COOL and National Animal ID System?

[Texan]

Oldtimer, I wasn't talking about using a quality grade stamp to label it. One of the things the Industry will have to do is to come up with an acceptable label.

And the packer and retailer will label it if there's money in it. They do it with CAB every day! There's no reason that the same principle won't work.

Just imagine if the Federal government had told all of the breeds years ago to come up with their own branded product and given them mandatory guidelines to do it with. Would we have anything as successful as CAB? I don't think so! The Angus people have a success with CAB because its consumer driven, but producer managed. Not because the government makes them label it as CAB!

 

[Oldtimer]

Oldtimer, I wasn't talking about using a quality grade stamp to label it. One of the things the Industry will have to do is to come up with an acceptable label.

And the packer and retailer will label it if there's money in it. They do it with CAB every day! There's no reason that the same principle won't work.

Just imagine if the Federal government had told all of the breeds years ago to come up with their own branded product and given them mandatory guidelines to do it with. Would we have anything as successful as CAB? I don't think so! The Angus people have a success with CAB because its consumer driven, but producer managed. Not because the government makes them label it as CAB!

Just because you buy CAB does not guarantee you are getting an American product- What is wrong with a plain old stamp that says "product of USA".

 

[la4angus]

Texan
Oldtimer said USDA inspected stamp. Not USDA "Quality Grade Stamp".


(quote)Oldtimer, I wasn't talking about using a quality grade stamp to label it. One of the things the Industry will have to do is to come up with an acceptable label. (quote)


(quote)The problem Texan is that the packers won't label our own- They use the same USDA inspected stamp on Aussie beef, Canadian beef, Mexican beef and Uraquayan beef as they do on American beef- their is no way for the consumer to tell what country it came from.(quote)

 

[Texan]

Just because you buy CAB does not guarantee you are getting an American product- What is wrong with a plain old stamp that says "product of USA".

I never intended to imply that the CAB label guaranteed an American product. And I sure don't want to fire up the CAB debate again. Just that they are guaranteeing what the product is, without the government making them do it. I'm just suggesting that the same principle could work on origin.

And you're absolutely right on the USDA stamps. It is very confusing to the consumer. Just one more example of something the government doesn't do right.

Your suggestion for the stamp that says "product of the USA" sounds like a winner to me. I just don't want the federal government in charge of it.

 

[Texan]

Texan
Oldtimer said USDA inspected stamp. Not USDA "Quality Grade Stamp".

You are correct, LA. That's not what he said. But most consumers don't see a stamp anymore because of closer trims. But what they are familiar with are the terms such as "USDA Choice" or "USDA Select Heavy Grain Fed Beef." These terms are used by retailers to advertise and its the only USDA terminology that most consumers are familiar with. And therein lies the problem that Oldtimer and I surely agree on. The misconception that the consumer has because the USDA is even involved in the current labeling.

 

[la4angus]

Lots of retailers use USDA Inspected and I have seen some ads advertising USDA heavy beef. Tells you nothing.

(quote)These terms are used by retailers to advertise and its the only USDA terminology that most consumers are familiar with. And therein lies the problem that Oldtimer and I surely agree on. The misconception that the consumer has because the USDA is even involved in the current labeling.(qupte)

 

[CattleAnnie]

Up here we already have a mandatory ID law in place. Currently we're using the bar code ear tags, however they will be phased out next year in favour of the chips. The ear tags aren't all that big a deal, we tag our calves at the same time we band them, and recheck at branding time. Uses the same applicator as my regular tags. When we're shipping animals, we simply run any that lost a tag through the headgate and re-apply. Yes, it's a bit of a pain, but better to have the trace back in case of another disaster. Currently if you even butcher an animal on your farm and take it to the local meat cutter for sausage, cut&wrap, what-have-you, the dead animal must be tagged before leaving the property. At least that one doesn't have to be chute run before tagging!

The cows tend to lose them from time to time (round bales with frozen twines can be a real bugger), which is why the CCIA has moved to the chip method. Supposedly the cost isn't going to be too high, but I'll let you know in the spring when they become available to us. Apparently all you need to apply the chip is the implant gun... not too cost prohibitive, and the chip isn't supposed to travel too far when you put it in the ear like that.

Anyway, by next spring I'll be able to let you know how it goes. Good luck with the dilemna.

Take care.

 

[Texan]

Lots of retailers use USDA Inspected and I have seen some ads advertising USDA heavy beef. Tells you nothing.

