F1

[Silver]

Rather than worrying about profit per acre, assuming you have enough acres, best to decide on how many animals you feel comfortable running, then maximize the profit per animal.

 

[WalnutCrest]

Rather than worrying about profit per acre, assuming you have enough acres, best to decide on how many animals you feel comfortable running, then maximize the profit per animal.

El Wrong-o.

Unless, of course, a ranchers' goal is to find new ways to supplement their farm income and/or pay off farm debt with off-farm jobs.

While the sustenance portion of a person's revenue is far different if working with deeded land than it is trying to pay down / pay off purchased land, that doesn't eliminate an obligation to oneself to try to maximize profit per acre (even if the land is paid off).

Profit per acre is the only metric related to the survivability of the enterprise. Everything else is noise (i.e., breed association clap-trap).

 

[Silver]

You are of course quite welcome to follow your course, this outfit will continue to follow the same course it has for the last 70 years somehow surviving despite our own ignorance.

 

[Stocker Steve]

What are a couple of successful applications that you have seen ?

 

[Silver]

Most of the guys that touted those metrics disappeared with the BSE crisis up here.

 

[CattleMan1920]

You are of course quite welcome to follow your course, this outfit will continue to follow the same course it has for the last 70 years somehow surviving despite our own ignorance.

If you have lasted 70 years and not gone bankrupt or sold out, then I would say you know what's going on.

Very few places last that long.

Don't worry about what people say, heck it's established on Cattle Today that I'm running the worst Angus operation in the world. LOL! You can probably judge for yourself if you see my cattle.

There is acreage around me that should be nearly impossible to raise cattle on, yet people squeak out a profit on their animals on that land, and then there is prime farmland right outside Lexington that probably have money losing herds subsidized by an income from being a doctor or lawyer or such.

I would think profit per acre would be more applicable to crops, not animals.

What if you have a good 100 acres of good pasture, but instead of running old cows from the stockyards you are engaged in high level breeding with AI and ET. How does that profit per acre figure in then? It's more about profit per animal.

 

[WalnutCrest]

What are a couple of successful applications that you have seen ?

I don't know I understand your question.

Application of what to what?

Generally, more hoof prints per acre per day with more rotations to fresh pasture with meaningful rest between bites taken from the leaves grown results in more leaves grown in the same area in the future. More 1200 lb cows can be carried on one acre than 1800 lb cows -- they have an unfair advantage because a higher % of their daily caloric intake is used for things beyond maintenance (like storing fat, getting bred, nursing a calf) -- the bigger the cow, the higher the % of her calories are merely used for keeping her big 'ol self alive.

Also, I think people have too many bulls per female. They're not asking enough of their bulls. IMO. This in part because bulls are being retained for traits unrelated to (or possibly antagonistic to) hardiness, fertility, functionality, etc. I'm not talking about anything crazy ... but two bulls and 15 cows is not good ... neither is 4 bulls and 100 cows; three should do the job just fine (and if they don't / can't, bull selection criteria is probably worth taking a look at).

Related to this, AI is generally cheaper than feeding and housing a bull. Heck, an enterprising person could use a single bull to breed 500 females in a 45 day window ... AI 500 on timed AI ... then, 21 days later, AI any that come up open ... and immediately kick them all in with the bull you'd collected that you used in AI. The first time through the chute, you have bred 350 of the 500 ... and the second time through, you've bred 105 of the remaining 150 ... leaving 45 for the bull to cover in the last breeding period (many of whom will be sub-fertile anyhow since they didn't cycle / stick with the first two AI attempts). One could do that instead of buying 15 bulls. That'd save money and improve profit per acre (and profit per head).

 

[WalnutCrest]

You are of course quite welcome to follow your course, this outfit will continue to follow the same course it has for the last 70 years somehow surviving despite our own ignorance.

If you have lasted 70 years and not gone bankrupt or sold out, then I would say you know what's going on.

Very few places last that long.

Agreed. That's a commendable accomplishment.

Resting on your laurels is what'll end up doing you in, though. It's what does every business in. Stay fresh and innovate. The world is far different now than it was 70 yrs ago.

<snip>

I would think profit per acre would be more applicable to crops, not animals.

What if you have a good 100 acres of good pasture, but instead of running old cows from the stockyards you are engaged in high level breeding with AI and ET. How does that profit per acre figure in then? It's more about profit per animal.

You're still focused on profit per acre ... you're just getting there in a somewhat unconventional track.

How much money did you make per unit of land?

Can you make more doing something different than what you're doing? Would investing in another donor cow be a possibility?

Could you rent land and run developing heifers on it (instead of forking over a fortune (down payment and interest) to acquire land?

... etc.

Is what you're doing now dynamic enough to tolerate changing markets? Or, is it working now, but might not work in a few years? If so, find the slack and try to remove it.

Good luck to you, sir.

 

[Stocker Steve]

OK, increase net cattle return per acre with:

F1 cross breds
smaller "cows" (smallest cow is a sheep :nod: )
rented land (got to love those 1500 to 1800# cows on a per head per month lease)
fewer bulls / AI
ET

 

[Stocker Steve]

Many have rediscovered manure value during this downturn. A few are even going back to the old timey lay farming crop and livestock rotations. When you run per acre enterprise numbers on less than prime land, you really see the value of livestock.

Labor with livestock is the trade off. Pretty easy to plant a crop, call the coop to spray it, and then call the custom operator to harvest it. So you also need to look at $/labor hr at some point. One of my favorite things about F1s is they can reduce labor required. :cowboy: