Herd improvement

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4Dranch

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Hello everyone. Hopefully, I can get some long sought after answers to seemingly simple questions here! Thanks in advance to anyone who shares their knowledge and skill with me here! I'll get right down to it then.

I was born and raised on a working (sort of) 500 acre cattle ranch in Texas. My father, who inherited the place from his father, has no training or knowledge of the cattle industry of any type, excluding a few hard-learned life lessons and what very little knowledge my grandfather passed on to him. Their knowledge and "marketing plan" is this: 1) Buy 20 head of wehatever mixed breed sad looking cow they could afford and likewise with a single bull. 2) let them loose as nature intended in the pasture. 3) keep the heifers, sell the bulls each spring until you reach 200 head. 4) after reaching 200 head, sell all yearlings.

Maybe I'm overcomplicating things a bit in my brain, but it seems to me that getting 200 head of mutt cattle with still only one mutt bull to the whole herd and hauling 150 or so yearlings off to the local sale barn each year is not what trying to make a living in the business should be about. Seems to me that choosing a breed and managing grassland and culling nonproductive cows should be happening, but its not and hasn't been for 50 years. I am 27 years old, and it is beginning to fall to me to make some decisions around the place. I want to move to a full blood herd and keep good records and utilize rotational grazing, and eventually find a better market than the local sale barn for these offspring.

Now, after all that background, my questions:
1) What breed should I go with and why?
2) How do I shift from what I have to what I want? I want to do it all in one fell swoop...sell every head on the place, give the land a year to "rest", use the money from the sale to purchase as many full blood whatever breed as I can and start from there. My father looses all the color in his face and starts shaking when I mention this...he is TERRIFIED of the thought. Suggestions?
3) Where do I go to learn about record keeping, herd and grassland management, and marketing? I have looked and looked online. Granted, I'm no Bill Gates on the computer so maybe I'm just missing it, but it almost seems like a deeply guarded secret (and it would not suprise me if it IS a deeply guarded secret!). I have talked to the local county extension office, but they seem rather unwilling to do more than offer a pamphlet of some sort.


I have a lot more questions, but this is already a large post, and I apoligize for that. Hopefully someone out there feels my pain here and has some insightful solutions for me! thanks!
 
Wow! Sounds like you have a mess! You need to get a Mentor asap! Even 200 cows on 500 acres sound like a major over stocking problem for land north of the metro mess.


I would cull down to your 25 best cows.

Use the cash to buy:

1) Repair or replace fences, cross fence, corrles and work equipment.

2) A new bull and 10 good brangus cows.

Every year buy some quality cows. Take it slow, building a good herd takes time.
 
500 acres and you got 200 cows??? Not a bad starting point!! I am not sure that your plan is NOT the right plan; but I would be hesitant to advocate a whole herd repop either. Replace the bulls with the genetics that you want to market. The cows have grown up on the place and probably are better adapted to that environment than anything you can buy elsewhere.

Do you have cross fences??? IF NOT, if you could divide that place into 4 large ~equal paddocks with water in each one. That would help you manage the grassland a lot better. That is a massive job but once done you can further control what is going on with temporary electric fencing.

Get an ear tag on each cow and record what she does individually. You got a 75% calf crop with very little management. IF you cull out the less fertile cows and get a vaccination program in time I can see that climb.

Improve over time with the best bulls you can find. I like using ANgus bulls for 4 years, Hereford for 4 years, Angus for 4 years, Hereford for 4 years, etc. BUT that MIGHT not be the best fit for YOUR environment. You need to get opinions from YOUR area. Ditch the full blood cows thing. 200 bred heifers @ $1000 a heifer is more money than I would want to spend. A good crossbreeding regimen 9 times out of 10 is going to beat equivalvent fullblood genetics.
 
4Dranch":391xy4jg said:
Hello everyone. Hopefully, I can get some long sought after answers to seemingly simple questions here! Thanks in advance to anyone who shares their knowledge and skill with me here! I'll get right down to it then.

I was born and raised on a working (sort of) 500 acre cattle ranch in Texas. My father, who inherited the place from his father, has no training or knowledge of the cattle industry of any type, excluding a few hard-learned life lessons and what very little knowledge my grandfather passed on to him. Their knowledge and "marketing plan" is this: 1) Buy 20 head of wehatever mixed breed sad looking cow they could afford and likewise with a single bull. 2) let them loose as nature intended in the pasture. 3) keep the heifers, sell the bulls each spring until you reach 200 head. 4) after reaching 200 head, sell all yearlings.

Maybe I'm overcomplicating things a bit in my brain, but it seems to me that getting 200 head of mutt cattle with still only one mutt bull to the whole herd and hauling 150 or so yearlings off to the local sale barn each year is not what trying to make a living in the business should be about. Seems to me that choosing a breed and managing grassland and culling nonproductive cows should be happening, but its not and hasn't been for 50 years. I am 27 years old, and it is beginning to fall to me to make some decisions around the place. I want to move to a full blood herd and keep good records and utilize rotational grazing, and eventually find a better market than the local sale barn for these offspring.

