on his mature cows. He is the best looking bull I've ever owned. Im not sure where you get off thinking the Angus bull wasn't calving ease. He had an act BW of 73lbs, his sire had a negative BW epd with over .9 accuracy as well as his grandsire. He was linebred N Bar 5522. These are low birthweight genetics. That being said I didn't just go by epds. When we went to buy the Angus, he was in the pasture with 30+ first calf heifers with calves at side that he sired. They were all small/moderate framed calves with low 70lb bws as recorded by 4G. It wasn't that his EPDs were acceptable, it was the he was PROVEN.

I grew up working char x brahman, hereford x brahman, and the likes. The Docility EPD of angus is a joke and I personally would never make a selection based on that. I am a huge believer in nuture over nature. We sold the bull end of July as he had serviced the yearling heifers and we had no other use for him. Someone should attach the video of him following me into the trailer with a feed bucket to his docility EPD. I would not have purchased this bull for the long haul or as a herd bull but he was an acceptable solution to our problem: 15- 14month old heifers that needed to be bred.

After all this problems you've had the TMW you keep harping on about my cattle seems rather insignificant....

Out of the 45 I run and the 60+ head my grandpa runs, we assisted/pulled 7 calves. 4 were out of DF, 2 out of the a Brangus bull, and 1 out of the Gelbvieh I purchased. The one was breach and upside down. Not exactly what I would call "all these problems". I made the TMW comment once on one particular animal. "Keep harping" would insinuate multiple comments, multiple times. As many have told you, TMW in the states will get you docked severly. Both in the showring and at the salebarn. Im a huge fan of your cattle evalution skills, heck I drink yours and doc harris' words for breakfast. I'd like to see better udders on some of the cows you posted, but phenotypically, they're as good as any Ive seen.

 

[3waycross]

MF 135
Me and everyone else can only go by what you post. I am glad you like your Govenor son. BTW The red bull I posted on the other thread is the one you mention in your post. When you post the registration number on the Angus bull with no other explanation all we have to go on is what we see on the AAA website. His EPD's are nonexistant much less not updated. Why?

In any event if he worked for you then good on ya. You just got my hair up by making sure everyone knew you had problems with the GELBVIEH bull with no other info.

Good luck with your calves.....and for cryin out loud don't put too much stock in what I have to say about anything. Maybe Doc,but not me.LOLOL

BTW they are going to have 2 real good GV sales in Missouri coming up.