Cow Manure - Patty or Mound?

[newtondak]

In reading here, I ran across a post where someone was having problems with calving and the question was asked as to whether the manure was pattys or mounds? Is the form of the manure an indication of a problem, and if so, what would that be?

 

[Jogeephus]

Don't know the context of what you read but it might have been directed toward the nutrition of the cattle. If you have high mounds the feed is poor. I can't find the link but there is a good article posted somewhere on the board that addresses this issue and has photos indicating the nutrient level.

 

[novatech]

Don't know the context of what you read but it might have been directed toward the nutrition of the cattle. If you have high mounds the feed is poor. I can't find the link but there is a good article posted somewhere on the board that addresses this issue and has photos indicating the nutrient level.

I remember the pics you are speaking of. I saved them but can't locate them in my manure pile of favorites. I did find this .http://www.gov.mb.ca/agriculture/livest ... 25s52.html
As far as how it relates to a cow calving i don't know except that cattle under stress will often get the runs. You ever notice how some cattle get the squirts when you are working them?

 

[Jogeephus]

I don't really understand the context if he meant labor trouble or percent calving problems. On the latter I started really watching the patties and making adjustments accordingly. Most all of my problems went away and calving percent increased tremendously.

 

[rockridgecattle]

I think the original poster is refering to this thread.
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=55589

In the original thread, the first poster was talking about calving problems and we asked about nutrition as a possible problem

 

[milkmaid]

Under normal circumstances (excluding disease, etc), it's an indicator of the level of protein in the diet. The lower the protein, the more "stiff" the manure is. The higher the protein, the runnier the manure is... ie, dairy cattle on a high protein diet have some of the loosest manure you will ever encounter other than actual diarrhea. Fiber content and water intake can also affect manure, but protein levels tend to be the main reason.

Loose manure when working cattle is caused by a release of epinephrine (adrenaline) due to stress. Just FWIW.

 

[CKC1586]

All this talk about poop had me looking over the girls piles this morning while doing my chores. I have one gal that always is looser than the others but they all get the same feed. I think they can have differences in their digestive system insofar as how they process their food. Some are a bit more sensitive.

 

[Jogeephus]

All this talk about poop had me looking over the girls piles this morning while doing my chores. I have one gal that always is looser than the others but they all get the same feed. I think they can have differences in their digestive system insofar as how they process their food. Some are a bit more sensitive.

Just wondering, the one that has a looser stool, is she an easy keeper or is there any difference? I was just wondering this because I recently listened to a speaker who suggested that you could enhance the rumen which would in turn cause the cow to better utilize the feed given it. Not trying to make any specific statements just kinda wondering.

 

[CKC1586]

All this talk about poop had me looking over the girls piles this morning while doing my chores. I have one gal that always is looser than the others but they all get the same feed. I think they can have differences in their digestive system insofar as how they process their food. Some are a bit more sensitive.

Just wondering, the one that has a looser stool, is she an easy keeper or is there any difference? I was just wondering this because I recently listened to a speaker who suggested that you could enhance the rumen which would in turn cause the cow to better utilize the feed given it. Not trying to make any specific statements just kinda wondering.

Great question. I wish I could have attended that seminar. I have three sisters, one will get fat on rocks and sticks, one is very average. The looser gal I just got in September, she was pretty thin when I got her and worked hard to get condition on her before winter set in while paying attention to not going crazy with too much. She has done pretty well thru the winter but doesn't have the condition her sisters do. I thought it was very interesting when they were talking about the visual on the poop indicating the feed quality. These girls get the exact same diet but have different poop.
edit: Oh, and what did they suggest to do to enhance the rumen???

 

[rockridgecattle]

Great question. I wish I could have attended that seminar. I have three sisters, one will get fat on rocks and sticks, one is very average. The looser gal I just got in September, she was pretty thin when I got her and worked hard to get condition on her before winter set in while paying attention to not going crazy with too much. She has done pretty well thru the winter but doesn't have the condition her sisters do. I thought it was very interesting when they were talking about the visual on the poop indicating the feed quality. These girls get the exact same diet but have different poop.
edit: Oh, and what did they suggest to do to enhance the rumen???

I really was stunned on this post until i read further down you were talking about cows and not your sisters
We buy a rummaker pellet. It comes in 50 # bags and you only use a little at a time in the grain ration for each cow. When hubby rolls grain he mixes in a little at a time. It helps two ways.
1. helps the cows make use of the feed and covert to energy better
2. the pellet we buy if you feed it about for about a month to 6 weeks before calving will reduce the codcidiosus (sp) load coming out the butt reducing the chances of calves getting it.

