GoWyo
Well-known member
Maybe Rampage was aptly named . . .
Heifer mauling new born calves ? Injured new born
- Thread starter Richnm
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Dsth
Well-known member
I have noticed that in my small herd as well. the last two times that I have had an orphan calf, a close blood relative or daughter of the dam ends up caring for it.
Lucky_P
Well-known member
Back 10-15 years ago, there were some family lines of Angus that were reputed to have problems with the occasional 'calf-killer' cows/heifers. One sire, in particular, that I often saw incriminated as having daughters over-represented in that category was BAR EXT Traveler 205, AAA#12452829.
I didn't see that bull close-up in the pedigree of this heifer (Though EXT and Traveler 5204, both noted for siring some 'heat' are in the woodpile), but there may be other 'culprits' in the breed, or imbalanced hormones or other factors that would cause a heifer or cow to want to kill their newborn calf.
We only ever had one cow that just absolutely would not take her own calf(except for some that rejected one of a set of twins)... she didn't try to physically kill it, but would jump out of or crash through any fence to get away from it. Running her up in the chute twice a day for the calf to nurse just never got her past whatever her problem was... but she took a ride to town once another cow lost a calf and was amenable to taking on hers.
I didn't see that bull close-up in the pedigree of this heifer (Though EXT and Traveler 5204, both noted for siring some 'heat' are in the woodpile), but there may be other 'culprits' in the breed, or imbalanced hormones or other factors that would cause a heifer or cow to want to kill their newborn calf.
We only ever had one cow that just absolutely would not take her own calf(except for some that rejected one of a set of twins)... she didn't try to physically kill it, but would jump out of or crash through any fence to get away from it. Running her up in the chute twice a day for the calf to nurse just never got her past whatever her problem was... but she took a ride to town once another cow lost a calf and was amenable to taking on hers.
faster horses
Well-known member
We used Traveler 5204 back in the day. We saw the attitudes of the heifers after they calved and we got rid of them. All of them.
We used sons of EXT that were gentle. The heifer calves out of him, not so much. They didn't get past the weaning stage. At our place cattle have every reason to be gentle because Mr. FH believes in 'not much dust' though he is firm in what he asks them to do. You couldn't handle them as weanling heifer calves. He didn't know what cows were bred to the EXT sons, but I did because I am the one who kept track. He sorted and I helped. I didn't say a word. When he got done, ALL the daughters of the EXT sons were in the sell pen. Just as their attitude showed.
We had a ma and pa outfit and there was no room for unruly cattle.
We ran into disposition problems with PaPa Forte daughters as well.
We AI'd a good cow to Traveler 23-4. We wanted to keep a heifer bull out of her because 23-4 was noted for siring good heifer bulls.
She had a good one. When we cut him off the cow to take him in to be weighed (for our own benefit), he took Mr FH. There was no excuse for that.
This was all before docility EPD's.
We used sons of EXT that were gentle. The heifer calves out of him, not so much. They didn't get past the weaning stage. At our place cattle have every reason to be gentle because Mr. FH believes in 'not much dust' though he is firm in what he asks them to do. You couldn't handle them as weanling heifer calves. He didn't know what cows were bred to the EXT sons, but I did because I am the one who kept track. He sorted and I helped. I didn't say a word. When he got done, ALL the daughters of the EXT sons were in the sell pen. Just as their attitude showed.
We had a ma and pa outfit and there was no room for unruly cattle.
We ran into disposition problems with PaPa Forte daughters as well.
We AI'd a good cow to Traveler 23-4. We wanted to keep a heifer bull out of her because 23-4 was noted for siring good heifer bulls.
She had a good one. When we cut him off the cow to take him in to be weighed (for our own benefit), he took Mr FH. There was no excuse for that.
This was all before docility EPD's.
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Travlr
Well-known member
Back in the 80's there was a high powered Limo that threw great calves... but the next generation were bad actors. The docility issues skipped a generation.
