• If you are having problems logging in please use the Contact Us in the lower right hand corner of the forum page for assistance.

Crapy Compose pile

cowboy43

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 7, 2009
Messages
1,942
Reaction score
0
Location
Central Texas
Know a young man who is passionate about about holistic and sustainable farming. He asked me to visit his operation. The first place we viewed was his compose pile. He is mixing human waste in his pile with the other things. I instantly told him I had stomach pains and felt like I was getting sick( an excuse to leave) . Makes me wonder how many other people who raise and sale vegetables use human waste in their compose pile. I got out of there as fast as I could before he asked me if I wanted to take a crap in his pile. :hide:
 

farmerjan

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 1, 2016
Messages
3,065
Reaction score
15
Location
Shenandoah ValleyVirginia
Sorry, human waste is not acceptable as fertilizer for vegetable production. In fact I do believe that there are several laws to prevent it. Has to do with the diseases that can be infective. I have no problem with it being used for some things, but not directly on gardens with vegetables. Use it for fertilizer on flowers and such, but after it has composted for a couple of years. There is alot of "bio-waste" sludge, that is being spread on some farms here; they have to get permits and all that and I don't know all the details. I do agree that it has to go somewhere, but there is the whole thing about heavy metals in sludge etc would make me very leery... I am very holistically minded with my garden and all and would NEVER use human waste in my compost pile that is feeding my vegetables.
 

dun

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 28, 2003
Messages
47,334
Reaction score
1
Location
MO Ozarks
In Japan it used to be (and maybe still is) referred to as "night soil"
 

Commercialfarmer

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 16, 2010
Messages
2,923
Reaction score
0
Location
Western Oklahoma
That is a serious violation common sense and an abomination to food safety. :shock: :???: :shock:

Vegetable pickers going in the fields is exactly how food born illnesses are often spread. And I believe that there is a much higher instance of illness with vegetables than meat.

With the influx of migration from 3rd world countries where parasites have not been eradicated, should make for some fun times at the hospital.

I hope there are no kids exposed to this madness.
 

Nesikep

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 13, 2008
Messages
15,989
Reaction score
57
Location
Lillooet, BC, Canada
I don't agree with it especially if the compost is used directly on human consumed foods.. if it's put on a pasture or something i don't see a problem with it.. I find it much easier to crap in the toilet though
 

True Grit Farms

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 4, 2016
Messages
9,453
Reaction score
2
Location
Middle Georgia
Next thing you know someone will be feeding chicken crap to cows. China feeds a lot of human waste to shrimp and tilapia, and exports it to other countries.
 

skyhightree1

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 9, 2009
Messages
19,770
Reaction score
0
Location
Free Rent ,VA
farmerjan":2gxhxw54 said:
Sorry, human waste is not acceptable as fertilizer for vegetable production. In fact I do believe that there are several laws to prevent it. Has to do with the diseases that can be infective. I have no problem with it being used for some things, but not directly on gardens with vegetables. Use it for fertilizer on flowers and such, but after it has composted for a couple of years. There is alot of "bio-waste" sludge, that is being spread on some farms here; they have to get permits and all that and I don't know all the details. I do agree that it has to go somewhere, but there is the whole thing about heavy metals in sludge etc would make me very leery... I am very holistically minded with my garden and all and would NEVER use human waste in my compost pile that is feeding my vegetables.

A lot of folks here use human sludge and have permits for it. I bought some land that only human waste was used on the pastures and they are some of the best pastures I EVER had. However, I did not continue the trend.
 

M-5

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 14, 2015
Messages
7,338
Reaction score
0
Location
AT the FLORIDA STATE line checking papers
 

skyhightree1

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 9, 2009
Messages
19,770
Reaction score
0
Location
Free Rent ,VA
farmerjan":349v7qed said:
Sorry, human waste is not acceptable as fertilizer for vegetable production. In fact I do believe that there are several laws to prevent it. Has to do with the diseases that can be infective. I have no problem with it being used for some things, but not directly on gardens with vegetables. Use it for fertilizer on flowers and such, but after it has composted for a couple of years. There is alot of "bio-waste" sludge, that is being spread on some farms here; they have to get permits and all that and I don't know all the details. I do agree that it has to go somewhere, but there is the whole thing about heavy metals in sludge etc would make me very leery... I am very holistically minded with my garden and all and would NEVER use human waste in my compost pile that is feeding my vegetables.