You're absolutely correct. Tells me nothing. Tells you nothing. Tells Oldtimer nothing. But as Oldtimer said, the consumer thinks it tells them something important.

The USDA sword is a mighty powerful one for the retailer to wield. We as an industry, along with the consumer, should provide more oversight for USDA. Not vice versa.

 

[la4angus]

You're 100% correct about this.

(quote)The USDA sword is a mighty powerful one for the retailer to wield. We as an industry, along with the consumer, should provide more oversight for USDA. Not vice versa.

 

[ollie]

I would personally prefer to see a totally transparent data stream from cool. It would be a benefit to purebred and commercial producers alike to be able to see what data was collected in the feed lot and packing house as it relates to profitable aspects of feeding and packing cattle. I would like to know for instance which bulls calves feed the cheapest or grade the best irrespective of a breed or ranch that it comes from. I think this is the best possible situation for producers , to not only know where a calf comes from but how it is bred . Can you imagine the improvements that could be made with this type of info? Yes I understand that it would be too labor intensive but I can dream cant I. I'm afraid once again we as producers will do all the work and recieve very little benefit as real profit.

 

[txag]

Yes I understand that it would be too labor intensive but I can dream cant I. I'm afraid once again we as producers will do all the work and recieve very little benefit as real profit.

it won't be labor intensive. all the data will be there. all they have to do is match the tag to the carcass data. the question is.....how much will they charge you to give the info to you?

fwiw, this is already available for those who choose to market this way.

 

[ollie]

It's not there like I would like. Every calf with info. Your bull may be the best however I can't go to a website and see the data in a spread sheet or as a ratio . I think with all the calves being taged it wouldn't be a big stretch to see all the data applied to the data bank so we could use it.

 

[Texan]

Ollie, sounds like what you want would open a whole 'nother can of worms. But it wouldn't have to have anything to do with whether or not we have COOL. Seems to me like it would be more related to National ID.

And it would probably be a natural progression of the National ID system in years to come. Like you said, "...with all the calves being tagged, it wouldn't be a big stretch..." I just don't want to have to pay for it for you. Like txag said, its already available for those that want it. And if its something that you think would benefit you, I think you should have the right to have it. I don't want it, so don't make me pay for you to have it.

After you get that set up, there's no reason you couldn't use your data and get with the packer and retailer and start a voluntary COOL. When the rest of us see the extra returns the consumer is willing to provide you, then we might choose to join you. But give us the choice.

 

[Oldtimer]

The homepage of cattletoday has a good article on where we set on the livestock ID program- Its in the Hunting Daylight section- Definitely read the last paragraph because I think it pretty much sums up the point of where we're at in the plan- don't have conception yet, but at least we've decided on the mating.

 

[Texan]

You're right, Oldtimer. That is a good article. Thanks for the tip.

....but at least we've decided on the mating.

Afraid the cow-calf man might be in on the wrong end of that mating. So, what's new, right?

 

[C & C Land & Catt]

I think that they should be optinal. It would just add another cost per head and I think we have enough of that already. In our operation 50 cents per head adds up. If they wanted to make it mandatory they could add a per carcass price for every calf they tagged. Then the goverment could take that money and give a % of it to the cow-calf man to offset his cost. Just a thought to help spread some of the cost around. I agree with la4 that opening up our exports would help the market but I do not think that one segement of the industry (cow-calf) should absorb all of the cost.

 

[Anonymous]

Hello all, great topic! I attended 1 of the Beef ID Academy sessions at KSU last month. They have a list of 25 companies in a chart for people to check out prices ect. The chart can be found on http://www.beefstockerusa.org/ .There is a link to the survey.
You may not have to do all cattle individually eithor, if the herd has always been the same and you dont add new cattle to it you may ID them as a lot when selling them. If you add 3 cows, you change the herd so therefore they would all have to be tagged. You will also be given an owner ID for your pastures/ lots. Give consideration to the fact if you have several pastures (not touching) at different locations you may want an ID # for each pasture. This way if there is a problem they wont quaranteen (sp.?) everything just the pasture/s suspect animal had been living in. Granted you'd have to keep your cattle as pasture herds and not intermix them, but if you have 1000 cows or keep cattle at several places its an option. If you choose to do the ear tag find out all hidden cost before deciding, some charge little amounts if they have to add your data and some do not. Some you can do all the data yourself (as much or as little as you decide) and when you go online it will enter your data automatically ,saving you paying them. One company said they would charge only 25 cents to add data per cow, well that would add up quickly if you want alot of info per cow listed.