Genex Red Angus Bulls??

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PATB

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I have a freind who has started a registered red angus herd and was looking for suggestion of which Genex red angus bulls to use on heifers? He was looking at the balanced epd approach with a strong emphasis on calving ease. The bull he bought to breed heifers with turned out to be problem calfer 9 pulls out of 10 heifers. Any and all Suggestion of Genex red angus bulls welcome.
 

dun

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We used Chateau and Browns Vacation this year, but they're not heifer bulls. The best heifer bull we have found is from ABS, Basin 79E. Calves just squirt out and they grade very well. We haven't retained any heifers from him yet, all bulls or twins, but we have 3 heifers bred to him this year, hoping for at least 1 heifer preferably 2.
We used Buster from Genex, not impressed, and BC Hobo from ABS, as weanlings you want to knock them in the head and bury them where nobody will see them. As yearlings they are really nice, as 2 year olds they are really great, not to shaby as 3 year olds either.

dun


PATB":eitja0mt said:
I have a freind who has started a registered red angus herd and was looking for suggestion of which Genex red angus bulls to use on heifers? He was looking at the balanced epd approach with a strong emphasis on calving ease. The bull he bought to breed heifers with turned out to be problem calfer 9 pulls out of 10 heifers. Any and all Suggestion of Genex red angus bulls welcome.
 
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PATB

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Thanx Dun

This will be the first experience with AI for this guy. The only AI tech is a Genex rep in our area so that means Genex semen. I think he might use Glacier Chateau since another red angus breeder has used him and had good luck. Red angus breeders please feel free to respond for this plea for help.
 

dun

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We used Chateau on one heifer but she is a big extremely well grown out girl. She's not due till the end of the month.
My neighbor used to be the Genex rep and he breeds Red Angus. He is very high on Rambler but I didn't care for his carcass numbers.


dun


PATB":1g0oowhz said:
Thanx Dun

This will be the first experience with AI for this guy. The only AI tech is a Genex rep in our area so that means Genex semen. I think he might use Glacier Chateau since another red angus breeder has used him and had good luck. Red angus breeders please feel free to respond for this plea for help.
 

Tod Dague

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I would use BROWN VACATION over CHATEAU. Chateau is breed average for calving ease but Vacation is in the top 15 % of the breed with an 8.3 for CED. I only use bulls with a 6 or greater on heifers.

Tod
 

dun

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Vacation is a little light on milk if heifers are to be retained. That was my only concern with him.
The one cow we used him on we don't intend to keep any heifers from. With our luck that's all she'll ever have.

dun

Tod Dague":g2dfa9wp said:
I would use BROWN VACATION over CHATEAU. Chateau is breed average for calving ease but Vacation is in the top 15 % of the breed with an 8.3 for CED. I only use bulls with a 6 or greater on heifers.

Tod
 
A

Anonymous

You have to go to abs to get the best calving ease red bulls. None of the genex calving ease bulls suite me. Vacation way too rough shouldered and chateau progeny also break behind the shoulder which shows they dont have enough chest floor.
 
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PATB

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Genex is the only game in town. I do not think there is an ABS rep in the State of Maine. He is stuck with what he can get from Genex for bulls. It is a matter what would make the best heifer bull out what is available. The heifers will be retained for replacements and herd building.
 

Oldtimer

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PATB":27qpy3sg said:
Genex is the only game in town. I do not think there is an ABS rep in the State of Maine. He is stuck with what he can get from Genex for bulls. It is a matter what would make the best heifer bull out what is available. The heifers will be retained for replacements and herd building.

PATB- After looking over Genex's options for red angus, if it was my heifers I'd probably go with Dynamics- Has a minus 4.5 BW with over 90% accuracy- medium framed- pretty even on all his other epd's - little light on YW. But he looks like the best bet Genex has for putting live calves on the ground and still having some decent calves. Except you have to remember the older I get, the more I lean toward calving ease as being the most important trait.
 

dun

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If you're looking at balanced EPDs, his carcass numbers suck. That's the reason we haven't used him

dun

Oldtimer":3anrq6o7 said:
PATB":3anrq6o7 said:
Genex is the only game in town. I do not think there is an ABS rep in the State of Maine. He is stuck with what he can get from Genex for bulls. It is a matter what would make the best heifer bull out what is available. The heifers will be retained for replacements and herd building.

PATB- After looking over Genex's options for red angus, if it was my heifers I'd probably go with Dynamics- Has a minus 4.5 BW with over 90% accuracy- medium framed- pretty even on all his other epd's - little light on YW. But he looks like the best bet Genex has for putting live calves on the ground and still having some decent calves. Except you have to remember the older I get, the more I lean toward calving ease as being the most important trait.
 
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PATB

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I think some of the young sires might be the best bet for balanced EPD's. You are taking a higher risk on calving problems. Genex needs a little more work on their red angus lineup.

pat
 

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PATB":gaivepxg said:
I think some of the young sires might be the best bet for balanced EPD's. You are taking a higher risk on calving problems. Genex needs a little more work on their red angus lineup.

pat

PATB- I agree with you that many of the younger sires have better balance- but after watching a few heifer calving wrecks with untested bulls, I'd still go with the proven low birthweight. I have always thought that with red angus you should go with a minus 1 or 2 or greater for birthweight epd on heifers, where with blacks I might go as high as + 1 or 2. Also agree that Genex doesn't have a good selection for heifer bulls. The only other proven low BW EPD bull I saw was a 7.5 frame bull.

