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Ouachita

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My kids and grandkids apparently have the week off from work and school.

I get home from work and can’t go anywhere without disturbing their hunting. So I cater to them, because I love them.

Me and the dog will sit in the yard and happily drink a bourbon, and see, and smell, and listen to all of the real goodness in the world. Nice evening.

It ain’t a bad way to be. I’m hoping others are enjoying similar smiles.
 
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callmefence

callmefence

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My kids and grandkids apparently have the week off from work and school.

I get home from work and can’t go anywhere without disturbing their hunting. So I cater to them, because I love them.

Me and the dog will sit in the yard and happily drink a bourbon, and see, and smell, and listen to all of the real goodness in the world. Nice evening.

It ain’t a bad way to be. I’m hoping others are enjoying similar smiles.
Grandkids will show up tomorrow afternoon. Not a deer young or old will be safe.
 

Dave

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There is also vast differences from one part of the country to another. Here the cats easily kill 10 times what the hunters do. Also winter kill is a serious problem on some years. They figure that the winter of 2016/17 over 60% of the deer in this county died. A combination of starvation and freezing to death. Doesn't happen every year but the potential is always there.
 

Brute 23

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That's every where. Coyotes, Bobcats, Mt Lions and even house dogs can have a big impact on your deer herd. There are huge anthrax kill offs also. The stats for deer hit by cars is amazing also. Hunters are actually way down on the list.

When I was a kid some if the places we had you couldnt even see a buck. People would peel the hide back off the nubs to claim it was a buck. They took pictures with 2 yr old 4 pts. People use to complain about not being able to kill does and would blame genetics on the lack of big mature bucks. Fast forward to now there are 140 and 150 class bucks being taken off the exact same properties. The meat hunters say I dont care about horns but they can take 2 buck and usually a doe per 50ac as opposed only one buck that they were lucky to see 25 years ago. The one mature buck is producing twice the meat that nubbin buck would.

The land hasn't changed, the genetics haven't changed, the food hasn't changed... in fact the conditions may have gotten worse due to land being tracked up and over grazing. The only thing that has changed is the mentality of how to manage deer and it has paid dividends.

It's amazing how nature will heal itself if we let it.
 

mwj

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That's every where. Coyotes, Bobcats, Mt Lions and even house dogs can have a big impact on your deer herd. There are huge anthrax kill offs also. The stats for deer hit by cars is amazing also. Hunters are actually way down on the list.

When I was a kid some if the places we had you couldnt even see a buck. People would peel the hide back off the nubs to claim it was a buck. They took pictures with 2 yr old 4 pts. People use to complain about not being able to kill does and would blame genetics on the lack of big mature bucks. Fast forward to now there are 140 and 150 class bucks being taken off the exact same properties. The meat hunters say I dont care about horns but they can take 2 buck and usually a doe per 50ac as opposed only one buck that they were lucky to see 25 years ago. The one mature buck is producing twice the meat that nubbin buck would.

The land hasn't changed, the genetics haven't changed, the food hasn't changed... in fact the conditions may have gotten worse due to land being tracked up and over grazing. The only thing that has changed is the mentality of how to manage deer and it has paid dividends.

It's amazing how nature will heal itself if we let it.


If hunters are ''way down the list'' on whitetail deaths, how can antler width on a very minor group, have much effect on the population as a whole?
 

Ouachita

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That's every where. Coyotes, Bobcats, Mt Lions and even house dogs can have a big impact on your deer herd. There are huge anthrax kill offs also. The stats for deer hit by cars is amazing also. Hunters are actually way down on the list.

When I was a kid some if the places we had you couldnt even see a buck. People would peel the hide back off the nubs to claim it was a buck. They took pictures with 2 yr old 4 pts. People use to complain about not being able to kill does and would blame genetics on the lack of big mature bucks. Fast forward to now there are 140 and 150 class bucks being taken off the exact same properties. The meat hunters say I dont care about horns but they can take 2 buck and usually a doe per 50ac as opposed only one buck that they were lucky to see 25 years ago. The one mature buck is producing twice the meat that nubbin buck would.

The land hasn't changed, the genetics haven't changed, the food hasn't changed... in fact the conditions may have gotten worse due to land being tracked up and over grazing. The only thing that has changed is the mentality of how to manage deer and it has paid dividends.

It's amazing how nature will heal itself if we let it.
Here in Arkansas there is a huge difference in how the NFS and large timber companies manage the land (compared to 30-50 years ago). So, here, the land has changed, and with it the forage, both in quality and quantity available.

In addition to more deer now than 50, or even 30 years ago, we also have a lot more predators. Natural predators are important for herd health, which is as you say, amazing how nature will heal itself if we let it. Similar to The Buffalo Theory.....................

A herd of buffalo can only move as fast as the slowest buffalo. And when the herd is hunted, it is the slowest and weakest ones at the back that are killed first. This natural selection is good for the herd as a whole, because the general speed and health of the whole group keeps improving by the regular killing of the weakest members. In much the same way, the human brain can only operate as fast as the slowest brain cells. Now, as we know, excessive intake of alcohol kills brain cells. But naturally, it attacks the slowest and weakest brain cells first. In this way, regular consumption of beer eliminates the weaker brain cells, making the brain a faster and more efficient machine. And that, Norm, is why you always feel smarter after a few beers.
 

Brute 23

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If hunters are ''way down the list'' on whitetail deaths, how can antler width on a very minor group, have much effect on the population as a whole?
Because although hunting is a smaller portion it targets a certain sector of the deer herd, usually young bucks.

Predators and other natural deaths, even vehicles, don't discriminate. They take young, old male, and female so it balances out. With the natural causes they may be taking the weak which helps the herd.

It's like a cattle rancher constantly butchering his herd bull for beef and wondering why they don't have calves or the herd isn't growing. Even though it's a small percentage being removed... its an important one.
 

mwj

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The sex ratio of deer harvested in my state runs at about 50-50. What %of bucks are harvested in your state? By the way if your bull to cow ratio is close to 1to1, go ahead and shoot a bull when you want to, it will not hurt a thing.
 

Brute 23

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The sex ratio of deer harvested in my state runs at about 50-50. What %of bucks are harvested in your state? By the way if your bull to cow ratio is close to 1to1, go ahead and shoot a bull when you want to, it will not hurt a thing.
Your harvest ratio is 1:1 or your herd ratio is 1:1?

I don't think Texas will have stats on how many deer are killed. You are not required to report your harvest in some cases. Just reading online it looks like about 500,000 deer are killed per season. I'm pretty sure our harvest numbers are based on live deer counts. I know the mld permits are because you have to turn the deer counts in annually to receive them.
 

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