Heifer calves out of younger bull .

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coachg

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I'm sure someone has asked this before but I couldn't find it in the archives. Are you more likely to get bull calves or heifers out of younger more aggressive breeders ? Retired our old man for a younger bull 4-5 of our fall calves are heifers. I know it can turn around in a hurry but 3-4 of the cows that had heifers always have Bulls. coachg
 
theoretically no difference, from antidotes cows bred earlier in standing heat have higher % of females than bred late in standing heat.... no data to back it up.... so not worth much
 
That's what I had always heard, we have black angus and are trying to build our #'s . So we are happy to get the heifers ! Didn't mind all those Bulls from our old man . Sure helped pay for the cows . coachg
 
When I was breeding cows as a relief tech the reg tech told me that the sooner a female is bred while coming into heat the more often a heifer calf. Reason, and I heard this from some friends that had 3 sons and were desperately trying for a daughter and their human doctor told them this; the egg has farther to travel when it is first released obviously, and the female carrying sperm are usually able to outlive the male carrying sperm. Also the fluids in the repo tract will change composition and the earlier fluids are more favorable to the female carrying sperm than the later in the heat fluid is more favorable to the male and they don't have as far to travel because the egg is further along in the tract. I can't remember if the fluid starts out more alkaline and changes to acid or the other way around.
One of the vets on here or repro experts can probably explain it better.... but I have found that it seems to be about right that when I breed an animal AI that if I get her early in her heat that she more often has a heifer calf. Although here the past 3 years we have been running 75% overall heifer calves so don't know if that is because the bulls are catching them sooner or if there are other factors at work.
By the way, those friends years ago did what the doctor told them, and they did have a girl for their 4th child.
 
I am a firm believer that the early bred AI does produce more heifer calves - but - you are also lowering your chance of conception. Some times the male & female sperm arrive with no egg "in sight" LOL
I was explained by an embryologist science research team doing early work on sexing semen -
The male sperm is more slender and swims faster than the fatter slower female sperm. The male sperm arrives and the egg has not been released. They die off, then the lazy fat females (no pun intended) arrive and the egg is waiting to be fertilized. But, if bred TOO early, they all arrive before the egg is released. What is too early??? that depends on each individual cow and her length of heat cycle. And, I don't know if the length of "hot heat" that we observe is indicative to the length of her release of egg.
 
can anyone explain why there is always that cow that you would really like to have a heifer out of that always has bulls....
I have one now.....just presented me with fifth or sixth bull even though we have had long talks while I scratch her back, about how nice it would be to have a pretty little heifer this time.....nother bull last week. I think I might even raise this one as a bull...he is pretty nice and growing well.
 
pdfangus":3vmm0kz2 said:
can anyone explain why there is always that cow that you would really like to have a heifer out of that always has bulls....
I have one now.....just presented me with fifth or sixth bull even though we have had long talks while I scratch her back, about how nice it would be to have a pretty little heifer this time.....nother bull last week. I think I might even raise this one as a bull...he is pretty nice and growing well.
She's facing the wrong direction when she's bred.
 
I like that Dun, my dear ole Grandma once said the bull put the sperm in backwards when our ole cow had a breech birth.
 
"Supposedly" male sperm & female sperm survive better in different PH environments. I think some cows just have a high or low PH which influences the sex. I once was told to add vinegar to their water - but I don't know if it was for more heifers or for more bulls??? LOL
 
We are up to 6 out of 7 heifer calves. My old # 75 dropped the best heifer of the bunch this morning.
 
pdfangus":1rwgfgub said:
Can anyone explain why there is always that cow that you would really like to have a heifer out of that always has bulls...
Jeanne - Simmi Valley":1rwgfgub said:
I think some cows just have a high or low PH which influences the sex.
:nod:
I think the cow has a say in determining the sex too.
But in a 50:50 circumstance, just like flipping a coin, a streak of 6 or 8 in row is rare but not an unrealistic expectation.
Just frustrating when you're on the wrong side of the flip.


p.s.
Cleveland Indians just set a new American League record with 22 wins in a row.
 
Two more today ,another heifer for 6 in a row and then a bull calf out of my grand daughters cow. Was pulling for a heifer for her but Paw Paw might trade with her ! 9 on the ground, 7 heifers and 2 Bulls.
 
dun":1e1kvosy said:
pdfangus":1e1kvosy said:
can anyone explain why there is always that cow that you would really like to have a heifer out of that always has bulls....
I have one now.....just presented me with fifth or sixth bull even though we have had long talks while I scratch her back, about how nice it would be to have a pretty little heifer this time.....nother bull last week. I think I might even raise this one as a bull...he is pretty nice and growing well.
She's facing the wrong direction when she's bred.

I actually got to pondering over this and Contacted Dr. Bill Beal the Repro Specialist at Va Tech. asked him if there was anything I could do to change the outcome...

he suggested sexed semen...

