Fat heifers and bulls

[dun]

The following was stolen from another board that mostly address' dairy, but it's just as appropriate for beef cattle

During the last few days , I attended an ABS meeting . At the dinner , several reps got to talking on fertility at heifer projects. The comment was made that over time , some customers cattle seemed to settle very well but other customers cattle were problems . One of the culprits in the equation was over fat heifers and the struggle to get them bred.

I see this all the time . It seems that if you observe a bunch of heifers that are healthy but maybe a bit on the green side but gaining pre breeding , you get along just fine but if you start out with a group of heifers that are borderline fat and getting fatter , you are setting yourself up for a train wreck in getting them bred. It is especially tough in the heifer projects where sometimes space is limited and the heifers already of good doing genetics dont get enough exercize . When I asked a good vet about it , his thoughts were that the overys get packed in fat and get too hot for the heifer to breed well.

I see the same thing happening in bull development . The bulls in feed tests where they are pushed for extremely fast gains dont seem to be as fertile, have more white blood cell problems and also have feet problems which will contribute to less longevity .

For this reason both on our developing heifers and our growing bulls we have gone to a lower concentrate ration , keeping the per cent concentrate down to 55 % or less. I am advocating this to my semen and bull customers as well for their developing heifers.

In my opinion, getting heifers too fat hurts conception and can really hurt milk production down the road besides adding extra cost to the mix . There is no justification for it at all in my opinion.

 

[shorty]

I have a group of calves that were weaned about 7 weeks ago, we have been feeding about 8lbs per head (ear corn, barley, oats, and soybean meal, about 12% total protien) they are leaving on saturday but I decided to keep 2heifers back for breeding, They are almost 9 months old, I usualy keep feeding some grain until they go to the bull at 15-16 mths , they usually dont,t get too fat but often timmes don't breed on first time with bull , Am Iright in doing this or should I take the grain away they also get hay or haylage mostly grasss but pretty good quality , when pastures are good in spring I stop grain completley from then on they will get the same as the cows , pasture supplemented with hay or haylage as neeeded plus minerals

 

[dun]

I have a group of calves that were weaned about 7 weeks ago, we have been feeding about 8lbs per head (ear corn, barley, oats, and soybean meal, about 12% total protien) they are leaving on saturday but I decided to keep 2heifers back for breeding, They are almost 9 months old, I usualy keep feeding some grain until they go to the bull at 15-16 mths , they usually dont,t get too fat but often timmes don't breed on first time with bull , Am Iright in doing this or should I take the grain away they also get hay or haylage mostly grasss but pretty good quality , when pastures are good in spring I stop grain completley from then on they will get the same as the cows , pasture supplemented with hay or haylage as neeeded plus minerals

Each situation/environemtn is different.
Our replacements get grain and pasture for 6-8 weeks during the weaning process then are kicked out to just pasture, hay if required, until we breed them in the May-June. Last year was the first time we've had any kind of a problem, and that was a heifer that didn't even cycle till she was 14 months old and didn't have another till she was 17 months. She's pretty darn good eating though.

dun

 

[dun]

Here's another respnse to the same subject

At our District ABS meeting last month several reps had the same concern, and a few had data backing up the damage that excess fat does to heifers. A lot of ranchers around here have gone to 'roughing' the heifers through the winter, then pushing them the last 60-90 days before breeding. The old term is flushing. I think the key is constant gains, but not excessive gain. Set a target weight for breeding, weigh them regularly during the season, and feed accordingly.
On those herds we have seen increased conceptions and greater longevity out of those animals. We have been watching this for 20 years now and it is consistent from herd to herd.
There has been some concern on the effects of ionophores on heifer fertility. Rather than the ionophore itself, it might be the increased gains and subsequent fat deposition that is the problem. It would be an interesting study. I did have a vet who tests hundreds of bulls each year tell me that he can tell how long a bull has been on an ionophore by his semen quality, the longer the lower. That could also be a problem of fat around the testes or prostate. Another topic for a graduate thesis.

And another

Last year we got in trouble with some good heifers at a heifer project. took them in weighing 800 which was the heaviest there. at yearling stage, one of them weighed almost 1200 which was WAY to heavy. not the feedlots fault as he was feeding for the average in the pen.
This year we are keeping the heifers home and we have made a real effort to keep them green . we plan to do just as you described for the rest of the growing period.
On the bulls, I talked with the fellow that runs the midland bull test . He claims they really watch the energy in the ration , keeping it low and have very few white blood cell problems which he tends to blame on acidosis.

 

[mhill]

Where are you located in eastern PA Shorty?

 

[Wren]

Now I have not tried to breed my heifer yet but she seems to be on the fat side to. I caouldn't tell you a wieght as she is a range cow but I have her on nothing but a 14 acre pasture and she seems to be excessivly fat. Anything anyone would suggest to get her wieght down?

 

[DRB]

I am interested in this "too fat" idea...My heifers, so I am told, are always "too fat"...I push them from weaning until breeding, really until the last trimester, and then slow down, but keep them in "good shape"...I have even put some of them in rye grass the last month before they calf...I have seen no diference in how they calf,or in their milking. Last year 5 of 5 heifers bred back within 30 days of calving...I think this is because they were in extra good condition...I only run one bull (only 25 cows/heifers) he stays fat and all my cattle were bred within 45 days...I'm calving right now...Horned hereford bull on Charolais cattle...some crossbred cattle...Also....not to be contrary, and this may be an exception to a good rule, but my bull has a high birth weight EPD (7+)...I experimented to see if a high birth weight herford would affect the calving ease of large frame Charolais...no problem...wake up in the morning and find a good calf standing by a good mama..the way it should be...

 

[Craig-TX]

I'll take 'em too fat vs too poor any day of the week and twice on Sunday. I'm too stingy to keep them gobby fat but I'm also too stingy to keep them looking gaunt.

Craig-TX

 

[D.R. Cattle]

I've experienced that problem with replacements. Usually there will be one or two that gets goobly fat, not sure why when they are grazing with the rest of the herd. Those are exactly the ones that turn up open.