Full French Charolais

[lithuanian farmer]

We have used once an easy calving Char bull, which BW was 77lbs, and xbred calves we got from him were born ~90-93lbs.
I've had the same issues before, and folks think I'm lying...

Those were small calves for us. Used easy calving Angus bull the same year on a couple heifers. His birth weigh was 90lbs. Yes, that's easy calving Angus bull here. His calves were born easily and around the same weight.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

The 3rd one looks the best. First two "appear" to have too much shoulder for me. Shoulder = calving difficulties.
Just a question to check out. The original French Charolais has quite a bit of double muscling in the breed. Do they still?
Yes, you will get heavier muscling than the Amer. Ch. but can you afford to get the extra bone? Will you get discounted at sale barn?

 

[elkwc]

The 3rd one looks the best. First two "appear" to have too much shoulder for me. Shoulder = calving difficulties.
Just a question to check out. The original French Charolais has quite a bit of double muscling in the breed. Do they still?
Yes, you will get heavier muscling than the Amer. Ch. but can you afford to get the extra bone? Will you get discounted at sale barn?

Jeanne I have never seen one discounted here because of big bone. I know many like myself that prefer it. That is one of the reasons I retained the PB Angus calf I did last year. He has more bone than anything I have been able to find along with as much growth as anything. I personally like one with some bone and big and rugged. Not refined boned and light muscling.

 

[Randi]

The 3rd one looks the best. First two "appear" to have too much shoulder for me. Shoulder = calving difficulties.
Just a question to check out. The original French Charolais has quite a bit of double muscling in the breed. Do they still?
Yes, you will get heavier muscling than the Amer. Ch. but can you afford to get the extra bone? Will you get discounted at sale barn?

I am still waiting to get the catalogue. Those 3 just looked like a pretty good sample of the ones they had posted photos of. Until I see some numbers, I'm not picking out a bull, lol.

I don't believe that extra bone will cause us any problems, as far as selling goes anyways.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

I like a good bone, not fine like so many Angus and some of the Sim-Angus cattle. There is a difference between too much bone & an adequate bone. Growing up with the first influx of Continental cattle, I have seen more than my share of big round boned cattle.

 

[WalnutCrest]

If there was a chance you may keep back any heifers the third one looks like one I'd be tempted to try mainly due to the deeper flank but I do like the second bill quite a bit.

Are you leaning towards one over another?

We definitely won't be keeping any as replacements. We have bought a few Char x cows, just because the price was right. But, they really aren't what we are after in our herd. Prefer a British based cow, then crossed to Char.

At the moment, I am not leaning towards any of them, I am waiting for the catalogue. But I thought they were a pretty good sample of what the breeder posted photos of. I think they are all pretty nice bulls.

I'll be in France at the end of May looking at possible donor cows ... are you going to head over to take a peak yourself?

 

[Randi]

I like a good bone, not fine like so many Angus and some of the Sim-Angus cattle. There is a difference between too much bone & an adequate bone. Growing up with the first influx of Continental cattle, I have seen more than my share of big round boned cattle.

Yes, I know what you're saying. With the Shorthorn cattle we've been running we get some big boned cattle too.

 

[Randi]

If there was a chance you may keep back any heifers the third one looks like one I'd be tempted to try mainly due to the deeper flank but I do like the second bill quite a bit.

Are you leaning towards one over another?

We definitely won't be keeping any as replacements. We have bought a few Char x cows, just because the price was right. But, they really aren't what we are after in our herd. Prefer a British based cow, then crossed to Char.

At the moment, I am not leaning towards any of them, I am waiting for the catalogue. But I thought they were a pretty good sample of what the breeder posted photos of. I think they are all pretty nice bulls.

I'll be in France at the end of May looking at possible donor cows ... are you going to head over to take a peak yourself

Umm no, these are from a breeder here in Canada....

 

[WalnutCrest]

We definitely won't be keeping any as replacements. We have bought a few Char x cows, just because the price was right. But, they really aren't what we are after in our herd. Prefer a British based cow, then crossed to Char.

At the moment, I am not leaning towards any of them, I am waiting for the catalogue. But I thought they were a pretty good sample of what the breeder posted photos of. I think they are all pretty nice bulls.

I'll be in France at the end of May looking at possible donor cows ... are you going to head over to take a peak yourself

Umm no, these are from a breeder here in Canada....

Ahhh... that'd be a bit out of the way for me.