Richnm
Well-known member
I have a Saguhatchee granddaughter that will clave in the next week. Let's see how she does. I will be close when she does.
coachg
Well-known member
I have a Rampage son ; he's not a pet but he's not crazy either. 20 + calves out of him and I'm keeping 5 of his daughters. Nothing out of the ordinary so far . Will be another year before they breed and calve. To be continued…… 
Woah!!!! Only bull we've ever had with attitude - as in, he tried to take out Mr TC - was Traveler lineage. Only 3 years old, sold him to a ranch in OK that does everything on horseback & with dogs. They knew he was HOT but wanted the EPD's. Dang bull tried to take out a couple of the horses, but they kept him until he was 8 and didn't pass his BSE. BTW, I retained 3 of his heifers and they have been awesome, completely docile, going on 7 years old.
I've only had one heifer get testy with her calf and she snapped out of it. But I did have an older cow try to kill one of her twins and luckily, I was there to intervene - and subsequently acquire a bottle calf.
I've only had one heifer get testy with her calf and she snapped out of it. But I did have an older cow try to kill one of her twins and luckily, I was there to intervene - and subsequently acquire a bottle calf.
Nature vs. nurture/environment.I have a Rampage son ; he's not a pet but he's not crazy either. 20 + calves out of him and I'm keeping 5 of his daughters. Nothing out of the ordinary so far . Will be another year before they breed and calve. To be continued……
faster horses
Well-known member
I looked online and EXT has Emulation 31 twice in his pedigree.
Emulation 31 was CRAZY.
Emulation 31 was CRAZY.
TexasJerseyMilker
Well-known member
It is interesting that the Spanish selectively breed fighting bulls. They test the cows for aggression too. I wonder if they have a problem with aggression to calves.
Bingo! Works 99 %
As a short term answer give the cow 1/4 cc of rompun, let her sit alone for 30 minutes, when she gets drowsy let the calf suck. If she is really high headed may take a little more than a quarter cc but not much. As a long term answer mark the cow somehow and make sure she isn't there the next year
Ebenezer
Well-known member
Just don't tell anyone. Those are all great foundation sires of the breed! Apparently the Angus motto is "let every generation learn their own hard lessons".
faster horses
Well-known member
A good stockman friend of ours swears by using Oxytocin along with Rompum. Oxytocin makes them let down their milk.
Oxytocin is a hormone produced in the brains of all male and female mammals and plays an important role in milk letdown, the contraction of the smooth uterine muscles during the birthing process, and various maternal behaviors.
Oxytocin is a hormone produced in the brains of all male and female mammals and plays an important role in milk letdown, the contraction of the smooth uterine muscles during the birthing process, and various maternal behaviors.
TexasJerseyMilker
Well-known member
<< I wished I had a bottle of Oxy back when I used to share milk this cow.
She can hold up or turn milk off like a faucet because she knew the calf was on next. Oxytocin is also known as the love hormone. After love making it causes people to snuggle. Maybe an Oxy shot would would also make the cow see her calf in a different light
She can hold up or turn milk off like a faucet because she knew the calf was on next. Oxytocin is also known as the love hormone. After love making it causes people to snuggle. Maybe an Oxy shot would would also make the cow see her calf in a different light
Lucky_P
Well-known member
FH... I bought a cane of Gardens Wave, years back, when he was 'new'... knew that docility could potentially be an issue, as he had 2 shots of EXT close up, and his sire, Highmark, was noted for siring hot disposition. He didn't have a DOC epd yet... but it originally came out at -23... after I'd already inseminated a group of cows to him... I was concerned, to say the least. But, the steers were no worse than any other Angus-sired calves, and they were leaving anyway. Got 3 heifers, and only one ever showed anything that would make you raise an eyebrow... she was mostly just a bit flighty in the pen... the other two were deadhead, sweetheart cows. Wished I'd used that bull more for what he brought to the table. (Ribeye, Marbling, Tenderness, high +$EN)
Sell the cow asap and get the calf to some one who raises bottle calves and walk away.
Nesikep
Well-known member
Here's the calf I mentioned earlier getting adopted by his sister.. she's an exceptional cow, her calves are always SPOTLESS
Same cow a few years later, Her calf was nursing and she's licking her sisters calf.. Anyone in front of her is getting a wash (myself included quite often)
This was the orphaned calf at about 6 months.. looked like all the rest
Richnm
Well-known member
Can't give her away it's a POSS Deadwood calf she should be worth some money. I doubt I will sell her now. She runs to me every time I check on her like I am her 3rd mom. I will just use this as a perfect opportunity to teach my young children (twins 6 years olds) to raise a calf and after school responsibilities.
