Coyotes killed a newborn calf *graphic pic*

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It's impossible for a North American to buy land in Mexico safely. So was wondering about Guatemala. And prices for good ground like yours. I suppose having a foreign investor in the neighborhood might be not be so good for you? Or are there advantages? Is it like here in the states with people leery of Californians moving in and bringing their social expectations with them? Just curious really... I'm reti
You can buy land down there for $1300-$2800 an acre for farming/cattle BUT not anywhere near the Southern, east coast, or parts of the west coast it all has to be the northern part of the country. Anywhere in the areas I mentioned, it's too expensive. There really are no advantages to having foreign investors. I don't think people have the mentality that having investors brings more job opportunities, at least in the small towns, I don't think they think about these things. Honestly, when I roam around town, people don't say anything to me they go about their business I go about mine, I mean, I do stick out like a sore thumb because the town I'm in is mostly mixed mestizo Mayan descent, so they know I am not from around there, white skin. freckles, light brown hair, and a Redbeard gives it away, LOL. My family that lives in Guatemala is either from the capital Guatemala City or the eastern part of the country. Most retired people from the states live in these places, city of Antigua, which is awesome! and Lake Atitlan, which is also awesome! the rest live in the capital city. my parents have a townhouse in the city in a gated community; the neighbors are a retired couple from Utah, and the other next-door neighbors are from Taiwan.

Check out this link to the homes that are for sale in Antigua and Lake Atitlan
https://www.antiguafinehomes.com/en/ they have some pretty incredible houses, and the construction is solid but not cheap.

FYI cost of living is cheaper except for fuel, it's about the same here in the states but less than California, where I hear it's over $6 a gallon.
 
It's impossible for a North American to buy land in Mexico safely. So was wondering about Guatemala. And prices for good ground like yours. I suppose having a foreign investor in the neighborhood might be not be so good for you? Or are there advantages? Is it like here in the states with people leery of Californians moving in and bringing their social expectations with them? Just curious really... I'm retired.
I know a couple ranchers that bought places in Mexico. lots of Americans buy homes there. you tecnically can't buy coastal property or ejido land, but there are ways around it.
 
You can buy land down there for $1300-$2800 an acre for farming/cattle BUT not anywhere near the Southern, east coast, or parts of the west coast it all has to be the northern part of the country. Anywhere in the areas I mentioned, it's too expensive. There really are no advantages to having foreign investors. I don't think people have the mentality that having investors brings more job opportunities, at least in the small towns, I don't think they think about these things. Honestly, when I roam around town, people don't say anything to me they go about their business I go about mine, I mean, I do stick out like a sore thumb because the town I'm in is mostly mixed mestizo Mayan descent, so they know I am not from around there, white skin. freckles, light brown hair, and a Redbeard gives it away, LOL. My family that lives in Guatemala is either from the capital Guatemala City or the eastern part of the country. Most retired people from the states live in these places, city of Antigua, which is awesome! and Lake Atitlan, which is also awesome! the rest live in the capital city. my parents have a townhouse in the city in a gated community; the neighbors are a retired couple from Utah, and the other next-door neighbors are from Taiwan.

Check out this link to the homes that are for sale in Antigua and Lake Atitlan
https://www.antiguafinehomes.com/en/ they have some pretty incredible houses, and the construction is solid but not cheap.

FYI cost of living is cheaper except for fuel, it's about the same here in the states but less than California, where I hear it's over $6 a gallon.
$1300-$2800 an acre isn't any bargain in the States. Or are you saying that price in some other form of money? Or is it in quetzals? Is that the price of grazing lands in US dollars?
If so... HOLY Cow!!!
 
I know a couple ranchers that bought places in Mexico. lots of Americans buy homes there. you tecnically can't buy coastal property or ejido land, but there are ways around it.
Yeah... I've known people that bought property in Mexico too. I also know that the government nationalizes foreign owned property at their whim. They never do it consistently, or all of it at once... just certain locations at a time, and it could be decades until it happens, or never (so far). Betting the ranch is not my kind of gamble.
 
$1300-$2800 an acre isn't any bargain in the States. Or are you saying that price in some other form of money? Or is it in quetzals? Is that the price of grazing lands in US dollars?
If so... HOLY Cow!!!
I think it's cheap considering I'm live in NYC and a houses for sale are over 1.4 million for a 20x40 home. I can tell you that my property taxes in guatemala are only the equivalent of $100 US. I would of thought farm land here in the US would of been more money.
 
I probably live in the poorest area or close to it in Ohio and you won't get land for under $1300 an acre. And that's hillside ground that has been overgrazed, full of weeds and autumn olive.
 
I think it's cheap considering I'm live in NYC and a houses for sale are over 1.4 million for a 20x40 home. I can tell you that my property taxes in guatemala are only the equivalent of $100 US. I would of thought farm land here in the US would of been more money.
Yeah... rural real estate here has gone up unreasonably too. I bought my first ranch for $625 an acre with a three bedroom house, an old saw mill, and a barn that was ready to fall down. Enough grass that I could keep a pair on two acres. My second I had to look hard and long to find for $833 an acre, but it had a decent house, a 40X80 shop, and a good 120X120 barn, and other outbuildings. Of course I sold it for quite a bit more, but it was a better place by then. After improving the pastures I could make a cow/calf unit work on six acres.
Where I live now I could never buy in and expect to pay for it with cattle. There is no way in Hell. I've seen ground here that a cow couldn't survive on go for more than I paid for my last place.
Thanks for the information. I like that place and your stock. Guatemala might be a place I'd like to visit.
 
