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Kenny I will follow the advice of my vets. Are you a DVM?
I agree to follow the vets advice but i cant imagine why a vet would advise you to damage a high quality peice of meat instead of in the neck.
No i am not a vet but i strictly follow the Beef Quality Assurance guidelines and he should also. We will agree to totally disagree on this.
 
You should only shoot in the neck. Injection site will have tissue damage.
I will ask you like I asked Kenny are you a vet? I won't start a discussion about BQA and who influenced the policies. But will say we have some of our beef custom processed and they have told me they found no damaged tissue. Also my AI tech will only give one shot in the hip. He is a rep of a semen service and their research has found that injections in the hip are now effective. Have you ever went to a doctor and they said they couldn't give a shot in your arm it had to be in your rear? I have many times. You can give yours where you want. I will follow the advice of those with experience and knowledge and not what is posted on a FB forum.
 
I will state I give maybe 98% or more of all injections in the neck. The exceptions are when I've been told otherwise by those with experience and training or when a contact person like my AI tech gives shots. I hire him to perform a service. How he does it is his decision.
 
I agree to follow the vets advice but i cant imagine why a vet would advise you to damage a high quality peice of meat instead of in the neck.
No i am not a vet but i strictly follow the Beef Quality Assurance guidelines and he should also. We will agree to totally disagree on this.

Kenny have his isn't one vet or one practice. Every vet I've visited with have stated similarly. They say you have to use common sense and what works the best for the animal being treated. They rely on experience and research.
What about all the foreign beef being labeled as USA beef. Do you think all injections were in the neck? Do you feel they used only antibiotics that US producers can? It is like fighting a fire there are different option and opinions. I saw over 20,000 acres burn because a gov't official wouldn't allow any fire guards to be made on national grassland. The fire had to be fought after it left the grasslands. It was contained but still burned private buildings and residences once it left until they got total containment. Again INO common sense should be involved. But with gov't policies that isn't the case many times. I
 
Oh i agree on all the imported beef and the government regulations.
But my point is i also have to do what i feel is best. Like you i am old and set in my ways but im very strict on giving injections. Up to the point that a needle that gives the shot is never in the bottle. A needle is placed in the bottle, no matter whether antibiotics or vaccines, and the dosage is drawn up and then the needle stays in the bottle and another needle is used for giving the injections. Each vaccine has its own syringe and after im done with it each time everything is disposed of properly.
If your vets are comfortable with injecting anywhere thats their choice. We have a vet school 15 miles from here and students come to my farm to learn. They arent taught to give any injections except how recommended as BQA.
I do think you do a very good job with your cattle but we can agree to disagree on this one.
On the fires, remember i was at a fire that burned a lot of your grazing a few years ago. I do not agree with how many of the fires are handled.
 
Oh i agree on all the imported beef and the government regulations.
But my point is i also have to do what i feel is best. Like you i am old and set in my ways but im very strict on giving injections. Up to the point that a needle that gives the shot is never in the bottle. A needle is placed in the bottle, no matter whether antibiotics or vaccines, and the dosage is drawn up and then the needle stays in the bottle and another needle is used for giving the injections. Each vaccine has its own syringe and after im done with it each time everything is disposed of properly.
If your vets are comfortable with injecting anywhere thats their choice. We have a vet school 15 miles from here and students come to my farm to learn. They arent taught to give any injections except how recommended as BQA.
I do think you do a very good job with your cattle but we can agree to disagree on this one.
On the fires, remember i was at a fire that burned a lot of your grazing a few years ago. I do not agree with how many of the fires are handled.

Kenny the fire I was referring too was several years ago in extreme SW KS. It started as I remember from a hot bearing on a trailer. I had friends on the volunteer fire department. They had the fire under control when the head of the grasslands showed up and made them withdraw. Winds were high but shortly went into the 50-60 mph range. It raged across the grasslands. The fire fighters could only wait for it to leave. They had built fire guards but with the high winds it jumped in some parts. Buildings were lost and some equipment. Fortunately no lives. All because of the lack of common sense.
I don't reuse needles. I clean syringes.
My vets and techs don't believe in injecting anywhere. They believe some vaccines are best administered in the hip rather than the neck. Like I said I give a large % in the neck
 
I will ask you like I asked Kenny are you a vet? I won't start a discussion about BQA and who influenced the policies. But will say we have some of our beef custom processed and they have told me they found no damaged tissue. Also my AI tech will only give one shot in the hip. He is a rep of a semen service and their research has found that injections in the hip are now effective. Have you ever went to a doctor and they said they couldn't give a shot in your arm it had to be in your rear? I have many times. You can give yours where you want. I will follow the advice of those with experience and knowledge and not what is posted on a FB forum.
No I am not a licensed veterinarian however, I do provide all the veterinarian services to our cattle.
My knowledge and skills didn't come from Facebook.
Not sure why you would get upset and provide lengthy posts to justify injecting cattle in the rear.
People here make recommendations just trying to help other ranchers and I am just making a general statement that is common knowledge that you do not stick cattle in the rear.
 
No I am not a licensed veterinarian however, I do provide all the veterinarian services to our cattle.
My knowledge and skills didn't come from Facebook.
Not sure why you would get upset and provide lengthy posts to justify injecting cattle in the rear.
People here make recommendations just trying to help other ranchers and I am just making a general statement that is common knowledge that you do not stick cattle in the rear.

We provide all of our on the ranch vet services. At one point I helped a vet. There is a difference in making a statement and giving an opinion. It is your opinion you don't give a shot in the rear. There are many reputable men and women who do for specific reasons. Just because they give a shot elsewhere besides the neck don't make them wrong. I will continue to follow the advice of my vets and professionals who provide services I need. I give all shots to calves in the neck area.
 
No I am not a licensed veterinarian however, I do provide all the veterinarian services to our cattle.
My knowledge and skills didn't come from Facebook.
Not sure why you would get upset and provide lengthy posts to justify injecting cattle in the rear.
People here make recommendations just trying to help other ranchers and I am just making a general statement that is common knowledge that you do not stick cattle in the rear.

My understanding from vets and professionals that BQA is a set of guidelines pushed by the major packers but have no legal enforcement capability. They are a general set of guidelines but like your personal doctors an on site vet who knows what running cows in this area require.
 
I am a licensed veterinarian, and used a Cap-Chur gun extensively in the first 5 years of my career... which was long before the BQA standards came into practice. Our principal use was in tranquilizing cattle when the owners had no way to contain them for treatment (70% of beef producers in the state of TN, at that time, had NO working facilities).
As others have stated, SQ with a shot to the neck is best. I've seen plenty of darts bounce off the top of the hip and go ricocheting off into who knows where. Then neck makes a much better target... I would not recommend a client shoot them elsewhere if they can make a neck shot.
 
Hi, I just purchased the Pneu Dart air gun, 178B and it will be here tomorrow. I am purchasing Draxxin as well, I got a prescription from my vet. But, it says to put under the skin, not intramuscular, how can I shoot her with the dart to only go under the skin? I am using the 6cc U pneu dart darts. I keep reading that everyone uses Draxxin to treat pink eye, and they use the pneu dart gun to do it. I think I'm missing something. Someone please let me know if I can just use the dart and shoot her in the neck where it says to put the med.
IDK how close you can effectively get to your animals. You got the prescription from the vet. I would ask the vet where the best places to dart would be for the Draxxin. It will be a matter of where you dart the animals on their body and how far from the animal you are when you pull the trigger.
 
I use a Cap-Chur long barrel pistol, and like it. Not as bulky as a rifle, easier to carry along, particularly in the tractor cab. I feed in winter by unrolling my bales across the pastures. Cattle are all lined up single file pretty much along that swath. When I get done unrolling, I just drive along the line-up, stick my dart gun out the window and treat the one(s) that I need to... very simple and easy, and no rodeoing at all.

As for which meds work best, that's mostly a function of "thin vs. thick" solutions (thick doesn't "flow" out of the dart as easily or quickly, ...but if the dart stays in for the duration, the somewhat thicker formulations do still work ... think LA200 vs. Draxxin, for example). Having your med at room temp vs. frig temp is probably helpful. The biggest "concern" is the recommended dosage.... once an animal gets up over 1000#, if the med is calling for more than 1cc/100#, you're likely going to need a couple of darts. Biggest ones are 12.5cc..., and you usually don't want to inject any more than that in one site anyway. The "low dose meds" typically are the more expensive ones per cc... and if a dart happens to "bounce off", the meds are dispensed from the dart regardless... so that could potentially be a $50 shot wasted. Practice with your practice dart first, on an archery target or something similar in density to the animal... learn how your gun reacts to varying conditions (cold temps vs. warm, etc.), so you can adjust your shooting accordingly. Heavier darts (larger with more meds in them) very definitely and automatically become challenging... don't fly as well to start with, take alot more energy to propel properly, will have a quicker fall in the trajectory so you have to compensate, etc. CO2 cartridges are cheap compared to wasted meds.
 
My Pneu rifle just wasn't getting the darts out fast enough. There is a little hole under the pump lever for oil. So I put in a liberal dose of the oil which came with the rifle. First practice dart went threw 4 layers of card board and I lost the dart in the tall grass. So I moved my target to by the dog kennel. The dart once again went threw the card board and was sticking half way threw quarter inch plywood. I think it is working now.
 
My Pneu rifle just wasn't getting the darts out fast enough. There is a little hole under the pump lever for oil. So I put in a liberal dose of the oil which came with the rifle. First practice dart went threw 4 layers of card board and I lost the dart in the tall grass. So I moved my target to by the dog kennel. The dart once again went threw the card board and was sticking half way threw quarter inch plywood. I think it is working now.
Dave, for sure your gun is now delivering the dart, but how's the dog feeling about that target move (or has he now has become your practice for hitting a "moving target") ;)
 

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