HOW BIG A HERD TO MAKE IT A FULL TIME JOB??

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I put Agman's principles to the test. I rotate every 3-10 days through pastures that are 3-6 acres. I have 6 pastures and two hay fields. I graze the hay fields for 2 days after I take the hay off and put it in the barn. I have 25 pairs and 1 bull in that herd. The place had no grass on it when i bought it 3 years ago. Now i have fescue and red clover better in some fields than others. My cows can't keep up with it. I feed hay now mid Jan to mid April. I honestly think if I rotated daily into smaller pastures I would not have to feed any hay and could increase my herd by as much as 20% and still be relatively safe in the dry times. Long term drought I couldn't do it. I can't make a full time living on this but the cows will pay for there keep, the land, the machinery I need, fertillizer needs, seed, fencing and fuel costs. I do profit annually thanks a lot to the increase in cattle prices the profit is increasing. When I compare my starting figures to the current figures and look at the percentages in each category as compared to the gross farm income I see very little variation over the three years. I know that will change as I keep with it. I said all that to say this. I think that 100 cows would provide me the residual income coupled with my retirement pay to afford me the lifestyle I provide for my family now. The reason I put that effort into the farm is to be my own boss, enjoy the newness of life provided annually by the babies and the fact that the farm affords me the ability to enjoy life and not be a slave to a job. It is a lifestyle I think we should figure a way to put a dollar figure on that part of it. Why else would anyone want o risk that much for so little profit? My profits are much more intangible than dollars. But then again I am not into material things. I want a place my grand kids can play dawn to dusk outside without concerns of being snagged off the street. I don't want to be worried about crime, I know who comes to my house to see me I like being waved at whenI meet a car on the road....I am sure many of you feel that way also...What is that worth in compensation?
 
the way you truely know how meny cows you can live is easy.you add up all your monthly bills.an then you devide that by say $650 a calf.that will give you the # of calves you need to sell a month x 12 months.an see if you have enough land for that # of cows.i did that an i could live good if i sold 3 calves a month.but i live on a shoestring an always will no matter how much money i have.
 
agmantoo":2poj6jcc said:
bigbluegrass

I keep rather close record of all my cattle expenses. Realize the farm taxes are low, I buy minerals, some diesel, ear tags, a few fencing materials, limited machinery parts, no labor, etc. These expenses when totaled, divided by the selling price of calves marketed are too low to post as no one here will believe the results. Could we suffice by saying that after I sold my 6 best steers in this high market I became profitable for the year?
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That sounds a lot like us. I have difficulty understanding why it is so expensive. We currently have 16 heifers, 130 acres paid for, and a few pieces of farm equipment. Granted, my brother and I just got back in the business, but he had a 16 cow/calf hobby here a few years ago. He keeps receipts on everything. He said he always made good money even then. Of course, 16 cows is not a living; we just look at it as extra money, and he said it was good money. He had someone mow our hay on the 1/3 deal, so he had to buy a few rolls; otherwise, he said he bought a little mineral, fly control, and fuel, and that was about it. He likes to call us the "bare bones" operators though. We just work with what we have and don't have a need for new equipment often. So, I guess everybody's situation is just different.
 
Best of luck to everyone of ya. Hopefully no one is fooling themselves. This is a tough business. Keep your eggs in many baskets. Big money is hard to come by. Seen way too many heartbreaks in my lifetime including watching my own dad go under in the 80's drought.
 
I will add this advice an old friend gave me. When buying farm land MAKE SURE TO GET THE MINERAL RIGHTS. Many farmers have been saved by getting a good lease on their ground. As drilling technology improves a lot of land that was overlooked is now quite valuable. I had a friend get burned buying land and the previous owner retained mineral rights, I went out of my way at closing on my property even though the realator said it was a waste of time and with the new utica shale play coming this direction have been getting some very tempting offers even for a non-drill lease with none of my property stepped foot on.
 
backhoeboogie":19w9fr6k said:
Best of luck to everyone of ya. Hopefully no one is fooling themselves. This is a tough business. Keep your eggs in many baskets. Big money is hard to come by. Seen way too many heartbreaks in my lifetime including watching my own dad go under in the 80's drought.
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that is some very good advice.
as jscattle and boogie and some others have said don't have your entire livelihood dependent on cattle.
in the late 80's and early 90 i thought i going to get rich, in 1994 between drought and .70 steers, i didn't get rich and learned the above statement
 
SRBeef":11pxwfd4 said:
A number I have read from several universities is that it costs $500/year to own a cow. It looks to me like that is fairly accurate...
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I've seen this number quoted in several places. Can someone tell me what goes in to the $500/cow/year figure?
 
ArmyDoc":d3kcq912 said:
SRBeef":d3kcq912 said:
A number I have read from several universities is that it costs $500/year to own a cow. It looks to me like that is fairly accurate...
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I've seen this number quoted in several places. Can someone tell me what goes in to the $500/cow/year figure?
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Hay, grain, mineral, salt, diesel, gas, equipment repair and maintenance, pasture spray, fertilize, pasture lease/rent, fence repair, vaccinations, and vet bills. Someone else will chime in with what I forgot.
 
Base rent for a cow calf pair, May to October, is now 225 on any new leases in my neck of the woods and you take care of the fences, thistles, and salt/mineral. I've got a few neighbors bidding 300 and some retirees asking 400. $500/year is pretty close for most of of those guys.
 
JS - out of curiosity, how many acres per pair, and how long is your grazing season?

We usually get five to six months of grass, wean, and move the cows to irrigated corn stalks until the snow gets deep.
 
H and H":2wdz521h said:
JS - out of curiosity, how many acres per pair, and how long is your grazing season?

We usually get five to six months of grass, wean, and move the cows to irrigated corn stalks until the snow gets deep.
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We graze from April until December . Most years I try to keep it 3 acres per pair . Some years its 1 acre some years its 8 just depends on the weather .
 
Thanks for all of the comments. I have a pretty good job, but my company always reminds me that I am just an employee, so I dream of working for myself full time someday.
Heres my variables: 300 hundred grazing acres(cross fencing is being put in now) Agmantoo post have been very helpful
I have about 75 acres in hay also, usually get around 400 rolls a year, trying to build up a surplus for hard times.
Land is paid for, no renting. I buy chicken litter yearly and rotate spreading.
I normally start feeding Dec 1 and stop around Mar 15. Usually feed around 225 rolls of 4x5s. I have around 100 head of cattle(thats cows,heifers calves, and bulls.)
All of my equipment is pretty new/ name brand and almost paid for! But theirs more on the list!
I've thought about chicken farming, but the debt that would be involved in startup is pretty scarey!
I have always thought a 100 mama cows would do it, but Idk now!
 
Tank with the land paid for, machinery almost paid for and I presume the cows are I would think you could make it on 100 head. You wouldn't be rich but it sure would beat an office or an assembly line. I am thinking that I can break even on expenses and make the difference up in my retirement pay from the military and what I make on active duty with a herd in the neighborhood of 40-50 cows with the current prices. But I don't have large payments on machinery. My cows will be paid for in 3 more years and the farm payment is fairly low. I have my hay rolled and buy a little but am comsidering buying all my hay and increasing my herd some. I have 25 cows on average now and feed 75 4x5's per year. That number is on a downward trend as my pasture gets better.
 
Working for yourself is a great goal but it's not always what you dream it to be. Doesn't matter what business you're in.
 

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