I just remembered a guy I ran into that did a fertilizer called poop soup and put on his tomatoes in his garden. He had some mighty fine maters... Poop soup was all the dog poop he could get and other poop. mixed with water until runny then poured on the plants.
 

Dave

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 12, 2004
Messages
8,855
Reaction score
55
Location
Baker County, Oregon
It is used in lots of third world countries. And I have fed a lot of hay that was grown using sludge. But in the garden...... maybe sweet corn as it never touches the soil but I think I will pass on the carrots.
 

TexasBred

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 15, 2007
Messages
30,439
Reaction score
10
Location
Heart of Texas
skyhightree1":ktkc03h3 said:
farmerjan":ktkc03h3 said:
Sorry, human waste is not acceptable as fertilizer for vegetable production. In fact I do believe that there are several laws to prevent it. Has to do with the diseases that can be infective. I have no problem with it being used for some things, but not directly on gardens with vegetables. Use it for fertilizer on flowers and such, but after it has composted for a couple of years. There is alot of "bio-waste" sludge, that is being spread on some farms here; they have to get permits and all that and I don't know all the details. I do agree that it has to go somewhere, but there is the whole thing about heavy metals in sludge etc would make me very leery... I am very holistically minded with my garden and all and would NEVER use human waste in my compost pile that is feeding my vegetables.

A lot of folks here use human sludge and have permits for it. I bought some land that only human waste was used on the pastures and they are some of the best pastures I EVER had. However, I did not continue the trend.

Really considerable difference in sewer plant sludge and raw shyt. Brother put the sewer plant sludge on his lawn when he built a new house. I think he mowed twice a week year round. :lol2:
 

skyhightree1

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 9, 2009
Messages
19,770
Reaction score
0
Location
Free Rent ,VA
TexasBred":1q74xk9b said:
skyhightree1":1q74xk9b said:
farmerjan":1q74xk9b said:
Sorry, human waste is not acceptable as fertilizer for vegetable production. In fact I do believe that there are several laws to prevent it. Has to do with the diseases that can be infective. I have no problem with it being used for some things, but not directly on gardens with vegetables. Use it for fertilizer on flowers and such, but after it has composted for a couple of years. There is alot of "bio-waste" sludge, that is being spread on some farms here; they have to get permits and all that and I don't know all the details. I do agree that it has to go somewhere, but there is the whole thing about heavy metals in sludge etc would make me very leery... I am very holistically minded with my garden and all and would NEVER use human waste in my compost pile that is feeding my vegetables.

A lot of folks here use human sludge and have permits for it. I bought some land that only human waste was used on the pastures and they are some of the best pastures I EVER had. However, I did not continue the trend.

Really considerable difference in sewer plant sludge and raw shyt. Brother put the sewer plant sludge on his lawn when he built a new house. I think he mowed twice a week year round. :lol2:

Off topic but my friend whos always pulling pranks on me I put 700lbs of fertilizer down on his yard while he was on vacation and it was a really rainy year.. He push mowed an acre and a half cause he said that was his exercise well he came back and had to mow his year 2-3 times a week then he broke down and bought a riding mower said all this rain was making his yard really grow.. I waited a year before I told him what I did :mrgreen:
 

dun

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 28, 2003
Messages
47,334
Reaction score
1
Location
MO Ozarks
People that think the stuff is safe probably think you can pick a turd up by the clean end
 

regolith

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 17, 2009
Messages
2,794
Reaction score
0
Location
New Zealand
Not legal, I think in this area too it is necessary to have a permit to use biosolids on agricultural land and can't imagine it would be approved for a dairy pasture.

I do bury cat soil in the garden, and grow ornamentals over those areas never vegetables... but to be fair, they also bury quite a lot themselves and I can't control where, any more than I can control whether or not the snails poop on the youngest kale leaves.
I can't see there being a safety issue provided the fecal matter isn't recycled directly into food production... human or animal food. Growing sweetcorn would be indirect.
Heavy metals are a whole different issue and I rather think if you had a lidded bucket for excrement and tipped it onto the compost heap daily there would be no chemical contaminants to cause problems, unlike sewage sludge which also catches all the household chemicals and industrial discharges... at one point all that would have been vented into the nearest river quite legally.
I saw my brother drink from such a river as a child - we were strictly forbidden to drink or swim in this river which of course meant that we concealed from our parents all evidence of having been swimming - and he's still alive today.
 

regolith

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 17, 2009
Messages
2,794
Reaction score
0
Location
New Zealand
How many food scares have there been recently where vegetables or fruit have made people sick or been found contaminated with e. coli?
From what I've seen, it's always blamed on some immigrant labour unit that didn't wash their hands after toileting and contaminated the produce.
Something that can't realistically be prevented - the farmer can provide proper facilities, but will 100% of the workers use them plus sanitiser 100% of the time?
But overlooks all the hundreds of other ways a piece of fruit can be contaminated before it reaches a table.
I used to work in a fruit shop as a kid. It is indescribable how filthy my hands got handling fruit - some of it because of the natural yeast blooms, some of it because of the proximity to other fruit that had rotted. Mostly I just didn't have a clue where all this filth came from. And then you simply can't control the shoppers who pick up an apple, examine it and replace it on the shelf... wash everything before eating, if that worries you.
 

gimpyrancher

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 8, 2009
Messages
819
Reaction score
0
Location
Southern Oregon
It's called Humanure. Mostly a byproduct of composting toilets. Funny how we can compost all kinds of animal manure for improving soil but humanure is somehow different. There is no contamination possible after composting.

Gotta say, it's funny to hear the stories and fears of people who have never researched the subject.

It is composted down to where no one could ever know what it was anymore than composting horse manure and identifying the remains as what it once was. It is not recommended for vegetable gardens. Great for fruit trees and shrubs. Composting toilets separate the liquid from the solids which prevent the mess and smell and avoids the need for sludge pools and leach fields. It is very common in areas where water is valuable.

They are also very popular in off grid homesteading.
 

Commercialfarmer

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 16, 2010
Messages
2,923
Reaction score
0
Location
Western Oklahoma
gimpyrancher":11f5aln1 said:
It's called Humanure. Mostly a byproduct of composting toilets. Funny how we can compost all kinds of animal manure for improving soil but humanure is somehow different. There is no contamination possible after composting.

Gotta say, it's funny to hear the stories and fears of people who have never researched the subject.

It is composted down to where no one could ever know what it was anymore than composting horse manure and identifying the remains as what it once was. It is not recommended for vegetable gardens. Great for fruit trees and shrubs. Composting toilets separate the liquid from the solids which prevent the mess and smell and avoids the need for sludge pools and leach fields. It is very common in areas where water is valuable.

They are also very popular in off grid homesteading.

Gimpy, the bolded statements are inconsistent with each other.

Maybe you should research the difference between animal manure being used on gardens vs human waste.

No possible contamination after composting? So composting in and of itself kills all pathogens???? No it doesn't.

Other means would need to be taken, and only someone wanting to win a darwin award would take chances with things like gardens/vegetables.

As stated, pastures where other species are consuming the plant growth is a different matter.

Why is it illegal to feed beef proteins to cattle? Or sheep proteins to sheep?
There is a very legitimate reason. But yet you can feed off species proteins to other species.

Very similar reasoning that human feces should never come into contact with food that will be consumed by other humans. They are called human pathogenic agents. Few pathogens cross species. So using cow manure is different than human waste. VERY different.

Regolith, the answer to why things are flushed in rivers is because "The solution to pollution is dilution." All things can be toxic. Water can be toxic. It's not that any one thing is present, it is a matter of what concentration it is present. Add thousands of gallons of running water, and a seriously toxic concentration of a substance can be quickly mitigated to non-toxic levels.
 

greybeard

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 5, 2012
Messages
19,309
Reaction score
21
Location
Cleveland Tx
Regolith, the answer to why things are flushed in rivers is because "The solution to pollution is dilution." All things can be toxic. Water can be toxic. It's not that any one thing is present, it is a matter of what concentration it is present. Add thousands of gallons of running water, and a seriously toxic concentration of a substance can be quickly mitigated to non-toxic levels.

Yep. I made a lot of $$ back in the early-mid 90s slurrying low level radioactive oilfield waste and pumping it back into the formations it came from, until the regs got changed and the states decided if you mixed it into enough soil (dilution) , it lowered the ratio of waste-to-soil enough to get below what was naturally there to begin with. Overnight, a niche industry died, but the primary proponent of changing the standards, (a big remediation company from Louisiana) made millions and millions of $$ 'landfarming' the same waste we were so careful to keep away from human and surface contact. "The solution to pollution is dilution."
 

Latest posts

Top