Following Too Many Numbers?

[Oldtimer]

here is the link to an article that adds a little different spin on EPD selection for some traits.

http://angusthemagazine.com/currentissu ... alone.html

 

[RD-Sam]

No different than taking an animal that was traditionally fed on grass alone and turning it into an animal that is fed grain and corn to make it grow faster than it should. It's about tayloring to todays market.

I am having trouble figuring out way they took them off the grass to start with? If you are in it for the long haul, what is an extra year or two to get started, and just let the cattle graze on their own, you don't have all that expensive feed and antibiotics, and cows getting sick in feedlots because the conditions are filthy. Why can't they just graze and even reproduce once before they head to market? The beef is said to have more flavor from a grass fed animal too. Did everything go overboard and now everyone is paying the price with high feed costs?

 

[goodbeef]

Do some research and you"ll find out why we need feedlots, and why all cattle arent fed on grass, its called efficiency and acreage! If you want to be able to eat affordable beef there must be feedlots!

 

[RD-Sam]

There is a post about several ranches with half million acre farms, and there are a boat load of farms in the 50 - 100k acre range, I don't think that is the problem. If you loose an initial year to two years that it takes to start the cycle to market, why does that matter if you are in it for the long haul? Are you saying it cost more to fatten a cow on grass than buying all that feed?

 

[dun]

No different than taking an animal that was traditionally fed on grass alone and turning it into an animal that is fed grain and corn to make it grow faster than it should. It's about tayloring to todays market.

I am having trouble figuring out way they took them off the grass to start with? If you are in it for the long haul, what is an extra year or two to get started, and just let the cattle graze on their own, you don't have all that expensive feed and antibiotics, and cows getting sick in feedlots because the conditions are filthy. Why can't they just graze and even reproduce once before they head to market?

A good share of it has to do with the 30 month rule and tenderness. I'll agree that an older animal has more and better taste, but they aren;t nearly as tender as a 14-16 month old. Those steers have a hard time reproducing.

 

[I luv herfrds]

RD you need to realize that each area has a different animal unit allowed for the different grasses.
Like our place it is a semi-arid area and number of cattle that it supports is dictated by this.

 

[Oldtimer]

No different than taking an animal that was traditionally fed on grass alone and turning it into an animal that is fed grain and corn to make it grow faster than it should. It's about tayloring to todays market.

I am having trouble figuring out way they took them off the grass to start with? If you are in it for the long haul, what is an extra year or two to get started, and just let the cattle graze on their own, you don't have all that expensive feed and antibiotics, and cows getting sick in feedlots because the conditions are filthy. Why can't they just graze and even reproduce once before they head to market?

A good share of it has to do with the 30 month rule and tenderness. I'll agree that an older animal has more and better taste, but they aren;t nearly as tender as a 14-16 month old. Those steers have a hard time reproducing.

And some steers have an easy time reproducing :???: ;-) :lol:

I understand what your saying dun- just couldn't resist..

 

[dun]

The whole concept of single trait selection causing problems is one of those "Well, Daaaah" kind of deals.
There are bulls that can give you multiple antagonistic traits all in one package, i.e. low BW high WW and YW. You just have to be willing to do the work of finding them and using them.

 

[Brandonm22]

There is a post about several ranches with half million acre farms, and there are a boat load of farms in the 50 - 100k acre range, I don't think that is the problem. If you loose an initial year to two years that it takes to start the cycle to market, why does that matter if you are in it for the long haul? Are you saying it cost more to fatten a cow on grass than buying all that feed?

You are right. IF I had 50,000++ acres of good grass, I probably would hold my steers and heifers longer (at least too 800 lbs). Most of us don't have the problem of too much ground and too much grass though. This business is "generally" about making the most money per available grazing unit. IF you only own 200 (or less) animal units worth of grazing, you have a decision too make. You COULD either carry 200 moma cows and sell calves at 6 to 8 months and gross ~$108000 (180 calves x $600 hd) or you COULD carry 100 cows and grass finish last year's calves and gross ~$97200 (90 grass finished steers/heifers at $1080 a hd). When the industry made the gradual switch from a lean grass finished product to a younger, more tender grain finished product the math favored feedlot finishing. Some people now are able too get a premium for their leaner grass finished beef so for them the numbers favor running less cows and holding the calves another year. Another advantage of specialization is weather. IF those calves are born in the early spring, the cow/calf producer only has too winter his dry moma cows. A grass finisher has to winter his dry brood cows AND his growing stocker calves and he has to do it in a way where his calves keep growing through the cold months or he won't ever get them satisfactorily finished so he has too winter two seperate herds (the cows and the stockers) and provide ample nutrition too both. That is a lot more work, is a longer interval between paydays, and requires more guerilla marketing on the part of the rancher.

 

[novatech]

here is the link to an article that adds a little different spin on EPD selection for some traits.

http://angusthemagazine.com/currentissu ... alone.html

A producers goal should be to provide what the customer wants. Today it seems to be efficiency. Calves with more weight are bringing higher prices. Those that can afford or have the grass to do it are retaining the calves longer.

For those that think everybody should go back to grass fed, well just back your 16 ft. trailer up and lets haul 5 or 10 thousand head over to your place and you can show us how its done. ;-)

 

[RD-Sam]

No different than taking an animal that was traditionally fed on grass alone and turning it into an animal that is fed grain and corn to make it grow faster than it should. It's about tayloring to todays market.

I am having trouble figuring out way they took them off the grass to start with? If you are in it for the long haul, what is an extra year or two to get started, and just let the cattle graze on their own, you don't have all that expensive feed and antibiotics, and cows getting sick in feedlots because the conditions are filthy. Why can't they just graze and even reproduce once before they head to market?

A good share of it has to do with the 30 month rule and tenderness. I'll agree that an older animal has more and better taste, but they aren;t nearly as tender as a 14-16 month old. Those steers have a hard time reproducing.

I can see where a steer reproducing might be a problem! :lol2:

 

[RD-Sam]

here is the link to an article that adds a little different spin on EPD selection for some traits.

http://angusthemagazine.com/currentissu ... alone.html

A producers goal should be to provide what the customer wants. Today it seems to be efficiency. Calves with more weight are bringing higher prices. Those that can afford or have the grass to do it are retaining the calves longer.

For those that think everybody should go back to grass fed, well just back your 16 ft. trailer up and lets haul 5 or 10 thousand head over to your place and you can show us how its done. ;-)

I heard that, the market in the US is, I want it, and I want it right now! And I know I won't change the cattle business, I was just making a comment more or less, and I was getting at the fact that everybody wants it right now, they want that quick profit, no matter the cost in the long run.

 

[Brandonm22]

Who is talking about "quick profit"? Most of us live in the here and the now. We are NOT worried about 2o years from now. We want too survive to see 2o years from now..........and I am not convinced that we ARE headed towards grass finishing even then.