Galloway females-advice/comments please!

[gallowaygirl]

I am considering some of these females at an upcoming online auction, but would like everyone's idea as to which females they really like. We are looking in the 2003-2007 age range, but an '02 or '01 may be OK as well. I have a few I particularly like, but will wait for some comments before posting. Anyways, here's the link: http://ladywells.ca/Pages/White_Cows.html

Criticism or especially-disliked females can also be mentioned, as I am trying to narrow down my list of "maybes." Thanks to everyone in advance!

 

[bigbull338]

those are some nice looking cows.an they appear to have good udders an teats.just set a price your willing to give for them.an dont go over it.

 

[3waycross]

Well I spent 30 min looking for one I didn't like. Seriously those are some real good cattle. The few that are not desirable are mostly cuz they are just kinda old. I agree with Bigbull set your price and buy what you can afford. You may have to end up sorting them by pedigree. Phenatypically they are all pretty good lookin.

 

[Willow Springs]

They are a pretty good set of cattle. Two things that I would suggest. Look up there production history on the Canadian Livestock Records website; the Canadian (and American??) Galloway associations register here. This should give you an idea of whether or not they have been raising replacment quality calves and if the bulls were being sold for breeding. Maybe you already know that if you are raising Galloway cattle, which by your name I assume you are.
Secondly try and have someone look at them for you (or look at them yourself if you live close enough); they are staying on the farm and not being trucked anywhere for a sale. As you know a picture doesn't really tell you enough to make any major purchases.

 

[gallowaygirl]

Yes, I really like that way the majority of their cattle are put together, and I think that no matter which ones I end up with (if any) would improve my herd. Almost every single one of those females is registerable from the research I've done, and since that's what I'm looking for (registered females for my herd) the ones whose one or both of their parents aren't registered are off my list. Did anyone notice GJR 141N? She has a really large udder and teats, I don't know whether to shy away from that or want it, I'd know more if I saw her calf, but does anyone have a hint as to her in particular?

I'm also having to try and figure out hauling them, as they are in Alberta and I am in NW WA, but after talking to a friend, I'll probably end up hauling them myself. If that's the case, I might try to go a day before the sale to look at them if possible, which will help me narrow things down even more. Does anyone here know exactly what is needed to bring cattle into the US? I was told to call my vet, and am going to in the morning, but if someone here has done it and has a few hints, that would be great as well.

Also, I already have kind of a base price set for these girls, but what would you guys say would be a fair price? They are all bred, so that is part of my price as well. Thanks!

 

[KNERSIE]

There are a few good ones, but also quite a few that lack in heartgirth and depth. Galloway's hair tends to make them look like they have more capacity than they do, so if you see one that is even slightly marginal when it comes to depth and capacity you'll do good to steer clear of that one.

 

[Australian]

Darn good group of cattle. I like dun coloured galloways best. Haven't got any yet but would love some.
Darn good sires they use.
Colin

 

[Gelbvieh 5]

There are a few good ones, but also quite a few that lack in heartgirth and depth. Galloway's hair tends to make them look like they have more capacity than they do, so if you see one that is even slightly marginal when it comes to depth and capacity you'll do good to steer clear of that one.

Out of close to 70 cows here I see 5 at most that are a little, too a lot, pinched. That's as soggy a bunch of cows as I have seen posted here in a while. Not sure how hair could make them appear deeper than they are, they are in summer coat and they are hairy all over?

What I don't really care for are some of their bulls. Many are very high flanked and tending toward the cursed funnel but.

 

[Angus Cowman]

There are a few good ones, but also quite a few that lack in heartgirth and depth. Galloway's hair tends to make them look like they have more capacity than they do, so if you see one that is even slightly marginal when it comes to depth and capacity you'll do good to steer clear of that one.

Out of close to 70 cows here I see 5 at most that are a little, too a lot, pinched. That's as soggy a bunch of cows as I have seen posted here in a while. Not sure how hair could make them appear deeper than they are, they are in summer coat and they are hairy all over?

What I don't really care for are some of their bulls. Many are very high flanked and tending toward the cursed funnel but.

I don't know but it may just be the breed

 

[gallowaygirl]

Galloways are a hairy breed, their summer coat is about the length of an Angus' winter coat, so in winter, they have about 4 times that much hair. I don't see where you are getting the funnel-butt thing, but maybe I just missed it. Galloways are a fantastic breed, but haven't had the influence of multiple other breeds like the Angus and other "black" breeds (no offense to Angus raisers or likers) to boost their genes. The breed is continually being improved, but doesn't have the advantage of being a non-pure purebred with hybrid vigor from other breeds. Just my little speal..