But remember- this is my way of operation- cows and heifers calve on the prairie.
 
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PATB

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We turn some heifers out to pasture with a bull last spring that we thought we had AI'd. The heifers came back in and got bred to a bull that is turning out to be a hard calver. I had to pull 2 calves yesterday both sets are doing fine. The calves have too much hip and the wrong shape to the head/shoulder region. The only problem is that I have 3 more heifers to go plus 14 cows bred to this bull. I knew I was having too long of a streak with out problems. I wish everyone an easy and challenge free calving season.
 
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Anonymous

Dun & others --- this discussion has interested me, and I'd like to ask a few questions if I may. I've never paid much attention to many of the EPD figures due to the type of little operation I have, so these may be stupid questions and/or observations. I know a lot of times you folks select certain bulls for matings with certain cows to try to improve or correct on specific traits and physiology --- but let's say on a superficial basis if I'm just looking at the EPD figures for the Genex possible "heifer bulls" other than Chateau, Dynamics and Vacation:

Would you exclude "Make My Day" mainly because of lousy ribeye figures and despite what appears to be very good marbling figure? Or because his WW and YW are a tad low even for a heifer bull? And he has low "Stayability"? I never have seen Stayability EPD discussed much, so maybe you guys place little importance on it?


And JR 105 might be a heifer bull as to birth weight EPD but he has poor milk and total maternal, lower growth and stayability along with poor carcass? Were it not for low birthweight EPD why would anybody even consider using him?

Thanks for any thoughts you care to share.. Arnold Ziffle
 

dun

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I'll look over my cut lists and see if I can figure out what particular cirteria was used to eliminate particular bulls

dun




Anonymous":2akvjqmy said:
Dun & others --- this discussion has interested me, and I'd like to ask a few questions if I may. I've never paid much attention to many of the EPD figures due to the type of little operation I have, so these may be stupid questions and/or observations. I know a lot of times you folks select certain bulls for matings with certain cows to try to improve or correct on specific traits and physiology --- but let's say on a superficial basis if I'm just looking at the EPD figures for the Genex possible "heifer bulls" other than Chateau, Dynamics and Vacation:

Would you exclude "Make My Day" mainly because of lousy ribeye figures and despite what appears to be very good marbling figure? Or because his WW and YW are a tad low even for a heifer bull? And he has low "Stayability"? I never have seen Stayability EPD discussed much, so maybe you guys place little importance on it?


And JR 105 might be a heifer bull as to birth weight EPD but he has poor milk and total maternal, lower growth and stayability along with poor carcass? Were it not for low birthweight EPD why would anybody even consider using him?

Thanks for any thoughts you care to share.. Arnold Ziffle
 

dun

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Some bulls make the cut or miss the cut based on a combination of traits.
105's calving ease is just barely better theb breed average, for heifers I want a much better calving ease number, plus based on his evaluations, to much height, poorfeet and large teats. That pretty much eliminates him from using him for anything. MMD misses becauseo f his calving ease, height, CETM is a big killer and muscle. That makes him a throw away as far as I'm concerned.
For heifers I want CED of at least double the breed average, that usually puts them in the minus 3-5 range for BW.
If there is no way I would keep a heifer out of a particular cow I would use Cherokee Canyon again. We're really impressed by the growth, calving ease adn the vigor of the new born calves. We'll find out about carcass in a couple of months when all of his calves from last year get slaughtered, both bulls and heifers.
We're willing to give up a little in milk and some other maternal type traits if the bull has really impressive carcass AND calving ease. We're willing to give up some weight o get better carcass as long as the calving ease is there. The deal for us is, there are bulls that will provide a well balanced calf and provide the required calving ease. It all depends on what is needed, what is planned to be done with the calves, but for heifers, calving ease (CED) is paramount.
Stayability is important but unless we really plan on keeping heifers it's pretty much a moot point.
We also have available Select Sires, Genex and ABS, so we have a really good selection of bulls to choose from.
We have one Millenium daughter. Definitely not a heifer bull, but boy does she calf easy, and unfortunetly milks way too heavy. The standard joke before we wean her calf is that she's a solid red Holstein. That's the kind of body condition she carries. But she breeds back first service and after weaning she'll gain 50-75 pounds in a matter of a couple of weeks. Darn nice cow, but not an easy keeper.
Sorry, done babbling now

dun

dun




Anonymous":1hm69gt2 said:
Dun & others --- this discussion has interested me, and I'd like to ask a few questions if I may. I've never paid much attention to many of the EPD figures due to the type of little operation I have, so these may be stupid questions and/or observations. I know a lot of times you folks select certain bulls for matings with certain cows to try to improve or correct on specific traits and physiology --- but let's say on a superficial basis if I'm just looking at the EPD figures for the Genex possible "heifer bulls" other than Chateau, Dynamics and Vacation:

Would you exclude "Make My Day" mainly because of lousy ribeye figures and despite what appears to be very good marbling figure? Or because his WW and YW are a tad low even for a heifer bull? And he has low "Stayability"? I never have seen Stayability EPD discussed much, so maybe you guys place little importance on it?


And JR 105 might be a heifer bull as to birth weight EPD but he has poor milk and total maternal, lower growth and stayability along with poor carcass? Were it not for low birthweight EPD why would anybody even consider using him?

Thanks for any thoughts you care to share.. Arnold Ziffle
 

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