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Do DNA Tests Work?

Red Bull Breeder

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Can't tell you much about if they work or not Herefords US. I reckon they work well enough testing homo black and homo polled. Don't think anyone can tell you how well dna test will work on ever thing else. Brother has a bull that had a 9 for tenderness, but i ain't going to get to eat him so guess i will never no if he is tender or not.
 

Angus Cowman

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Red Bull Breeder":1lpat8hm said:
Can't tell you much about if they work or not Herefords US. I reckon they work well enough testing homo black and homo polled. Don't think anyone can tell you how well dna test will work on ever thing else. Brother has a bull that had a 9 for tenderness, but i ain't going to get to eat him so guess i will never no if he is tender or not.
What ya mean RBB Andy ain't gonna let ya eat that bull
Don't worry I will sell ya some good BLACK ANGUS BEEF and we don't even have to test it for tenderness we know it will be tender :lol: :lol: :lol:
 

Red Bull Breeder

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I raised the daddy of the one Andy ain't gonna let me eat,i can raise me another one.I kinda think we should eat him for research to see if this dna works. Them black angus is to fat for me, and ain't got enough round.
 

Herefords.US

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No doubt the single marker tests like homo polled, homo black, and the tests for these genetic disorders, like IE, that are affected by single recessives are accurate. But reading this article leads me to believe that there's still a LOT of research left to do before the DNA tests on traits that are affected by multiple "markers" will become reliable and accurate.

I still believe that DNA testing will eventually greatly enhance the accuracy of or replace EPDs as selection criteria.

George
 

Red Bull Breeder

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I think you are right about the future of DNA test George. I think it will be a few years yet before we no how well they will work.
 

ONEGICOP

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Angus Cowman":293w8d1n said:
Red Bull Breeder":293w8d1n said:
Can't tell you much about if they work or not Herefords US. I reckon they work well enough testing homo black and homo polled. Don't think anyone can tell you how well dna test will work on ever thing else. Brother has a bull that had a 9 for tenderness, but i ain't going to get to eat him so guess i will never no if he is tender or not.
What ya mean RBB Andy ain't gonna let ya eat that bull
Don't worry I will sell ya some good BLACK ANGUS BEEF and we don't even have to test it for tenderness we know it will be tender :lol: :lol: :lol:

AC,

Heck no I ain't gonna let him eat my bull, not even for "research" like he claims. If he want's to eat one out of his D1 bull, Judy's got a nice big fat heifer out of him. See how far he gets with that :eek: :eek: :eek:
 

novaman

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Herefords.US":2yrle9i6 said:
No doubt the single marker tests like homo polled, homo black, and the tests for these genetic disorders, like IE, that are affected by single recessives are accurate. But reading this article leads me to believe that there's still a LOT of research left to do before the DNA tests on traits that are affected by multiple "markers" will become reliable and accurate.

I still believe that DNA testing will eventually greatly enhance the accuracy of or replace EPDs as selection criteria.

George
This past January the dairy breeds began using genomic evaluations to enhance the accuracies of the current proofs. The animals with high accuracies gained very little from these DNA tests. The group that benefited the most is the young, unproven sires. Most of the young sires I saw were at 70% accuracy w/o having any offspring born. Granted 70% is quite low but I was impressed it could be that high off the bat. It will take until the spring of 2011 before we start getting any hard data back on these breedings to see just how things worked out. It's very exciting to see such advances in the way we evaluate the genetic merit of young animals.
 

alexfarms

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novaman":4sk73qgd said:
Herefords.US":4sk73qgd said:
No doubt the single marker tests like homo polled, homo black, and the tests for these genetic disorders, like IE, that are affected by single recessives are accurate. But reading this article leads me to believe that there's still a LOT of research left to do before the DNA tests on traits that are affected by multiple "markers" will become reliable and accurate.

I still believe that DNA testing will eventually greatly enhance the accuracy of or replace EPDs as selection criteria.

George
This past January the dairy breeds began using genomic evaluations to enhance the accuracies of the current proofs. The animals with high accuracies gained very little from these DNA tests. The group that benefited the most is the young, unproven sires. Most of the young sires I saw were at 70% accuracy w/o having any offspring born. Granted 70% is quite low but I was impressed it could be that high off the bat. It will take until the spring of 2011 before we start getting any hard data back on these breedings to see just how things worked out. It's very exciting to see such advances in the way we evaluate the genetic merit of young animals.

That is very interesting. I would like to learn more of how the dna test results are being incorporated into epds. Is there a site that contains info on the evaluation you are referring to?
 

novaman

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alexfarms":33g9dtxc said:
novaman":33g9dtxc said:
Herefords.US":33g9dtxc said:
No doubt the single marker tests like homo polled, homo black, and the tests for these genetic disorders, like IE, that are affected by single recessives are accurate. But reading this article leads me to believe that there's still a LOT of research left to do before the DNA tests on traits that are affected by multiple "markers" will become reliable and accurate.

I still believe that DNA testing will eventually greatly enhance the accuracy of or replace EPDs as selection criteria.

George
This past January the dairy breeds began using genomic evaluations to enhance the accuracies of the current proofs. The animals with high accuracies gained very little from these DNA tests. The group that benefited the most is the young, unproven sires. Most of the young sires I saw were at 70% accuracy w/o having any offspring born. Granted 70% is quite low but I was impressed it could be that high off the bat. It will take until the spring of 2011 before we start getting any hard data back on these breedings to see just how things worked out. It's very exciting to see such advances in the way we evaluate the genetic merit of young animals.

That is very interesting. I would like to learn more of how the dna test results are being incorporated into epds. Is there a site that contains info on the evaluation you are referring to?
http://www.accelgen.com/Genomics.aspx
http://www.selectsires.com/genomics_menu.aspx
Just a couple links I found quickly on genomics. As of now it is only being used for dairy breeds but I would have to think that beef breeds would be coming in the future. If you google genomic evaluations you'll get all kinds of reading material.
 

Frankie

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The American Angus Assn is starting to incorporate them into EPDs. I just logged on to the Angus site and pulled up one of our weaned heifer's pedigree/EPDs. It has this note at the bottom "EPDs (CW, Marb, RE, Fat) are enhanced by genomic profiles generated by Igenity". I think, they'll be included with the regular EPDs next year:

The American Angus Association® has issued its first release of genomic-enhanced EPDs for multiple carcass traits, now available at www.angus.org through AAA Login or EPD/Pedigree lookup.

In an industry first, the updated National Cattle Evaluation (NCE) carcass trait EPDs are scheduled for weekly release and incorporate available breed-specific DNA profile results from the IGENITY® Profile for Angus in addition to all pedigree and performance information.

Through the use of new technologies, Angus NCE EPDs can be provided across the complete performance database for carcass traits, encompassing nearly 2 million animals. Genomic, carcass and ultrasound databases can be used to calculate NCE EPDs each week for Angus breeders and industry allies.

The process bypasses the need for interim procedures on animals with genomic profile results and speeds the information exchange for newly arriving ultrasound and carcass data received at the Association.

Visit www.angus.org to access the NCE genomic-enhanced EPDs for carcass traits. For more information call the Association at 816-383-5100 or e-mail [email protected].
 

Frankie

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From back in August:

I Am Angus—Association’s Bill Bowman Talks About Genomic Enhanced EPDs

By Chuck Jolley

August 27, 2009

Expected Progeny Differences (EPDs) are selection tools that have been around long enough to be old school. Over the years, they’ve been tested and proven reliable by cattle producers across the country as a primary way of making genetic improvement in beef cattle.

Bill Bowman, president of Angus Genetics Inc.®, is on the leading edge of genetic improvement for the beef industry. For over a decade, he’s been involved with the genetic evaluation programs for the American Angus Association®.

Given recent advancements in our understanding of the bovine genome, Bowman now sees enormous opportunity in coupling traditional genetic evaluation practices with DNA technology – and making these things available to the industry.

“We felt it was time to step it up and take genetic selection to the next level,” Bowman says. “We want to use the current DNA technology to enhance these selection tools by creating genomic-enhanced EPDs, combining the established performance database with DNA profiles that evaluate multiple traits instead of a single trait or test.”

He was talking about a new relationship between AGI and IGENITY® that will provide American Angus Association breeders with genomic-enhanced EPDs through the effective use of DNA technology.

Bowman said, “IGENITY and AGI have collaborated to develop the Igenity Profile for Angus. This includes DNA results for reproduction and maternal traits in combination with other economically important traits such as carcass, growth and efficiency. The addition of IGENITY’s genomic tools to our National Cattle Evaluation system will let us better characterize Angus genetics, improve the accuracy of EPDs on young animals, and explore traits that have been traditionally difficult to measure.”

