I I thought it was calves stealing milk

[dun]

Huge difference between buck and birdshot

no dun I did not mean buck shot like you would kill a deer with I mean bird shot like you shoot a bird with. I called it wrong, if it was buck shot it would not be as hard to remove, if it did not kill him.
Shooting them then selling them is a bad idea if you BIRD shoot them when you are ready to sell them take them out back and kill them and feed them to the coyotes !!!
when they have bird shoot in them and they are butchered you have to remove it. Any missed will go through the grinder and into the hamburger then ol miss sue happy bites down on one and it breaks her tooth and next thing you know the packer is in court getting sued. Its not a good deal and with the way they can track them back to where they came from today I don't that the person that shot the bull may not get in trouble also.

Common sense is so uncommon. At a distance the birdshot won;t even penetrate the hair let alone the hide. All it does is sting

 

[True Grit Farms]

Huge difference between buck and birdshot

no dun I did not mean buck shot like you would kill a deer with I mean bird shot like you shoot a bird with. I called it wrong, if it was buck shot it would not be as hard to remove, if it did not kill him.
Shooting them then selling them is a bad idea if you BIRD shoot them when you are ready to sell them take them out back and kill them and feed them to the coyotes !!!
when they have bird shoot in them and they are butchered you have to remove it. Any missed will go through the grinder and into the hamburger then ol miss sue happy bites down on one and it breaks her tooth and next thing you know the packer is in court getting sued. Its not a good deal and with the way they can track them back to where they came from today I don't that the person that shot the bull may not get in trouble also.

Common sense is so uncommon. At a distance the birdshot won;t even penetrate the hair let alone the hide. All it does is sting

I've shot the heck out of my cows with bird shot. Trying to rotate them off the oats some will just refuse, but that sting will make them find their way every time.

 

[Till-Hill]

If I was you I'd do the partner a favor and haul him to market asap and find a new bull.

I sure wouldn't want you as a partner. Making decisions without consulting him and not even knowing how much money
is tied up in the bull or by who and the what the added replacement expense will be.

Do yourself a favor and talk with the partner first and agree on a plan before shipping him.
Otherwise you may create much bigger problems than a sucking bull.

Butch I was being sarcastic. I hope the partner tho ships him down the road.

 

[BRYANT]

Huge difference between buck and birdshot

no dun I did not mean buck shot like you would kill a deer with I mean bird shot like you shoot a bird with. I called it wrong, if it was buck shot it would not be as hard to remove, if it did not kill him.
Shooting them then selling them is a bad idea if you BIRD shoot them when you are ready to sell them take them out back and kill them and feed them to the coyotes !!!
when they have bird shoot in them and they are butchered you have to remove it. Any missed will go through the grinder and into the hamburger then ol miss sue happy bites down on one and it breaks her tooth and next thing you know the packer is in court getting sued. Its not a good deal and with the way they can track them back to where they came from today I don't that the person that shot the bull may not get in trouble also.

Common sense is so uncommon. At a distance the birdshot won;t even penetrate the hair let alone the hide. All it does is sting

call it what you want but I have cut 4 different sizes of bird shot out of one bull before the Gov. Insp. said we had to trash him. We bought most bulls on the rail so in that case the buyer was the one who lost. If I was the buyer you can rest for sure that I would have traced back to who brought the bull in and been on them. I will never be convinced that shooting them with bird shoot is a good thing. Seen way to many times that people did not use ''common sense'' and we were cutting out bird shot. Waste of time, labor and money if you have and idiot bull or cow sell them and replace with one that isn't .

 

[True Grit Farms]

You'd have to be dang close to the cow for bird shot to penetrate the hide. I was shot by a kid in the back with a 20 ga at less than 30 yards in the dove field, and only 3 pellets broke the skin and one is still in there somewhere. And I was wearing a tee shirt, and not leathers.

 

[farmerjan]

AdamsCreek, don't think that you would be able to come out ahead on the buying then selling the bull in 90 days or so. Seems when we need something we always pay premium for it, then when it's time to sell, don't get back the worth. If you couldn't lease a bull from a neighbor, what if it is a bull they are thinking of selling in order to get new genetics for themselves???? Then you would probably be able to buy for cull price and then not lose when you sell. Since you know and get along with the two neighbors at least, I would certainly explore that avenue first.
Do the neighbors run the bull full time with the cows or only for a specific time frame? If full time then it might be a better chance to get it for a 60 day window. Also, you might want/ need to change the timing of how you manage the cows if you do go to leasing. Maybe later calves, and sold at lighter weights or kept longer and fed some for heavier weights....we have gotten very flexible here now that we have more numbers and sometimes put the calves on feed after weaning to hold until the market is better....but we have a whole different operation due to the fact that we can run 1 c/cf pair for every 1-3 acres instead of every 5-10 acres like your weather dictates. But we also make and feed alot of hay; we also do alot of rotational grazing and just moved 30 c/c pairs to pasture that was rotated off of in July, and will feed them for at least a month if no deep snow. They have 5 rolls in front of them and only see a few even wanting to munch on them so know that they are doing mostly grazing of the dry grass. And we will open up 2 hayfields that were only cut once so as to extend the grazing, which we will do in about 2 weeks then move them out again in mid-march so it doesn't ruin the fields when we start to get some rain and all before growth starts in April.
Too bad you aren't closer, we usually lease a couple of bulls every year and are glad to let someone else feed them for a couple of months...

 

[BRYANT]

this ol bull had it all over him and he was one ''bad boy'' probably one that should have been sent to town long before he was. He would fight and come looking for a fight. In my younger days I got to where I could walk then 2.7/8 top rails pretty good and fast with a hot shot in one hand.