 

[wade]

What are the approx. weaning weights on these animals? At what age can you butcher a steer and get a hanging weight of say 800 lbs? I am not trying to knock them at all. A real good friend of mine has a herd of Belted Galloway. He thought they were great until he put a few steers in with my Red Angus on my pasture. His steers were a year older than my steers and the hanging weight difference put a new light in his eyes. Maybe I am missing something but pounds to go to town with at the earliest age makes more sense to me. Please enlighten me.

 

[Willow Springs]

A few comments.

Galloway Breeders that I have talked to say that the belted cattle are generally poorer quality. This is probably due to the fact that they are novelty cattle becasue of their colour pattern, and a lot of them are raised on acreages and petting zoos. Some of these cattle are not under any sort of improvement program. In fact they are registered in a different section of the herdbook. Dutch Belted cattle were crossed with Galloway to produce the colour pattern so they are maybe not as pure as the reds, blacks, and duns. Belted cattle are probably not the best representation of the breed.

I have a friend who crossed Galloway with his Angus cows and finished the cattle as well. After several years he stopped using Galloway because he couldn't get the non-replacement heifers to a high enough carcass weight to be profitable (in his system). The steers did fine and he said the replacment heifers were big enough.

In trials done up here (Canada) the Galloway cattle have excelled in lean meat yield, ctuability and feed conversion (superior to other British breeds). This is probably due to the fact that they have less back fat; maybe an evolutionary change due to their thick hair coat??? They also marble very well. This work was done on steers.

 

[gallowaygirl]

Well, weaning weight wise-ours are around 500 pounds (but that's just my eyeball talking, could be totally wrong) and our first bull was kind of questionable as to his "exact" Galloway breeding. And we haven't had them long enough or had the numbers to really see or taste what the meat is like. However, some interesting info from my Galloway Dispatch:

Two kids from Cornucopia, WI took Black Galloway steers to their local fair and ended up with these results:

Live Wt 1168, HCW 716, Ribeye Area 15 and the other was Live Wt, 1120, HCW 653, Ribeye Area 14.6 getting 3rd and 2nd respectively in the carcass phase of the competition. I personlly thought those were good numbers, but haven't shown enough to really know.

Another tidbit: A 7/8 Galloway steers was sent to the processor, checked in with a 1425 liveweight graded at high choice and hung out at a 980 carcass for a 68.7% dressing percentage.

And about the Belted's. They are a sort of hobbyists breed, however some people are working at bringing them back up to a beef breed. They are smaller than the regular and white Galloways, but have the same temperament and meat qualities if raised right.

 

[DOC HARRIS]

gallowaygirl-

Well!!!!!!! You have designed a real "Cattle-selection" Exercise for yourself, and if nothing more, you should learn a great deal about Phenotype, Genetics, and Functional Traits in the performance of your assignment and homework.

As a preface to my remarks here, I will repeat, AGAIN, two caveats that should ALWAYS be borne in mind when judging and selecting cattle: PICTURES ARE NEVER SATISFACTORY WHEN CHOOSING SEEDSTOCK, and ALWAYS QUESTION YOUR DECISIONS WHEN THE CATTLE DISPLAY "FUNNEL BUTTS"! Having established those parameters, here are my "Opinions" of the cattle represented here. I am not privy to the intricacies or the specifics of the Galloway Genetics (or EPD's), therefore I won't do an indepth analysis of those details. The opinions expressed here are from a Phenotypical observation only.

BULLS: Most of the bulls pictured here lack hindquarters and depth of body, both characterists of which are critical in the selection of a breeding bull, or the SIRE of seedstock females. The one bull which impressed me the most from this group is "GJR 97P". He is deep quartered, good spring of rib, has a fairly deep heartgirth compared to the other bulls represented, a strong, level topline, large testicles, a masculine head with breed-characteristic "burlyness" (which indicates a potential high fertility value in his daughters), a reasonably level rump, good capacity (which also is an indication of how his daughters may be able to produce optimally healthy calves) and characteristic thickness. The "two" pictures which are available on this site for this bull demonstrate how pictures can distort reality. In making decisions about your selection of Herd Bulls for seedstock or just calf producing, it is advisable to (a) see and examine the bull PERSONALLY, and (b) examine his dam and any of his daughters which may be available for perusal.