The technology will benefit all sizes of seedstock operations – whether they are large or small – enabling all Angus seedstock producers to make genetic improvements more precisely in less time. That’s an enormous economic advantage for producers who will tap the benefits of this technology.

Genomic-enhanced EPDs will also allow commercial cow/calf operators to use the advanced science and technology to make rapid genetic improvements.

“Our breeders have used technology advancements like artificial insemination, embryo transplant and ultrasound for years to rapidly improve Angus genetics. Now, by adding DNA to their tool box,” explains Bowman. “It will allow cattlemen to make decisions that will improve their genetic selection decisions earlier in the production cycle.”

“The industry agreed that genomic-enhanced EPDs were the next advancement in DNA technology,” he says. “It was our responsibility at AGI as a genetic evaluation provider to the seedstock industry to take action and move the topic of genomic-enhanced EPDs from an industry discussion to a user-friendly solution.”

“We’re not inventing a new language,” he says, “we’re melding existing data with DNA technology.”

Asked about how long the melding process will take, Bowman said the list of available genomic-enhanced EPDs is being finalized now by the American Angus Association. “Producers will be able to access the data online late this year,” he says. “The spring 2010 Sire Evaluation Report will be available online in December 2009 and in print January 2010.”
 

alexfarms

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Like I have said before, Frankie, we(AHA members) probably ought to just ask our leaders to merge with the AAA. I don't think we'd have any lessor representation. Although, I am really not impressed with how the genetic problems in the AAA went "undected" all those years, but even that effort is probably better than the AHA.
 

Frankie

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alexfarms":21ykh15f said:
Like I have said before, Frankie, we(AHA members) probably ought to just ask our leaders to merge with the AAA. I don't think we'd have any lessor representation. Although, I am really not impressed with how the genetic problems in the AAA went "undected" all those years, but even that effort is probably better than the AHA.

Can you see any improvement since the Horned and Polled groups merged? And in defense of the AHA board, members have to step up and collect data before the AHA Board can do anything with it.
 

alexfarms

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Frankie":1lzirghw said:
alexfarms":1lzirghw said:
Like I have said before, Frankie, we(AHA members) probably ought to just ask our leaders to merge with the AAA. I don't think we'd have any lessor representation. Although, I am really not impressed with how the genetic problems in the AAA went "undected" all those years, but even that effort is probably better than the AHA.

Can you see any improvement since the Horned and Polled groups merged? And in defense of the AHA board, members have to step up and collect data before the AHA Board can do anything with it.

I had been in the Polled assn, although I had some horned Herefords also and subscribed to both journals. Looking back it wasn't so much a merger as an AHA takeover, I am not sure why. The AHA appears to me to be structured in such a way that change is very, very slow. I am not sure where I got this term, but someone else described it as "structured to support the status quo". It seems to be bigger than any board member or staff member can affect. The AHA is unresponsive, unrepresentative and ineffective in a lot of ways. As far as data collection goes, in my own experience it is frustrating to send in data and get nothing really usable back. Cow weights is one example. Instead of getting cow weight epds we get some kind of profit idex, that may be ahead of its time, but it is hard to interpret or use for promotion. There is a "bent" toward staying away from any data that puts show cattle or "continental type" cattle in a lesser light than "range type" cattle. As an example: When the steer feed tests were first instituted there were to be top 10 placing announced in several catagories. One of those areas was rea/cwt.......never happened.
 

Brandonm22

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alexfarms":1tn59zfy said:
The AHA is unresponsive, unrepresentative and ineffective in a lot of ways. As far as data collection goes, in my own experience it is frustrating to send in data and get nothing really usable back. Cow weights is one example. Instead of getting cow weight epds we get some kind of profit idex, that may be ahead of its time, but it is hard to interpret or use for promotion. There is a "bent" toward staying away from any data that puts show cattle or "continental type" cattle in a lesser light than "range type" cattle.

I think that is precisely WHY AHA does not have a $EN or maintenance energy EPD. A lot of those multi trait leading sires would suddenly have a "flaw" if it got out that their mama and typical daughters were 1700 pounders. No $EN, no mature weight, no mature height EPDs, and if Angus adds feed efficiency, fertility, and temperment EPDs the Hereford data set will really seem paltry by comparison.

On another note, I looked up a popular bull to see if Angus had added an EPD I was unaware of and was shocked to see Bon View New Design 878 now has 12,938 daughters data in the registry. Incredible. That bull has more daughters than 40+++ breeds have total cows.
 

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