Are they still full French Charolais if they're in Canada? Or, maybe they're in Quebec and a good argument could be made ...

 

[Randi]

Lol, I'm just going by what the breeder says...I'm guessing that he means the cattle are not bred up. But either imported or originated as embryos.

 

[WalnutCrest]

Lol, I'm just going by what the breeder says...I'm guessing that he means the cattle are not bred up. But either imported or originated as embryos.

I understand.

I have full French Aubracs in the same way ... not bred up, but bred solely from imported genetics.

 

[Dubcharo]

Our bull buyers want calving ease and no horns so we don't work with Full French but we like a quarter french blood in our herd bulls. If you need a bull to cross with angus the horns are not an issue, just keep an eye on birth weight or calving ease EPD. There's nothing like trying it on your place under your management. No farm are the same.

 

[Randi]

Here is the catalogue. The bulls we are most interested in trying are Lot 5, 20 and 29. Seem to be a bit more moderate on the calving, but still around average in the WW.
http://issuu.com/pdrneepawa/docs/stephe ... 9/57317266

I am not a stickler on BW, our average BW from our cows is right around 95 lbs. But we have enough cows that throw 110+ that I don't want to be stupid about introducing something new in. Horns really don't concern me too much. The cow herd is Angus, or Angus crossed with Shorthorn or Hereford. Bred to Shorthorn, Red Angus and Charolais. I've never dropped any interest in a bull because he's horned or not. We have a few calves with horns every year. Deal with them at branding, and the occasional one in the summer that we missed, or didn't develop horns til later.

I'm thinking we will go, and try to get one of those 3 and give him a try. I can easily make sure I throw lighter BW cows in with him for the first year. Definitely not going to try more than one right now, don't need that kind of wreck if things don't click.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Well, I did not look thru the rest of the catalog, but out of the 3 you posted, I like 20 hands down better the the other two. And IMO, I would eliminate #5. #20 is really balanced, full heart girth, good flat shoulder, deep flanked.
I realize #5 is only a yearling, but, to me, he has too much shoulder, may be pinched in the girth and his tail head looks like it comes out of the top of his butt. #29 looks good, just doesn't appear to be as powerful as #20 and is younger but only by 3 months.
Of course, pictures can be soooo deceiving. Especially a bull that you cannot SEE ANY FEET or 1/2 their legs!!! LOL
Good luck.

 

[creekdrive]

Don't have a lot of experience, but we have a Char bull whose sire is Full French. First calves were born last April. Used him on a mixed group of commercial cows, most being 50% or more Angus. A few have some Sim or Gelbvieh in them. We don't usually weigh any of our commercial calves unless there is a problem, but it is safe to say he did add some birthweight. Avg bw was easily over 100lbs. Our commercial cows calve right along side our purebreds, and since we weigh all the purebred calves we usually have a pretty good idea of what they weigh. Our commercial cows with an Angus bull are usually 85-95 lb calves so the difference wasn't huge. We did have to pull one calf from a small 2nd calver (1000 lb). Calf was 113 lbs. It wasn't a hard pull by any means and she probably could've had it on her own if we left her. Only other calf of his we weighed was 124 lbs and built like a brick. Born unassisted but definitely was not built for easy calving. Calves were all born with plenty of vigour and were up & sucking quickly.

We were very happy with the calves when we sold in the fall. Lots of muscle, and tons of width over the top. The bull also added frame to the calves which is a plus in our case. We are planning on adding another Char bull this year and most likely will be going back to the same breeder. His bulls are all either Full French or sired by Full French bulls. Looking at the catalogue, I'd say there is a good chance we will end up with a Full French bull this time. We plan to stick with something under 100lbs bw.

The 3 bulls you have picked out look alright to me! Very hard to judge by pictures, but I think it would definitely be worth trying one. The first breeding season we did the same as you mentioned and kept the cows that we know throw large bw calves away from him and it worked fine for us.

 

[Supa Dexta]

Ha. The east coast has been using chars for years and are now going more towards sims and angus, and the western provinces are going in the opposite direction.

 

[Randi]

Ha. The east coast has been using chars for years and are now going more towards sims and angus, and the western provinces are going in the opposite direction.

Yeah, and they are importing these good Char calves from out west too...lol

 

[Willie2107]

Where are you getting the catalogue from I would like to find full French Charolais semen in Texas

 

[Randi]

The breeder is Stephen Charolais, here in Saskatchewan, Canada. Pm me if you want more info.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Randi - did you buy a bull last year? How did you make out?