xbred
Well-known member
is there a generic cydectin on the market?
generic cydectin
- Thread starter xbred
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Lucky_P
Well-known member
I don't know of one, but some recent unbiasedstudies comparing the generic ivermectin formulations against the name brand product showed that they didn't perform. Even though they had the appropriate measurable amount of 'ivermectin' in them, efficacy - as measured by decreased worm egg counts was, in some cases, worse than for control calves that weren't even dewormed. Source(China, for instance) of the raw product may have more influence on efficacy than folks had thought...
I'll keep on buying the 'real thing', thank you. So what if you save a few cents per dose - if it doesn't kill the worms, you've wasted your money AND lost performance on the cattle.
I'll keep on buying the 'real thing', thank you. So what if you save a few cents per dose - if it doesn't kill the worms, you've wasted your money AND lost performance on the cattle.
Lucky_P
Well-known member
You did, or had fecal egg counts performed?
Otherwise, how do you know the cows don't have worms - or that the ivermectin product removed them, if they had them?
Just wondering.
The study I referred to looked at the effect name-brand and generic ivermectin products had on reducing fecal egg counts, comparing before/after and non-dewormed control animals.
For the most part, I'm not convinced that deworming most cattle older than 1st-calf heifers is economically worthwhile.
Otherwise, how do you know the cows don't have worms - or that the ivermectin product removed them, if they had them?
Just wondering.
The study I referred to looked at the effect name-brand and generic ivermectin products had on reducing fecal egg counts, comparing before/after and non-dewormed control animals.
For the most part, I'm not convinced that deworming most cattle older than 1st-calf heifers is economically worthwhile.
Lucky_P":301rvsol said:
I check random fecal's looking out for Coccidiosis - been a problem on my place for years - kinda manage that with Bovatec tubs. Never any other parasites found. That said - I've never really had worms other than Cocci so who knows? Perhaps I wouldn't have worms even if I didn't worm? Good question.
I know for sure it (the generic stuff) helped a TON with flies this summer. I put out IGR tubs but the flies still seemed to be building this past summer anyway and I started having some pinkeye so I bought the cheap Ivomec just to check - ran them through and within 2 days the flies were nearly eliminated for the rest of the season.
Your point though has be wondering about just worming once a year in July when the flies come out . . . .
Lucky_P
Well-known member
The generics met the appropriate chemical analysis for content of ivermectin - but the efficacy was not there.
Rainplace
Member
Lucky, is that study on-line, and if so, would you post a link. If not, can you tell me where you read it? We use a generic brand.
Lucky_P
Well-known member
Can't put my hands on it at the moment, but will see if I can locate it.
In the meantime, look here: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/ar ... 1797000228
The linked article above was not an ivermectin study, but the findings and conclusions, especially regarding lack of efficacy of some products coming from 'international suppliers', were similar to those that Yazwinski, et.al., observed in their trial.
In the meantime, look here: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/ar ... 1797000228
The linked article above was not an ivermectin study, but the findings and conclusions, especially regarding lack of efficacy of some products coming from 'international suppliers', were similar to those that Yazwinski, et.al., observed in their trial.
Lucky_P
Well-known member
T.A. Yazwinski, et al. A Field Trial Evaluation of Several Commercial Ivermectin Pour-On Products in Cattle.
Arkansas Cattle Business.20(9):44-46, 2004.
http://www.springerlink.com/content/211850mp2h60x373/
Not sure 'who' funded the study, and I understand what you're hinting at. Even if it were funded by a company with a competing product, facts is facts and a properly-designed research protocol at a university has to pass examination by an IACUC for validity, and then pass peer-review for publication. If there were any attempt to monkey with the results/data by the funding entity, it shouldn't make it past those hurdles for publication.
I know, folks want to say, "Well, Ft. Dodge(or Merial, or Rhone-Poulenc, etc.) funded that study, so you can't really believe the results." It ain't necessarily so.
Dr. Yazwinski has a nice video on parasites in cattle - http://vimeo.com/11107393 - I've not yet had a chance to sit through the whole thing, but it's only about a half-hour long. Starts talking about the generics around 19:30, then goes on to comparisons between specific wormers. Well worth watching.
Arkansas Cattle Business.20(9):44-46, 2004.
http://www.springerlink.com/content/211850mp2h60x373/
Not sure 'who' funded the study, and I understand what you're hinting at. Even if it were funded by a company with a competing product, facts is facts and a properly-designed research protocol at a university has to pass examination by an IACUC for validity, and then pass peer-review for publication. If there were any attempt to monkey with the results/data by the funding entity, it shouldn't make it past those hurdles for publication.
I know, folks want to say, "Well, Ft. Dodge(or Merial, or Rhone-Poulenc, etc.) funded that study, so you can't really believe the results." It ain't necessarily so.
Dr. Yazwinski has a nice video on parasites in cattle - http://vimeo.com/11107393 - I've not yet had a chance to sit through the whole thing, but it's only about a half-hour long. Starts talking about the generics around 19:30, then goes on to comparisons between specific wormers. Well worth watching.
Rainplace
Member
The springerlink introduction states that worm load isn't necessarily reflected by egg count, which they admit is the shortcoming of the study. I had no idea. I hate when I can't access an entire paper! Thanks for the link. I'll take a look at the video tomorrow since I'll have a day off.
Rainplace
Member
Excellent video! I had no idea pour on wormers were so much less effective. I tried finding out who the private funders were for Dr. Tom Yazwinski, but couldn't find anything. Their studies certainly suggest that generics aren't worth anything.
Rainplace":spkqp13g said:
This is what's perplexing me - they clearly work on my place (for flies) and, at least, for parasite control. How is that possible to have some a scientific study that is so easily contradicted? I suppose that's true of all science though.
Rainplace
Member
angus9259":33pzrcab said:
In the video he says they are the only university that killed all their subjects. He's contending that fecal samples can only look at egg count and egg count does not tell you worm count. It was only through killing the cattle and going through their intestines that they were able to determine how many worms actually survived the application. At least that's how I understood it. I wish I had access to the entire paper so I could look at how many cattle were in their study. The video is worth the 30 minutes to look at.