 

[Nesikep]

Neighbor of mine was cleaning out a pen when the bull came after him.. apparently he put the pitchfork through the bulls nose and into the ground, and left him there to cool down a little.. After that incident apparently the bull said please and thank you.

 

[MRRherefords]

Many years ago my grandfather had a cow that was losing milk. He though it might be anything from other calves, to other cows, to the bull. But it turned out to be a very large black snake, that was determined to get a drink of milk.

 

[TexasBred]

You'd have to be dang close to the cow for bird shot to penetrate the hide. I was shot by a kid in the back with a 20 ga at less than 30 yards in the dove field, and only 3 pellets broke the skin and one is still in there somewhere. And I was wearing a tee shirt, and not leathers.

I killed a deer at not more than 30 yard with a 16 guage with #4 Remington Expresses but that's a bit more than "bird shot".

 

[True Grit Farms]

You'd have to be dang close to the cow for bird shot to penetrate the hide. I was shot by a kid in the back with a 20 ga at less than 30 yards in the dove field, and only 3 pellets broke the skin and one is still in there somewhere. And I was wearing a tee shirt, and not leathers.

I killed a deer at not more than 30 yard with a 16 guage with #4 Remington Expresses but that's a bit more than "bird shot".

As bad as it hurt with a 20 ga low brass, I image a #7 1/2 high brass express would of killed me. My uncle would shoot his quail dogs with Remington high brass express, for breaking point and flushing the covey. I saw one dog run for at least 1/2 mile yelping with every step. Don't know if it help the dog much, but my uncle said it was worth it to him.

 

[farmerjan]

Neighbor of mine was cleaning out a pen when the bull came after him.. apparently he put the pitchfork through the bulls nose and into the ground, and left him there to cool down a little.. After that incident apparently the bull said please and thank you.

oudh :shock: :shock:

 

[Lazy M]

Many years ago my grandfather had a cow that was losing milk. He though it might be anything from other calves, to other cows, to the bull. But it turned out to be a very large black snake, that was determined to get a drink of milk.

I think grandpa was telling tales..

 

[AdamsCreek]

AdamsCreek, don't think that you would be able to come out ahead on the buying then selling the bull in 90 days or so. Seems when we need something we always pay premium for it, then when it's time to sell, don't get back the worth. If you couldn't lease a bull from a neighbor, what if it is a bull they are thinking of selling in order to get new genetics for themselves???? Then you would probably be able to buy for cull price and then not lose when you sell. Since you know and get along with the two neighbors at least, I would certainly explore that avenue first.
Do the neighbors run the bull full time with the cows or only for a specific time frame? If full time then it might be a better chance to get it for a 60 day window. Also, you might want/ need to change the timing of how you manage the cows if you do go to leasing. Maybe later calves, and sold at lighter weights or kept longer and fed some for heavier weights....we have gotten very flexible here now that we have more numbers and sometimes put the calves on feed after weaning to hold until the market is better....but we have a whole different operation due to the fact that we can run 1 c/cf pair for every 1-3 acres instead of every 5-10 acres like your weather dictates. But we also make and feed alot of hay; we also do alot of rotational grazing and just moved 30 c/c pairs to pasture that was rotated off of in July, and will feed them for at least a month if no deep snow. They have 5 rolls in front of them and only see a few even wanting to munch on them so know that they are doing mostly grazing of the dry grass. And we will open up 2 hayfields that were only cut once so as to extend the grazing, which we will do in about 2 weeks then move them out again in mid-march so it doesn't ruin the fields when we start to get some rain and all before growth starts in April.
Too bad you aren't closer, we usually lease a couple of bulls every year and are glad to let someone else feed them for a couple of months...

Lots of good advice here. I haven't really thought that hard about it. Not sure if it's because I'm still green when it comes to the business side of this deal or cause I'm not that intelligent. Probably some of both. Thanks for taking the time to give advice and ideas Jan. It's appreciated.

 

[farmerjan]

Don't think it's that you aren't "that intelligent"; just sometimes it takes coming from a different perspective. Owning a bull joint isn't always a bad deal, we've done it in the early days.
Buying a bull from someone who changes bulls every couple of years is something we did several times. And got a couple that we kept for many years and a few that didn't click with our cows and sold after only a year or two. But if you don't have to have a specific bloodline, but just a decent bull, getting one that someone is going to ship is a good way to get a proven bull, at "affordable" pound prices, and then you can ship him after and he got a little extra lease on life.
Talk to the neighbors since you don't need one "right now" and get the groundwork laid before you need him.

 

[Caustic Burno]

I hauled a 12 month heifer today for being a thief
Caught her this morning before the storm came through soon as it was
over penned them and she grew wheels.

 

[AdamsCreek]

The offending bull is gonna get hauled to his other home in mid March. I figure I'll just calve my little bunch out between October and December then figure out which direction to go in. I just have to put up with it until then since I kinda need him to do his job right now.

 

[Caustic Burno]

I can't afford a colostrum thief

 

[ddd75]

Many years ago my grandfather had a cow that was losing milk. He though it might be anything from other calves, to other cows, to the bull. But it turned out to be a very large black snake, that was determined to get a drink of milk.

I think grandpa was telling tales..

i know in ky they all told me to watch the ponds b/c a certain snake would latch on to the tits and suck the milk.

 

[dun]

i know in ky they all told me to watch the ponds b/c a certain snake would latch on to the tits and suck the milk.

Same category as hoop snakes that grab their tails and roll away like a wheel.