COWS: The cows depicted here are, for the most part, a reasonably acceptable representation of seedstock females. In selecting the one's I mention here, I used the criteria of their potential ability to move your breeding ahead in quality and reproductiveness with PROFIT as the ultimate goal. Bearing that in mind, I won't analyze each one individually with specific comments or reasons for my selecting them. They ALL should present strong toplines, deep bodies for enough capacity for producing strong calves without problems, acceptable width and depth of quarter, wide and thick bodies for acceptable rib eye production, and optimal Galloway breed characteristics. And, as important as ANY trait in a female, they should present an exemplary udder and teat anatomy to help assure a long, productive life without expecting breakdowns along the way.

These are the one's which I would certainly give a second look - - AND that is EXACTLY what you should do prior to purchasing any seedstock: visit the producer the day or two prior to the sale and EYEBALL your tentative selections before making a definite decision to place bids. Your Financial status and "Dollar Boundaries" should be firmly established in your mind, and WRITTEN DOWN somewhere so that you won't be "caught up" in the excitement of the auction, and be intimidated by an Auctioneer's "Verbal BS", which is part of the "$ALE$ BU$INE$$". KNOW exactly what you want to buy and WHY you have decided upon that particular animal! It is extremely easy to go completely blank when you get into the "Realm of a Beef Cattle Auction", and lose contact with "the Reality Principle", the result of which could be disastrous! Keep the "important" factors uppermost in your mind, and don't be influenced by the minor characteristics - which may be of lesser import!

These cows are the one's which I would strongly consider. There may be others which you could accept for reasons of which I am not privy.

COWS: RHG17P - GJR47L - GJR123S - GJR44N - GJR87M - RHG36K - RHG23B - RHG29P - GJR130H - GJR130P - GJR140R - GJR81L. AND - - the cow which I think presents the most desirable Phenotype in the entire group is - - GJR18P!

The heifer RHG5R has the potential to mature into a fine producer, but is too young to evaluate either Phenotypically or Genetically - from THIS PICTURE!

I wish you good SEARCHING and good DECISION-MAKING in your pursuit of the "Rest-of-your-life-BU$INE$$!"

DOC HARRIS

 

[gallowaygirl]

DOC-the cows that you chose are all ones that I had on my list (except RHG 23B, RHG 36K, GJR 81L, GJR 81M, and GJR 130H because of age) I especially like the RHG 5R heifer, she seems well put together for her age. Thanks for the help.

I have a question for anyone reading/posting. Does the udder of 141N look way too large to want to add to the herd? i can't decide whether to shy away from her or want her if she raises a large calf (which I don't know about as of yet)

Also, DOC, what did you think of GJR 112S? I think her butt looks funny, but might just be the way she is walking.

 

[Keren]

I only had a quick quick look and they appear to be a really good set of cattle, probably couldnt go too wrong with any of them.

The ones that caught my eye from the thumbnails only were GJR 130N and GJR 18P. Can you stick them in an airmail envelope and send them to me?

The heifer looks to have a little too much leg for me.

141N is a cow that sticks everything into her calf - very different type to the others and personally I like the others better - they are holding their condition while raising calves (hopefully those calves are just as good as hers) - theoretically they should breed back faster than this girl. But there are a whole host of unknowns - was she at a different stage of lactation to the others when the pic was taken, has she been sick etc.

 

[DOC HARRIS]

DOC-the cows that you chose are all ones that I had on my list (except RHG 23B, RHG 36K, GJR 81L, GJR 81M, and GJR 130H because of age) I especially like the RHG 5R heifer, she seems well put together for her age. Thanks for the help.

I have a question for anyone reading/posting. Does the udder of 141N look way too large to want to add to the herd? i can't decide whether to shy away from her or want her if she raises a large calf (which I don't know about as of yet)

Also, DOC, what did you think of GJR 112S? I think her butt looks funny, but might just be the way she is walking.

-

gallowaygirl-

Concerning the 141N cow - We are confronted here with two potential problems: the pendulous udder, which is certainly a factor to be seriously considered in itself, and also the size of her teats, which could be a difficulty for a new-born calf to access for a few days after birth, BUT - the primary problem with 141N is the fact that the left front quarter of her udder appears to be non-functional. That precludes her use immediately in my book. It could be an indication of a previous 'Mastitis' condition, and you don't need that to confuse the issues of Cow Herd Management.

In regard to GJR 112S, I would suggest that before you decide one way or the other you carefully observe her - PERSONALLY! Watch her walk, and analyze how she moves, whether she is sickle-hocked or cow-hocked, whether she is a Funnel Butt, and whether her front feet splay-out, indicating a lack of Spring of Rib and, therfore, minimal capacity for healthy calf production and long life. A lack of Hind Quarter muscling (Funnel Butt-ism) will make her look even more so when she is taking long strides, as it seems she is doing in this picture. There are other cows here who are more desirable - flat out! - than this cow. It is important that one refrains from "making excuses" for an obvious fault, and therefore becoming "BARN BLIND" to the REALITY of an animal's lack of important factors which comprise a desirable seedstock candidate. Be ruthless! It means Money in your pocket, now AND in the future.