Now, after all that background, my questions:
1) What breed should I go with and why?
2) How do I shift from what I have to what I want? I want to do it all in one fell swoop...sell every head on the place, give the land a year to "rest", use the money from the sale to purchase as many full blood whatever breed as I can and start from there. My father looses all the color in his face and starts shaking when I mention this...he is TERRIFIED of the thought. Suggestions?
3) Where do I go to learn about record keeping, herd and grassland management, and marketing? I have looked and looked online. Granted, I'm no Bill Gates on the computer so maybe I'm just missing it, but it almost seems like a deeply guarded secret (and it would not suprise me if it IS a deeply guarded secret!). I have talked to the local county extension office, but they seem rather unwilling to do more than offer a pamphlet of some sort.


I have a lot more questions, but this is already a large post, and I apoligize for that. Hopefully someone out there feels my pain here and has some insightful solutions for me! thanks!

Are you in the Noble Foundation's area? They work in counties within 100 miles of Ardmore, OK. Here's a link to their site:

http://noble.org/

Just browse the site if you're not in their region. Find the Texas A&M Extension site, I'll put OK State University's Cow-Calf corner link below. Join your local cattlemen's group. Join your state Cattlemen's group (TSCRA). They probably offer online help and seminars to learn.

I can understand why your dad hesitates to sell everything and buying high dollar heifers. :) Management is very important. As Brandonm2 said, get ear tags in the cows so you can measure their performance. Buy GOOD bulls of a breed that you think will improve your herd. I'd suggest Angus, of course. The demand for Angus cattle continues to grow. The Angus database (the basis of EPDs) is the best in the industry. IMO, you'll find more quality Angus bulls available at reasonable prices than any other breed. The AngusSource tag adds value to your calves. But other breeds have similar tags if you don't want to go with Angus. I'll put the link to the Angus Beef Bulletin below, too. It has good info on a regular basis.

Get out and attend some sales. There are Angus bull sales in your area this fall. See what's selling best at your commercial market now, with an eye to other marketing options as you improve your herd. Most breed associations have their magazine online. Read up on their marketing programs. Check into the Texas Ranch to Rail Program. I think your Extension people will have info on that.

Welcome to the board and good luck with your program.

Cow-Calf corner: http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/exten/cc-corner/

Angus Beef Bulletin: http://www.angusbeefbulletin.com/

Angus Assn: http://www.angus.org

Angus Commercial Program info: http://www.angus.org/comm/index.html
 
LonghornRanch, Thanks for your reply! I do feel like I have a mess. I agree that 200 on 500 is pushing the limit, however the land and grass and tanks seem to support it well. We have been topped out at 200 for about 10 years now, and I can see that the grass is not as thick as it used to be, but it certainly is not wasteland either.

Brandonm2, thanks for your insight also! I believe I am in a fairly good position to transition to something a little more professional with the 200 head. To address some of the questions both of you posed:
The place is divided up into 15 relatively equal sized paddocks, each with its own grazing areas, shelter, and freah water supplies. All of the border fences and cross fences are top notch, I see to that and have since I was about 12! I would like to have someone mroe experienced than me look at the layout and see if they have suggestions for improving the grazing rotation I have set up. I use "rotation" lightly; I know there is supposed to be a rotation and I have almost blindly and certianly without any education set up a rotation scheldule. I plant winter wheat in 1/4 of the paddocks, sweet sudan in another 1/4, and coastal bermudagrass in the other half. I have just stated this system about 3 years ago, and can already tell a difference in the quality of the cattle.

Also 3 yrs ago, I was able to afford a purebred black Limousin bull. Not much, but it was certainly a step in the right direction I think.

As far as records, the extent of the records is.......200 head on 500 acres. No vacinations, no age testing, pregnancy testing, only yearly worming. Thats it. I STRONGLY disagree with my father on this, he deems it unnecessary and a waste of money.

Anyways, thanks for your input. Look foward to more!
 
4Dranch":8qwuyynw said:
No vacinations, no age testing, pregnancy testing, only yearly worming. Thats it.

Believe it or not, there are freezer beef customers who are looking for exactly that. Everything "natural". Try to hit that glitch market with them. You will not find 200 customers, but you might get a dozen or two.
 
Yes, I was envisioning more chaos. It sounds like the pasture management plan is more intensive than most of us run.

Genetics really sounds like the weak link. You also need more than one bull to get that calving season tighter.

Are you castrating? You are deworming. It would not be too hard to set up a decent (if not perfect) whole herd vaccination plan for when you have those cows up for the worming. I don't like direct one on one conflict if I can avoid it when I need a good relationship with the person; but I still intend to get my way. How knowledgable are you about what goes on in the area??? You CAN twist current events to create a panic and use that 'crisis' too implement your plan. IF you find a couple of calves dead in the field, declare it to be evidence that the herd is breaking with Blackleg or BVD type II or IBR (whatever story is most plausible in your local area) and things are about to get real bad and rush down and implement your vaccination program. If nothing bad happens after that declare OUR plan a success; but now we will have to keep it up since the herd has been exposed. If you read about rustlers in your greater area, announce that we need to be able to identfy all of the cows with ear tags so that we can identify them when/if the rustlers take them to the yard. Once you have your ear tags in place, you can independently launch your record keeping program.
 

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