Herd sire breed decisions

[bpwagner115]

Last night I asked if my dad or uncle were planning on going to a local bull sale and he said that they were putting me "in charge" or the bull buying for this year. I took an AI course last fall and since have spent hours "sitting on the can" looking at A.I. stud magazines and surfing this board. As you might imagine this news of being responsible for chosing the next herd sire is REALLY exciting. So my question....

We are running 120 head of commercial cows and finish 85% of them ourselves and sell by the pound either through local salebarn or direct to the packer by the pound. Herd is black and black baldy cows with the exception of 20 purebred angus coming 2nd calvers (no registration papers though). I have mentioned to him the importance of heterosis, but i don't think he gets it or believes in the results.

I mention a hereford bull and he starts cussing about them being slow-maturing, can't ever get them fat, bla bla bla. Not to mention there is the possibility of red calves and anything not black is docked $ 2-3 right off the top at the sale barn. Sickening. My thoughts are....20 purebred angus + hereford bull = F1 replacements!

I am considering simmental as well for strictly terminal use. If I snag a bull that will put serious pounds on calves in the feedlot they will take notice. I mention Simmental and he starts blabbing about not having any hair on their hide.

I could consider a SimAngus or Maine/Simmental/Angus, as the neighbors have an annual sale offers bulls of that type. Am i better off with a purebred Continental to put on pounds than a composite bull?

Anyone have thoughts on these? Is their truth to slow maturing herefords? Lack of hair a problem with the Simmental breed in colder climates? Obviously he has either experience with these problems or heard of someone who did.

Thanks.

 

[ALACOWMAN]

they put you in charge and then complain about your choices i believe id bow out.. never seen a problem with hereford being slower maturing, or keeping condition in my area even in heat and on fescue

 

[Galloways1]

At the risk of some saying I am pimping my breed, I will reply to your post. You say you finish out most of your own cattle, so feed efficiency is important. You want heterosis, on an angus or angus cross influenced herd. I can assume you want to maintain good carcass traits, to get premiums were applicable.

I would suggest Galloway. You will maintain your black hide, no need to worry about no hair. They have no angus in them, so you get tremendous heterosis. They have high marbling, while trimming off excess backfat. Carcass yields are in the low to mid 60%, with most being YG 1s and 2s.

The Galloway will achieve this on less feed per pound of gain than most cattle. The heifer mates are highly sought after as replacements, as they are very maternal and extremely feed efficient.

http://www.blegengalloways.com or http://www.americangalloway.com

 

[ANAZAZI]

There is almost no difference in maturing age or any other important traits between angus and herefords, they are very much alike.A hereford over angus gives about the same results as angus over angus, plus the obvious heterosis benefits both as weaning weights, feeder calves, and as F1 mother cows.
Running 120 cows mean you use three or four bulls; and I am guessing you are replacing only one. If the new one will be a hereford, then put him on the blacks and save your angus bulls for the baldies, this will lower the risk of red calves.
Lack of hair on simmethals is just rediculous. I have a friend who outwinters simmenthals in the mountains just under the tree line; with no problems regarding lack of hair.
I like composites, but not particularly that composite you mention. What other breeds do you consider?

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

Just break the up in groups and breed the groups to different breeds. Then next year you will no which done the best.

 

[dun]

My choice would be a smaller framed homo black simmenthal with decent calving ease but high carcass traits.

 

[Baldie Maker]

I second the simmental bull. I've not seen many Simmentals but never noticed or been told about any hair problems besides rat tails and the breed is way past that. Gateway bulls are really geared towards calving ease, growth, and the final product. jmo

 

[Massey135]

to put on pounds[/b] than a composite

ABSOLUTELY! CHAROLAIS, LIMOSINE, or BLONDE 'D and fullbloods if you can find em. There are high growth individuals in all breeds, but none of the high growth british breeds can compete as far as cutability with the high yielding continentals. Not to mention the hybrid vigor that you won't get with the british on british or with the black continental composites.

Modern pb black limos and gelbviehs tend to be more materal oriented than the char/ limos. ie not as good of terminal option.

 

[Limomike]

I tend to agree with ALACOWMAN, why do they put you in charge of making the decisions then complain about it??
As far as negative comments about Herefords, or Simm.... You are going to hear negatives about almost any breeds. Just take the positives, and go with it. I never have dealt with the Simm breed, but with Herefords, I never had a problem with them being "slow to mature".

 

[CandyMeadowFarms]

Hereford or Charolais. Charolais will pour the pounds on

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

Limousin would be a bit cheaper to feed.

 

[ousoonerfan22]

I agree with Anazazi...... run hereford bulls on your black cows and angus bulls on your black baldie cows.

 

[Massey135]

I agree with Anazazi...... run hereford bulls on your black cows and angus bulls on your black baldie cows.

I thought he was looking for pounds!?

 

[ANAZAZI]

I agree with Anazazi...... run hereford bulls on your black cows and angus bulls on your black baldie cows.

I thought he was looking for pounds!?

His choice must be agreeable to his elders.

 

[double v]

Go Gelbvieh and raise balancers still keeping to the black theme keep some of the heifers and then go hereford giving you a good 3 way cross. :clap: And there are plenty of gelbvieh breeders your way.

 

[Old_man_emu]

At the risk of some saying I am pimping my breed, I will reply to your post. You say you finish out most of your own cattle, so feed efficiency is important. You want heterosis, on an angus or angus cross influenced herd. I can assume you want to maintain good carcass traits, to get premiums were applicable.

I would suggest Galloway. You will maintain your black hide, no need to worry about no hair. They have no angus in them, so you get tremendous heterosis. They have high marbling, while trimming off excess backfat. Carcass yields are in the low to mid 60%, with most being YG 1s and 2s.

The Galloway will achieve this on less feed per pound of gain than most cattle. The heifer mates are highly sought after as replacements, as they are very maternal and extremely feed efficient.
http://www.blegengalloways.com or http://www.americangalloway.com

I agree, and I am not a galloway breeder. Welsh blacks work too! A mate of mine breeds them in Australia and crosses on about 20 angus cows. They make really good
steer and great heifer replacements. They will increase pounds on a carcass and can handle the cold.

I also don't like the fact they have left the decision to but are knocking back all your ideas. Tell them you want to AI the angus to a bull/s of your choice. It's minimising the risk if you don't like the results, you have got a bull sitting around and its only 20 out of 120 calves.

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

Double V :bday:

 

[angusdave63]

tell dad u missed the sav sale

 

[double v]

thanks RBB, but that wasa helpful post i gave but i guess i deserved that.....

 

[ANAZAZI]

thanks RBB, but that wasa helpful post i gave but i guess i deserved that.....

:nod: :lol2: