CIDRs

[jaydill]

Well hello everyone! Many of you may not recognize me, but I used to frequent the boards a while back. Ever since I've been in college, though, I haven't had much time to stop by and post and such...but every once in a while I do try to browse the boards to see what's going on and to pick up extra knowledge.

I'm working on a project for my Reproductive Physiology class and I had a question for those of you familiar with the use of CIDRs to synchronize estrus in a breeding program. In my research, I found that it costs about [EDIT] $12 per head to use CIDRs; that is purely the cost of the CIDR and the CIDR applicator. With time and facility requirements set aside, when do you think it would NOT be cost effective to use CIDRs to synchronize estrus in your females? (As in, how many females would you have to have for it to be cost INeffective to use CIDRs to synchronize estrus?)

Thanks!
Jay

 

[dun]

You either need to edit the dollar amounts or check again on the costs.
A couple of years ago we used them in 2 cows and even with the shots it was less then 20 bucks a head

 

[CWT Angus]

I agree- that price is way off. Runs us $7-10/ head

 

[jaydill]

Ahh...I'm sorry, that is my mistake. It is $115 for a 10ct of CIDRs so...it would be ~$12/hd for the CIDRs. I suppose since this price is so cheap...at about $12/hd, and factoring in the time requirement, when do you think it would be cost INeffective to use CIDRs to synchronize estrus in your females?

 

[dun]

when do you think it would be cost INeffective to use CIDRs to synchronize estrus in your females?

From our own limited use and that at the dairy I think any use of them is a waste of money. I know there are people that have had great succes with them but not us.

 

[angus9259]

Dun, do you sync then? lutylase?

 

[dun]

Dun, do you sync then? lutylase?

Nope. The only time we give anything is if it's suspected cystic cow.

 

[jaydill]

Thanks Dun! Okay, one more quick question. Let's say that using the CIDRs did work for you program. About how many head of cattle would make using CIDRs too time and cost INeffective?

 

[dun]

Thanks Dun! Okay, one more quick question. