Hereford cows

[tncattle]

I don't think that the main question is what breed to use. I do agree with your choices but to me that is way ahead of the game for the beginner. I also applaud the not borrowing. However the first question I would ask is whether starting with just 4 or 5 is a viable or smart plan. In my observation and experience anything less than 15 is a very risky proposition. Let me ask some questions.
1. Do you have a reliable place to run them and or winter feed supply.
2. Do you or your spouse have time for them? Assuming either you or your spouse has a full time job. The biggest problem I constantly see here is taking the time to treat an illness the moment it is spotted instead of putting it off until you have more time.
3. Do you have handling facilities for them? In case of needing to treat them or just load them out. You might be able to treat them with a gun but that is very expensive and do you really want to carry that 365.
4. Have you calculated the cost of a bull for breeding only 4 or 5 cows. You can AI but you still need to do a clean up.
5. How about machinery? Pickups, trailers, ATVs are very expensive on a per head basis for only a very few head.
6. Are you set up with someone to watch them if you need to be gone?

I have seen these exact problems over and over into nauseum. For some odd reason there seems to be a whole lot more problems and dangers for herds of less than 15.

I recently bought a small herd of cattle from a very unique line that is all but extinct. In the beginning I was to get 7 head, all that the breeder had plus some semen. Of the 7 there was one steer calf, one bull calf that we couldn't use and one cow that we could use only marginally. So now we are down to 4. Next of those 4 2 came down with pnuemonia which we were able to clear up OK. Next one foundered on just grass and probably will never be able to raise a calf on her own although we are flushing her regularly. So now we ended up with 3 cows that can have a healthy calf. How long will it take that number to produce enough to have a sustainable sized herd? Luckily they were all open so we could donor them.

What we decided was to ET the 4 that were good and get all the numbers as quickly as possible. That is just what we are doing but don't get the idea that this idea is simple. First there is the cost and the difficulty of finding viable recipients. We started with a very large number of our own cattle to find the few recipients that are now pregnant.
We are planning on transferring twice a year and flushing every few months. The fresh transfer is much cheaper but if you want to implant 30 embryos and are flushing only 4 cows then you need to have some frozen embryos for backup. Two of the donors came down with foot rot right in the beginning of their stimulation and AI period. We did get embryos out of one but the other was a blank.

I could recount a whole lot of these horror stories from simply not having enough funds to properly care for the cattle to not taking the time to treat or not recognizing a problem until it is too late. After selling hay to these people for years we sometimes feel that we have heard it all.

I applaud what you want to do but you had better be prepared for the worst.

I'll answer your questions in order:

1. Yes I have a reliable place to run them and quality winter hay as well.

2.Yes, I have the time and can leave my job which is very flexible at a moments notice and it's 10 minutes from the farm.

3. Yes, I have handling facilities I built myself and a good automatic squeeze chute. I can't believe people have cattle and no handling facilities. I can load and unload easily as I built it that way to make that part of it.

4. I'm certified to AI but probably will not as I have access to high quality Hereford bulls and Angus bulls. Both are within 10 miles of me and have both told me that I can borrow a bull when needed because of all the free work I have done for them over the last 5 years. What I mean is: I help them very often with their cattle and just about anything else that they need help with with when I can.

5. I have a 2004 Dodge 2500 Cummins (paid for) that I maintain and it pulls great. I have access ti a 24 ft. cattle trailer anytime I want or need it. The farm I lease has a nice tractor and bush-hog that I use to clip the pastures and it worked great last year except when I kept running over giant thorns and flattening tires!

6. Yes, the family that lives on the farm are from Montana and the husband has a degree in vet. medicine and has worked with horses and cattle most of his adult life--he's around 45 yrs. old. They are great people and know livestock and farming.

You have 90% under control go for it. Few people have all those advantages. As long as you don't expect to make any money for a while you are all set.

Yes, you're right about the $ I don't expect to make any for around 3-5 years and probably more around the 5 year mark. It's a tougher decision because I can and do make money running stockers but you have to make such a a big investment upfront all at once with the stockers of course the return is much quicker unless one or more of them die! I want to go cow/calf for many reasons and one of the big ones is my 4 small children that will obviously be getting old enough to learn and help when appropriate. They already love to go to the farm so I want t cultivate that. Also, thinking long term I'd like to hand this off to at least one of my children someday and they would have a good start with an established herd. God willing that won't be for another 25-35 years.

 

[quackingduck]

Hereford certified Anxiety 4th.

Idaman

I'd sure like to see photos and updates.

 

[Idaman]

I agree with the reasons for your decisions and applaud them.

If you can get a copy of the November Stockman Grass Farmer there is an editorial by Alan Nation that would certainly bolster your confidence in what you are doing in going from stockers to mamas.

 

[regenwether]

I'm a fan of hereford's but will be the first to admit to be green as grass to the bloodline's. What are the trait's of Anxiety 4th? How do they differ from today's genetic's?

 

[Idaman]

I applaud all the effort and the noble sentiments; but if these cows get pneumonia, founder, get hoof rot (on some mountain in British Columbia???), and fail to cycle while living the pampered life of a donor cow does this industry really need their genetic multiplied, no matter how rare their bloodline has become???? It sounds like there is a reason they went extinct. It might be best to identify the one that is the best and just clone her.

Our decision to flush all the available cows was made this way. To wait and flush just the best one would take years and the danger of losing some with this small number would have been too great. Each one is absolutely unreplacable.

We have in the somwhat random way of flushing them all have found out some very interesting, at least to us, things.

1. By flushing them all we have quickly found out which ones were the most consistently fertile. One consistently produces 18 embryos others 12 down to one at 2. The highest producers are the first to come in heat after the Lute and show the best standing heats.

2. When we flush in sync. with the recips. and implant fresh the ones that produce the most embryos will have the most implanted. Again a range of from 0-12.

3. Of the implanted embryos which donor will produce the most pregnancies. On a percentage basis that ranges from a low of 66% to a high of 94%.

Now we have learned who is the most fertile, settles to AI the best, produces the most and best embryos, and whose embryos are the most likely to attach and make a pregnancy. Done in this random manner the best will rise to the top on a natural elimination basis.

We will do the low performers for several flushes that have had health problems and then flush their daughters to see if the ones with health problems were affected by those problems.

This is against all conventional wisdom but so what we are developing a uniquely tested herd. They survived the horrible winter where they came from, adjusted for the haul, and vastly different climate, were tested and cleared for ET(each and every one) and are now going through the ET success rate test. Plus they were all born after their dams were at least 11 years of age. What whole herd has been tested in this way?

 

[Black Coos]

I think in the last few years that Herefords have really turned around, prehaps only because of the need of good Hereford bull to make Black Baldies, and I for one are glad to see Herefords in the fields again..Now If the HOMO Black Herefords every get off the ground, then the reds growth might slow down.. but alot of people really seem to hate the idea of Black Herefords...

 

[Black Coos]

I did not mean that a Hereford was soley a good cross on Angus, also tiger stripes, and all the other breed thay cross so well with..