Color definitions?
- Thread starter J. T.
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J. T.":19qbxrn5 said:
I can't help you with the Tobiano and Overo question, but - as it was explained to me by a Paint breeder - the difference between a Paint and a Pinto is the line of demarcation between the colors. A Paint has a very clear line of demarcation (no black, red, etc., in the white areas), whereas with a Pinto the color will 'bleed' into the white areas in the form of colored hairs at the edge of the white, or white hairs at the edges of the color. I hope this helps.
Kiger Lady
New member
The difference between a Paint and a Pinto is based solely on the breed of the horse. To be a registered Paint the horse must be of Paint, Quarter Horse or Thoroughbred descend and a Pinto is any other breed that has painted markings. For registry purposes the American Paint Horse Association (APHA) goes by bloodlines and the Pinto Horse Association goes by color. If you breed a Paint to a Quarter Horse and get color you have a Paint, if you breed a Paint to a Morgan and get color you have a Pinto.
The difference between Overo and Tobiano is the pattern of white. An Overo is a basic solid color with irregular splashes of white that doesn't cross the back. A Tobiano is a white base coat with irregular splashes of solid color that cross the back. The color of either can be any color (ie. bay, black, sorrel, dun, roan, palomino)
The difference between Overo and Tobiano is the pattern of white. An Overo is a basic solid color with irregular splashes of white that doesn't cross the back. A Tobiano is a white base coat with irregular splashes of solid color that cross the back. The color of either can be any color (ie. bay, black, sorrel, dun, roan, palomino)
kjones
Well-known member
Ok, so what is skewbald,and piebald? I've read the definition before but forgot.
I posted this a while ago (to Ellie) so I just did a copy and paste, but it should answer your question:
Ellie I'll try to answer your questions;
First you have the APHA, American Paint Horse Assoc., It is a breed all its own, they allow only Quarter horses in to the mix, but the Quarter Horse can be an appendix QH or have Thouroughbred in it, but the TB comes from the QH side. Lots of paints bred to QH's...lots.
Second you have the American Pinto horse Assoc. which is a color regristry (sp). Meaning any horse with enough white on it can be regristered with the Pinto Assoc. Arabs crosses, Paints, Saddlebreds, Mini's, etc.
If you get a solid colored or min. white on your Paint horse than it is still regristered as an American Paint Horse, but it's called a "Breeding Stock" Paint (which get very little respect in the paint world). But you can still breed them and get a colored baby (regristered).
The AQHA and the APHA are always changing thier rules on what can be regristered, how much white,etc., but for the most part, you can not have double regristered horse, but there are some out there that slipped through the loop holes one of the assoc. didn't close for a year or so. Both assoc. just changed the rules again in the beginning of 2004 so that you can't have double regristered horse.
Before 2004 a QH bred to a QH that produces a foal with too much white could be regristered under both QH and Paint assoc. That foal is called a "crop out" Quarter horse. again, I'm under the impression that the APHA changed that in 2004 to not allow crop outs to be regristered with them. QH assoc. has stated that crop outs are undesirable as did Paints, but as of 2003 they could be doubled regristered...how can that be undesirable? Again I have not kept up with the last rule change with crop outs but I believe that is how it is.
If you bred a paint to your Quarter Horse it could only be regristered under APHA (paint).
Hope I covered all your questions.
Since I wrote this APHA and AQHA did do a rule change and now there is more double reg. horses, although a crop out can no longer be reg APHA.
The easiest way to tell the difference in a Overo and Tobi is a Tobi (tobiano) will have the same coloring on the head a QH. Solid colored head with maybe a star or blaze ect., not excessive White on the head. If they have excessive white on the head and white over the back they are a Trevro (sp).
I don't know or haven't heard of the two types of bald you mentioned, on of my problem with paint breeders is some tend to make up there own words, doesn't mean this is the case.
But a bald face is a face that all white to behind the eye. I have always heard and used that a horse (always a overo) has a bald face, particle (sp) bald or bald on the right/left side.
