Experience with Salers Bulls

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We have had Salers for years, and they have had good tempers, and were really great momma cows. The Calves took a little longer to finish than the simm/angus calves, but the Salers/angus tasted the best. Just my opinions.
 
The best person I can think of to get an opinion on Salers bulls would be ollie'.
 
Mallen23":2tvbo2ug said:
I have PM ollie, but got no reply to this.

Better make sure you use ollie' and not ollie. Notice the '

He will answer your questions. But sometimes isn't on late at night or early morning. I'm positive he will get you a reply.
 
Mallen23":2xjz0y9b said:
I have PM ollie, but got no reply to this.
Sorry Mallen23. I indeed do not check the old login of ollie. I have added and '. I guess your question is too general . What would you like to know? If you like you can pm me or ask here. Pluses and minus qualities of Salers are similiar to other breeds. Have you got a specific bloodline in mind or a specific purpose for using a saler?
 
I don't know a thing about Salers but have heard they have bad temperment, is that true?
 
I don't make it a habit to pet bulls. Heard too many horror stories of guys getting mauled.
 
I was wondering how they will cross with angus based cattle. Will they perform as well as gelbvieh or balancers? Will the outcomes be similar.
 
Mallen23":336rf6c2 said:
I was wondering how they will cross with angus based cattle. Will they perform as well as gelbvieh or balancers? Will the outcomes be similar.
There is not a breed X that will out preform breed Y everytime. Alot depends on the type angus you own and the type Saler bull (or Gelbvieh) bull you put on them. There is no short cut for knowing how to breed quality livestock. Epd's won't tell you , breed associations won't tell you, and I can't tell you. I have calved several hundred saler calves over the years and have rarely had calving trouble. I have never had a prolapse on a Saler cow. I have only had one calf that wouldn't suck. Those are convience traits where most Salers cows stand above the crowd .The F1 angus Saler females are fantastic. Some of the drawbacks to salers generally are similiar to Gelbvieh. They sometimes aren't smooth enough in appearence. Sometimes they are tight behind the shoulder and there are several old fashioned stringbean individuals. If you have a traditional type angus cow and a modern, moderate Saler bull I think you will be pleased with the results if you are looking for a convient type cattle that pound off at the sale barn. If your angus cattle are bigger and flatter made than most or/and if you purchase a big framed high flanked saler bull (or Gelbvieh) I think you'll be disappointed. I would research the purebred breeders in your area and see which breed offers the best seedstock for your type cattle and base my decision on that. If you like you can pm me the Saler genetics or a picture of a bull that you have in mind and possibly I can help more.
 
ollie' -

I understand your antipathy and aversion to the use of EPD's, however it seems to me that your profound and well-considered reply to the request for help from Mallen23 "makes the case" for the use of a balance between EPD's and Phenotype in the selection process of beef cattle. You suggested that Mallen23 research the purebred breeders in his area to determine which breed offers the best seedstock for "your kind of Cattle". ollie', what criteria should he use in making his decisions? Should he close his eyes and just guess - or, as you have ALLUDED to in this post, should he use a form of EPD's and Phenotype in matching his selections? I would suggest that the term " EXPECTED Progeny Differences" is just THAT - EXPECTED, - NOT "Guaranteed, or certified, or warranted, or assured, or promised, or subsidized - just 'Expected' - to the best of one's abilities given the facts at the present time. Combine that with the experienced eye of the master breeder and you have the best chance for success in today's demanding market.

ollie', I think that you gave him some valuable and pragmatic advice.

DOC HARRIS
 
I'll give you my 25 cents on the issue. I've run around a few salers, fence jumping devils weren't nasty mean just alot more pressure sensitive but cornered in a corral i'd watch them pretty close. On the plus side they grow quickly and are the most vigorous calves i've seen, small and full of it. They don't seem to marble to well and have lost some popularity around here.
 
DOC HARRIS":np4vz2qa said:
what criteria should he use in making his decisions? Should he close his eyes and just guess - or, as you have ALLUDED to in this post, should he use a form of EPD's and Phenotype in matching his selections?
DOC HARRIS
Doc, I understand your support for epd's . In a controlled data base where the calves will go back on the same environment the data was collected in , epd's would be invaluable. The sad truth is though Doc many , many people without a lick of experience visually appraising livestock and without ever having any experience raising stock in their own environment much less all the various environments the data is gathered in use epd's as their authentic selection criteria for purchasing seedstock. They were never intended for that use nor will they work when applied that way. Believing that I find they do more harm than good in the average persons hands. People are using it as a placebo for knowledge. I respect your opinion very much Doc but we disagree some on this issue.
 
ollie'

I understand your perspective, and I concur with your hypothesis as you have described it. Believe me - when I was teaching, I was swamped with 'facts' which flew in the face of seeming reason - but were correct in their own right. So, I empathize with your point of view!

DOC HARRIS
 

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