DOC HARRIS

 

[gallowaygirl]

OK, here is what I have gotten down to:

GJR 10M GJR 110T GJR 130N GJR 130P
GJR 132P GJR 166S GJR 18P GJR 195T
GJR 39R GJR 44N GJR 722T GJR 73P
GJR 81S K5 23P RHG 17P RHG 5R

There is no way I will be able to view these animals before the auction, so I'm having to base all my opinions on the pictures they have provided. I know that is not the way to do it, and it's not what I was planning, but I'll get to see them when I pick them up! :?
Personally the majority of them all look pretty good to me, and I think that no matter what, any of the ones on my list will be an improvement on the females I have now. Anyways, tell me what you think, if there are any you guys would definitely NOT pick.

 

[DOC HARRIS]

OK, here is what I have gotten down to:

GJR 10M GJR 110T GJR 130N GJR 130P
GJR 132P GJR 166S GJR 18P GJR 195T
GJR 39R GJR 44N GJR 722T GJR 73P
GJR 81S K5 23P RHG 17P RHG 5R

There is no way I will be able to view these animals before the auction, so I'm having to base all my opinions on the pictures they have provided. I know that is not the way to do it, and it's not what I was planning, but I'll get to see them when I pick them up! :?
Personally the majority of them all look pretty good to me, and I think that no matter what, any of the ones on my list will be an improvement on the females I have now. Anyways, tell me what you think, if there are any you guys would definitely NOT pick.

gallowaygirl-

The females that you have indicated that you would be interested in buying are all within the acceptable parameters of acceptance that I would select. What small differences of opinion there may be within specific individuals here are very inconsequential insofar as "decision policy" is concerned. The individual's you have chosen all seem to be more than qualified to improve an average seedstock herd.

I don't know how limited you are within your overall budget allowances, but that is something that you have to balance with the eagerness to acquire whatever individual(s) you decide you wish to purchase. I would caution you to consider carefully the advisability of selecting quality rather than merely numbers!

Remember, it is very easy to become "Barn Blind" at an auction - particularly buying online! Being aware of "What and Why" is sometimes more important than just "Which".

DOC HARRIS

 

[Willow Springs]

I had a look at the females again.

If you are going to buy based on the pictures I would be wary of any where you cannot see the udders. Most of the cows have very good udders, but a good portion have teats that could be a problem. There are a lot of long teated cows with the ice cream cone shaped teats; from what I have seen of Galloways (more in the past) this can be an issue, so try to avoid it.

The pictures also indicate that a lot of the females you had listed were dry when pictured. Based on when we the Ladywells herd is calved (mostly April-June) these cows did not raise a calf this year; why?? The females look good, but most females that go to pasture without a calf do. Is the favourite 18P as good as she appears, or just fat becasue she didn't raise a calf?

I would avoid the cows bred to the Highland bull. We have PB Red Angus and all the good cows get bred PB Red Angus. Most PB herds would be the same; only the poorer cows would get bred to a bull of another breed. I yhink if you look at the cows that are bred Hihgland they tend to have more issues than the others pictured.

Don't be afraid to buy older cows. They have usually gotten to be older for a reason; they work. I think you have left out some of the best cows based on age; 39M is one of the best cows pictured and 54M is pretty solid too. They will only be seven years old next spring; they should be in their prime. What are the rules for import into the USA?? Maybe the older ones can't get accross the border?

Based on what I can see in the pictures I would take these off the list.
130N - her teats are pretty long for her age and she is bred Highland.
132P - her teats are shaped like popsicles; she is a young cow and it usiually gets worse.
39R - don't like her hip and rump structure; like to give herd more depth of body; she is also bred Highland
166S- very silmialr in structure to the above heifer

I would add
105R - bad picture but looks to be a good cow
156S - bad picture but has some volume
39M - a little older but one of the best
54M - pretty solid cow
706T - again bad picture
150S - pretty solidly built, lots of depth and volume; again though she is dry.

In the end pictures are pictures and as I have said earlier you should have sombody look at the cows for you if you are serious about a building a seedstock herd. And I agree with Doc that buy the best you can afford within reason. You don't need to haul a bunch of cows accross the border that you'll just end up shipping in a few years.