Hope this helps,
Alan
Ellie I'll try to answer your questions;
First you have the APHA, American Paint Horse Assoc., It is a breed all its own, they allow only Quarter horses in to the mix, but the Quarter Horse can be an appendix QH or have Thouroughbred in it, but the TB comes from the QH side. Lots of paints bred to QH's...lots.
Second you have the American Pinto horse Assoc. which is a color regristry (sp). Meaning any horse with enough white on it can be regristered with the Pinto Assoc. Arabs crosses, Paints, Saddlebreds, Mini's, etc.
If you get a solid colored or min. white on your Paint horse than it is still regristered as an American Paint Horse, but it's called a "Breeding Stock" Paint (which get very little respect in the paint world). But you can still breed them and get a colored baby (regristered).
The AQHA and the APHA are always changing thier rules on what can be regristered, how much white,etc., but for the most part, you can not have double regristered horse, but there are some out there that slipped through the loop holes one of the assoc. didn't close for a year or so. Both assoc. just changed the rules again in the beginning of 2004 so that you can't have double regristered horse.
Before 2004 a QH bred to a QH that produces a foal with too much white could be regristered under both QH and Paint assoc. That foal is called a "crop out" Quarter horse. again, I'm under the impression that the APHA changed that in 2004 to not allow crop outs to be regristered with them. QH assoc. has stated that crop outs are undesirable as did Paints, but as of 2003 they could be doubled regristered...how can that be undesirable? Again I have not kept up with the last rule change with crop outs but I believe that is how it is.
If you bred a paint to your Quarter Horse it could only be regristered under APHA (paint).
Hope I covered all your questions.
Since I wrote this APHA and AQHA did do a rule change and now there is more double reg. horses, although a crop out can no longer be reg APHA.
The easiest way to tell the difference in a Overo and Tobi is a Tobi (tobiano) will have the same coloring on the head a QH. Solid colored head with maybe a star or blaze ect., not excessive White on the head. If they have excessive white on the head and white over the back they are a Trevro (sp).
I don't know or haven't heard of the two types of bald you mentioned, on of my problem with paint breeders is some tend to make up there own words, doesn't mean this is the case.
But a bald face is a face that all white to behind the eye. I have always heard and used that a horse (always a overo) has a bald face, particle (sp) bald or bald on the right/left side.
Hope this helps,
Alan
kjones
Well-known member
I looked up these definitions on webster online. "Piebald" 1. composed of incongruous parts. 2. of different colors ; especialy : spotted or blotched with black and white. "Skewbald" 1. marked with patches of white and any other color but black. So basically they are in reference to color combinations.
Piebald is the british term for a black and white pinto. Also any other animal that is black and white can be described as piebald. Skewbald is a chestnut, bay, or whatever other colour pinto you have. But not black. That's piebald.
hayray
Well-known member
Alan":yjkkalge said:
That is the most in depth explanation I have heard.
one extra thing about the Pintos is that they do not register horses with cold blood in them. I posted a picture of a Tobiano pattern on the mule or horse topic page but the mare is half cold blood so she could not be registered as a Pinto in the American Pinto Horse Association.
randiliana
Well-known member
msscamp":ya9bb7qt said:
Cold blood is the draft horses. Hot blood is Arab, Thoroughbred and Warmblood is pretty much everything else, from QH and paints to the "actual" Warmbloods to appy's and ponies(I think) Basically anything that could be a mixs of Cold and Hot blood.
hayray
Well-known member
Alan":1z0lscge said:
TBs are generally considered hot blooded (the blood horse). Now that would be the pure Thoroughbreds. Your question about the Saddlebred brings up some interesting points also about the Saddlebred and the QH's because those breeds are simply TB derivatives, just modern breeding has changed the phenotypes but the genetics all came from the same thing. However, the QHs' and the Saddlebreds as well as many lines of Thoroughbreds have during Colonial times been crossed with the English Hobby horses and Pacers - all that were pretty much lateral gaited like the modern walkers and racking horses. So you probably should consider the Saddlebred more of a warmblood horse and only really consider the Arab as the true hot blooded horse but because of the TBs' initial history in England being crossed with Arabians I think that is still considered a hot blood, wheather technically or by what everybody percieves them to be hot blooded.
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