I decided to try it and looked up the select sires sexed semen bulls and ordered five units of

7AN426
SAC Conversation
Breed: Angus
Registration Number: 17808532 (AMF-NHF)
Tattoo: JS02
Born: 11/12/2013
Pedigree: BT Crossover 758N
Silveiras Conversion 8064
EXG Saras Dream S609 R3

SAV 004 Predominant 4438
Laflins Farrah 0252
Laflins Farrah 7215
From: Schermer Angus, IA; Silveira Bros, CA and The Conversation Group
Birth Weight (BW): 76
Birth Weight Ratio: 95
Weaning Weight (WW): 888
Weaning Weight Ratio: 124
Yearling Weight (YW): 1502
Yearling Weight Ratio: 117
Yearling Scrotal (SC): 41 cm
Yearling Frame: 6.1
Canada Eligible: No
 
I like how we can attempt to find "scientific" answers to the randomness of life.

If you flip a coin and the first 99 times it comes up heads, what are the odds that the next one will be heads too? 50%
 
Well that coin is landing on tails the last 3-4 have been Bulls ; count now stands 7 heifers and 5 Bulls . What I like the most is 12 calves in 16 days !
 
If you are like me, then the sexed semen may not work. I am the perfect example of murphy's law when it comes to sexed semen. Since it is supposed to be 90+% accurate according to some; and others say 95%.... I decided that I would breed the one jersey I kept getting bull calves out of with the sexed semen for a heifer. Her very first calf was a heifer, drowned in the creek, then 3 bulls. So we bred her with the sexed semen.....bull #4 ...okay, next year, sexed semen bull #5, okay try again, next year, sexed semen, BULL # 6....I said just forget it, used regular semen and FINALLY GOT A LIVE HEIFER....It turned out to be her last calf as she aborted twice after that to regular semen and then got mastitis problems and her age was against her so she went. Am breeding her heifer now so will hope for a heifer, but I used regular semen.
That wasn't all, I had another 1/2 jersey/holstein that had 3 consecutive bull calves with sexed semen so finally used regular and got a bull then a heifer the next time...same bull used both years. It is kinda a joke that if I want a bull calf to use sexed semen. These 2 cows were both on dairies (different farms) and it wasn't me doing the breeding. But both of these farmers use sexed semen on their own cows to some degree and do get about 85-90 % heifers....

Now if I could get some sexed BULL semen to use on our beef cows since we have been running 75% heifer calves for the past 2 1/2 or 3 years........maybe I should try the "normal" sexed for female semen...with my luck I would get the 10% bull calf out of each straw.... HaHa
 
We do have one angus bull that does throw about 75% bull calves, but the others have been making up for it with heifers. This bull has been with us a long time and has always thrown predominantly bull calves all his life. Nice calves too....
 
pdfangus":1pwetauz said:
dun":1pwetauz said:
pdfangus":1pwetauz said:
can anyone explain why there is always that cow that you would really like to have a heifer out of that always has bulls....
I have one now.....just presented me with fifth or sixth bull even though we have had long talks while I scratch her back, about how nice it would be to have a pretty little heifer this time.....nother bull last week. I think I might even raise this one as a bull...he is pretty nice and growing well.
She's facing the wrong direction when she's bred.

I actually got to pondering over this and Contacted Dr. Bill Beal the Repro Specialist at Va Tech. asked him if there was anything I could do to change the outcome...

he suggested sexed semen...

I decided to try it and looked up the select sires sexed semen bulls and ordered five units of

7AN426
SAC Conversation
Breed: Angus
Registration Number: 17808532 (AMF-NHF)
Tattoo: JS02
Born: 11/12/2013
Pedigree: BT Crossover 758N
Silveiras Conversion 8064
EXG Saras Dream S609 R3

SAV 004 Predominant 4438
Laflins Farrah 0252
Laflins Farrah 7215
From: Schermer Angus, IA; Silveira Bros, CA and The Conversation Group
Birth Weight (BW): 76
Birth Weight Ratio: 95
Weaning Weight (WW): 888
Weaning Weight Ratio: 124
Yearling Weight (YW): 1502
Yearling Weight Ratio: 117
Yearling Scrotal (SC): 41 cm
Yearling Frame: 6.1
Canada Eligible: No

Tried Conversation on 2 cows for Nov 2016 calves... both heifers; went ahead and tried him on a heifer in 2016, she also had a heifer calf last week. All Conventional semen. Your sexed semen should be REAL heifer heavy??
 
I have long thought that in cases like this, there is something in the cow that influences which gender gets through.

when i first started my own herd back in the mid 80's I bought three heifers. one of them had a bull every year and she paid the bills....sold almost every bull from her for a decent price. the other two had a normal mix of heifers and bulls....really wanted a heifer out of Betty but never got one...sold about a dozen bulls from her though...
 

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