The cow and calf that's nursing that one I think died from botulism and was found dead the same morning as the one that was eaten, botulism or some kind of infection is the only thing I can think of that can make them die in. 24hrs. The eaten calf is another calf that was born the same day later that night and found not far from the other calf.
Looking into a game camera would not be a bad idea. Any suggestions.
The cow dying from botulism is certainly a possibility but a young new born calf, I don't know about. Are your soils phosphorous deficient? Botulism is often from chewing bones from old carcases in phosphorous deficient country. Poultry litter can also be a good source for the spores.

Ken
 
The cow dying from botulism is certainly a possibility but a young new born calf, I don't know about. Are your soils phosphorous deficient? Botulism is often from chewing bones from old carcases in phosphorous deficient country. Poultry litter can also be a good source for the spores.

Ken
Hi Ken yes the whole northern part of Guatemala is deficient in phosphorus. I was also thinking pneumonia but it hasn't rained in 7 days and it's usually in the 90's down there. The cows do get minerals and no added salt. Also add vitamins to the water and that also has a bit of salt. But the water troughs are 250 gallons so the vitamins are diluted. I think next time I'm just going to bite the bullet and have an autopsy done.
 
Hi Ken yes the whole northern part of Guatemala is deficient in phosphorus. I was also thinking pneumonia but it hasn't rained in 7 days and it's usually in the 90's down there. The cows do get minerals and no added salt. Also add vitamins to the water and that also has a bit of salt. But the water troughs are 250 gallons so the vitamins are diluted. I think next time I'm just going to bite the bullet and have an autopsy done.
Aspirative pneumonia requires no inclement weather for a newborn anything.
 
I think wvbs58 hit on the problem.. That the problem is not the coyotes but how the chicken waste is handled (mishandled)
It would appear the handling methods are resulting in the aforementioned botulism. Unless I misunderstand it would seem the
manure, litter and dead chickens are being spread on the grazing land. If you said, I missed what you did with the feathers and
waste (if any) from processing. Assuming you are in a management position, or have the ear thereof, would composting be a
viable financial consideration? No disrespect intended but I can't imagine what it must be like to be interred alive in NYC.
I think open land in Guatemala has a nice ring to it! I have no relation that I know of in New York since Grandpa Rapalje sold
the farm on Brooklyn. (I think the street sign reads Rapaleye. It is down in the old navy yard. Anyway I do hope you get the
botulism situation handled to your satisfaction. I do believe there is some good ore in these forums albeit takes a little refining
at times to get to the gold.
 
Hi Ken yes the whole northern part of Guatemala is deficient in phosphorus. I was also thinking pneumonia but it hasn't rained in 7 days and it's usually in the 90's down there. The cows do get minerals and no added salt. Also add vitamins to the water and that also has a bit of salt. But the water troughs are 250 gallons so the vitamins are diluted. I think next time I'm just going to bite the bullet and have an autopsy done.
We have a dedicated botulism vaccine here, it is a single dose but requires a yearly booster. I give to my cows around weaning before they go into my 600 acre dry cow scrub block. I lost 2 cows in there during the drought in 2019, cows had been seen chewing on old bones.

Ken
 
Smaller animals-predators, yes. Otherwise pretty opportunistic scavengers. He mentioned he had another dead calf. The one pictured looked really "clean" for being attacked and killed.
last spring my neighbor had a new born calf killed by coyotes confirmed by the states DNR officer. not limited to "smaller animals" as a predator.
 
The cow dying from botulism is certainly a possibility but a young new born calf, I don't know about. Are your soils phosphorous deficient? Botulism is often from chewing bones from old carcases in phosphorous deficient country. Poultry litter can also be a good source for the spores.

Ken
You got me thinking now. I read your comment with more thought after Lee va Ross posted. The chickens do hang out near the house. But the cattle never graze near the chickens or the house. I'd say the closest pasture is about 500-600 ft. I think if it happens again I'm just going to get someone to pick up the calf and take it to a lab.
 
We have a dedicated botulism vaccine here, it is a single dose but requires a yearly booster. I give to my cows around weaning before they go into my 600 acre dry cow scrub block. I lost 2 cows in there during the drought in 2019, cows had been seen chewing on old bones.

Ken
That's what I need. Unfortunately the ones I've found are good for 6 months.
 
Sorry for your loss.

I'm not gonna ask if it had an underbite.
Well, I am going to ask if they had a normal bite? I haven't tracked the facial bone underdevelopment further south than Mexico. A veterinarian in Mexico wrote a whole book on the subject of underbite in Indicine cattle breeds like the calves in the photos. If the calves died and were eaten, why is it necessary to shoot the clean-up crew? We really have to stop killing wildlife for no good reason. Apparently, you are in New York, but I would still be interested in you checking the bite and reporting what you find since you are raising an Indicine breed of cattle. Thanks.
 
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You got me thinking now. I read your comment with more thought after Lee va Ross posted. The chickens do hang out near the house. But the cattle never graze near the chickens or the house. I'd say the closest pasture is about 500-600 ft. I think if it happens again I'm just going to get someone to pick up the calf and take it to a lab.
And check the bite!
 

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