KNERSIE":d7uucn6u said:
Just re-read thru the post on here, some good comments. I can agree that "low accuracy EPD's " are questionable, but what about if the sire and dam have good EPD's? What do you think about the DNA test for some of these traits?
The most important thing when using unproven EPDs is to go and look in previous generations where the good EPDs came from. If it is good going back several generations you can use them with reasonable confidence, but if it shows that the "good" EPDs was a result of corrective matings then you are as likely to get either extreme as you are to get the good in between.
This is an interesting point. "Good" but low accuracy EPD's can originate from recent corrective matings OR they can result from similar "Good" EPD's from a bull's previous generations.
I have taken a fair amount of criticism from some folks here on the "low accuracy" of my former bull's (Huth Coop T021 reg# 42812075) "Good" EPD's and have learned from that. T021's low accuracy is likely to remain that way since neither I nor the Angus operation now using him to make baldies have registered any calves from him.
However the number one bull criteria for me is calving ease since I am often not around my cattle at calving time for a few days at a time. Jerry Huth originally suggested this bull for me mostly on that criteria. Looking back through T21's pedigree though, there is calving ease on the top side quite a ways back through 9126J, 3008, 767G as well as not bad on the bottom side.
So I agree with Knersie's comment about low accuracy EPD's but that come from and through a pedigree seem to be still valuable, at least in an area such as calving ease which is hard to see visually. T021's calving ease seems to have carried through to him although I am probably jinxing myself with his current group of calves due to start in a week or so.
What the EPD's don't show is the conformation. And while T21 was not bad, I really like my current Huth bull, U070 (#43022886), who is a half brother to T021 and shares the same pedigree top side calving ease etc, but has a smaller frame size and what I now see as a "beefier" conformation.
Point is as Knersie points out the EPD's seem to be valuable (and likely to carry through) even though low accuracy IF they come from the deep in the pedigree rather than a single, more contrived, EPD-oriented mating. However the EPD's do not give you the visual conformation, frame size, and what I see as "beefy" structure and ability to do it without a hot special bull feed ration.
Here is a picture of my current U070 bull to illustrate what I am talking about in conformation. His growth EPD's aren't quite what T021's are but the calving ease and others are still there along with good feet, some beef, lower, longer frame and the ability to do it on just hay and mineral all winter. U070:
An interesting and educational discussion.
I guess I am one of the numbers-oriented newbies referred to with some disdain above in this thread but I think I am getting closer to understanding at least a part of this business. BTW, to show his offspring, here is a picture of a couple of T021's steers in corn from yesterday. They are coming along. I am looking forward to seeing if they are closer to my 1100 lb goal in late April. From the looks of the manure on the ground they should be WELL marbled.
Thank you.
Jim