Just An Observation

[East Caney]

Sure, you see them advertised all the time--beefmaster breeders jumping on the black hide fever bandwagon by unceremoniously slipping some angus genetics in the woodpile.
How else do ya think black polled beefmasters came to be?
They may claim thru selective breeding within the BM breed but that's mostly a fantasy.

It may be the company we keep...but those with whom I associate myself, to a great degree, are very unconcerned about black Beefmaster cattle. What's eating at me to a far greater degree is the push by the association (and some in it) for Beefmasters to be solid colored. I continually see red mottle faced Beefmaster bulls topping sales. Then, I hear breeders who should know better saying that the mottle faced bulls will make great commercial bulls. Well, how do you produce them when commercial buyers want them without some white on the face of either parent? And to my signature...what are doing if we aren't trying to raise bulls for the commercial cattle operator? Eventually, someone's going to take the logical approach of just looking at the quality of an animal with color only being a deciding factor when all other reasonable trait characteristics don't distinguish one animal from another. I'm going to hop down off this soap box before I mess up someone's Friday. :tiphat:

 

[bigbull338]

EC your not going to mess up my friday.because as a breeder i hear it from both sides.ive got friends that only like red beefmasters.friends that only like the foundation breeding.friends like like the show bred beefmasters.i just want cows and bulls that are bred to meet the guiedlines of the BBU founder.if they have a show calf thats great.but im not going to breed my cows for that single thing.

 

[East Caney]

EC your not going to mess up my friday.because as a breeder i hear it from both sides.ive got friends that only like red beefmasters.friends that only like the foundation breeding.friends like like the show bred beefmasters.i just want cows and bulls that are bred to meet the guiedlines of the BBU founder.if they have a show calf thats great.but im not going to breed my cows for that single thing.

Bigbull, I'm not directing my comments at anyone in particular. Your post was similar to mine in that we aren't looking for black Beefmasters. If I wanted to chase that market, I would put a homo black homo polled bull with no Brahaman influence on the Beefmaster cows and produce polled black Beefmaster crossed calves that could be sold in the E6 or Advancer program. That cross is marketable in as large an area as any. I thought about it...hard. But once again, I have Beefmaster blood in my veins.

 

[thommoos]

Sure, you see them advertised all the time--beefmaster breeders jumping on the black hide fever bandwagon by unceremoniously slipping some angus genetics in the woodpile.
How else do ya think black polled beefmasters came to be?
They may claim thru selective breeding within the BM breed but that's mostly a fantasy.

Been there when I had a lot less experience and knowledge, I am the biggest critic now of the corruption of Black Magic, Soul Man, and a couple others. I even have some Homo Black and Polled semen left. Today there is a definite back lash on the black hide in Beefmasters only one or two are surviving the back lash. Focus has been of late on Captain Sugar and oasis influence. Another rabbit hole instead of carcass, trait, and epd's. What has caused my faith the most to drop is the EPD issue with Beefmasters Most animals have a low EPD across the board. You have to focus on the commercial buyer not the deep pocket pure bred, With all this said I mean the south east especially. That is why I dropped my membership and have jump to the Gelbveih bull.

Bigbull, I'm not directing my comments at anyone in particular. Your post was similar to mine in that we aren't looking for black Beefmasters. If I wanted to chase that market, I would put a homo black homo polled bull with no Brahaman influence on the Beefmaster cows and produce polled black Beefmaster crossed calves that could be sold in the E6 or Advancer program. That cross is marketable in as large an area as any. I thought about it...hard. But once again, I have Beefmaster blood in my veins.

Beefmasters are in my blood also but I have become disallusioned with what is being sold down here. The last time I went to a sale the Futurity winner was a an animal for Deep pockets, not the best animal there. What would sale in Texas will not sale down here.

 

[greybeard]

Eventually, someone's going to take the logical approach of just looking at the quality of an animal with color only being a deciding factor when all other reasonable trait characteristics don't distinguish one animal from another.

I thought someone already did that a long time ago,,when he developed the breed. :nod:

 

[dieselbeef]

so give me some input on this guy. i just bought him by chance and got lucky. how do i rate the sire and dam in order to use information to help me select another bull.

school me on epds and comparison shopping . you guys know alot more than i will ever understand.
thanks i like this thread altho some of it is over my head

gary

 

[cloud9cattle]

Just as a tid bit. I was at a sale last month at our local auction bar and i saw two paint befmaster steers ring the bell and top the calf sale. My point being i think when they are good they are good no matter what color they are.

 

[East Caney]

Just as a tid bit. I was at a sale last month at our local auction bar and i saw two paint befmaster steers ring the bell and top the calf sale. My point being i think when they are good they are good no matter what color they are.

I would hope so, but I need more examples of the that and some way of showing the variables that produced those outcomes before I'll be led to believe that a set of paint calves will consistently outsell a set of black calves when quality is consistent across the board.

Eventually, someone's going to take the logical approach of just looking at the quality of an animal with color only being a deciding factor when all other reasonable trait characteristics don't distinguish one animal from another.

I thought someone already did that a long time ago,,when he developed the breed. :nod:

He did. Unfortunately, he's no longer here to remind those who wish to reshape the breed. Almost seems folks are willing to pick any 5 of the 6 essentials and substitute color for #6. I can imagine Tom Lasater if he was having to deal with some of this right now. It would probably look something like this... :bang:

 

[cloud9cattle]

Just as a tid bit. I was at a sale last month at our local auction bar and i saw two paint befmaster steers ring the bell and top the calf sale. My point being i think when they are good they are good no matter what color they are.

I would hope so, but I need more examples of the that and some way of showing the variables that produced those outcomes before I'll be led to believe that a set of paint calves will consistently outsell a set of black calves when quality is consistent across the board.

Eventually, someone's going to take the logical approach of just looking at the quality of an animal with color only being a deciding factor when all other reasonable trait characteristics don't distinguish one animal from another.

Unfourtantley the angus association hired one hell of a marketing team and suggested black was better.

 

[thommoos]

so give me some input on this guy. i just bought him by chance and got lucky. how do i rate the sire and dam in order to use information to help me select another bull.

school me on epds and comparison shopping . you guys know alot more than i will ever understand.
thanks i like this thread altho some of it is over my head

gary[/quote]
This is my problem with the beefmasters right now NO EPD's. on that reg paper But I know Beefmaster genetic: Excellent Blood lines, goes back to Rober E Lee, Crimson Warrior on Top side and Bottum is Polled Mandate then the dam goes right back to Levi and Rob E Lee, and out of a Volunteer Donor Cow. To sum it up excellent line breeding to produce a great Bull. I know I have seen your pict of him, I like.

Individual Performance looks like 78 bw and 840 wean, why with that heavy of a wean weight epd's of only +6?