I have to say it really helped getting our cows in condition for calving. The cold had taken its toal on them and with the addition of grain and rummaker, the cows were able to gain...so were the calves in gestation

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Rockridge - sounds like your "runmaker" pellets must be Rumensin or Bovatec (both coccidiostats) both enhance the cattles ability to utilize thier feed.

 

[rockridgecattle]

Rummensin i believe. but i honestly do not believe the cattle would not have gained like they did in the last several week if we had not put the rummaker in the grain. Beware, too much can cause problems, i am told

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Yes, it is a great additive. But, as you say, a little goes a long way, and too much is NOT GOOD. We have it added to our mineral year round. Cows utilize hay better in the winter & grass better in the summer. Summer - what a thought - we're getting snow right now - yuk!

 

[TexasBred]

Rummensin i believe. but i honestly do not believe the cattle would not have gained like they did in the last several week if we had not put the rummaker in the grain. Beware, too much can cause problems, i am told

Check the tag on the pellets. May contain Rumensin but probably also a high protein pellet between 26% and 32% protein for mixing with grain. Read the ingredients and it will most likely contain all the needed vitamins, minerals and maybe yeast products. The only drawbacks is having to mixthe correct amount of pellets with grain to get the desired crude protein in the complete mix. (Mixing instructions may be on bag or tag). Rumensin can sometimes knock cattle "off feed". Bovatec works very similar and is more "forgiving".

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

I just realized I read that wrong - it's RUMmaker - so that makes me more convinced it must be a Rumensin product.

 

[CKC1586]

Great question. I wish I could have attended that seminar. I have three sisters, one will get fat on rocks and sticks, one is very average. The looser gal I just got in September, she was pretty thin when I got her and worked hard to get condition on her before winter set in while paying attention to not going crazy with too much. She has done pretty well thru the winter but doesn't have the condition her sisters do. I thought it was very interesting when they were talking about the visual on the poop indicating the feed quality. These girls get the exact same diet but have different poop.
edit: Oh, and what did they suggest to do to enhance the rumen???

I really was stunned on this post until i read further down you were talking about cows and not your sisters
We buy a rummaker pellet. It comes in 50 # bags and you only use a little at a time in the grain ration for each cow. When hubby rolls grain he mixes in a little at a time. It helps two ways.
1. helps the cows make use of the feed and covert to energy better
2. the pellet we buy if you feed it about for about a month to 6 weeks before calving will reduce the codcidiosus (sp) load coming out the butt reducing the chances of calves getting it.

I have to say it really helped getting our cows in condition for calving. The cold had taken its toal on them and with the addition of grain and rummaker, the cows were able to gain...so were the calves in gestation

:lol: :lol: :clap: rockridge you aren't the only one that thought at first I was talking about human sisters! I got a cute pm from another of us up nort gals....
Ya, I been dancing on a tight rope with these girls this winter, have to be careful that Pieds don't get too much protein late in the gestation or calves will be bigger than we like. But this darn cold winter and Jalo starting out thin has been tough to get them dialed in. She is the first one due in about a week so we will see how good a job I have done. I have not heard of rummaker, you get it from your feed store/mill??

 

[Jogeephus]

All this talk about poop had me looking over the girls piles this morning while doing my chores. I have one gal that always is looser than the others but they all get the same feed. I think they can have differences in their digestive system insofar as how they process their food. Some are a bit more sensitive.

Just wondering, the one that has a looser stool, is she an easy keeper or is there any difference? I was just wondering this because I recently listened to a speaker who suggested that you could enhance the rumen which would in turn cause the cow to better utilize the feed given it. Not trying to make any specific statements just kinda wondering.

Great question. I wish I could have attended that seminar. I have three sisters, one will get fat on rocks and sticks, one is very average. The looser gal I just got in September, she was pretty thin when I got her and worked hard to get condition on her before winter set in while paying attention to not going crazy with too much. She has done pretty well thru the winter but doesn't have the condition her sisters do. I thought it was very interesting when they were talking about the visual on the poop indicating the feed quality. These girls get the exact same diet but have different poop.
edit: Oh, and what did they suggest to do to enhance the rumen???

This was something called Bovazyme. Its more of a probious type treatment that you mix in feed or mineral. There are a few people around here using it and I'll know their opinions in a few months. Have used rumensin and bovatec before but this is a little different.

 

[rockridgecattle]

CK,
we Feed Rite / Ridley makes this product. So yes we get it from the feed mill in 50# sacs. I think hubby uses a few cups maybe more but not a whole lot in a 5 gallon pail of rolled barley wieght about....oh boy...24 or 34 # been a while since he told me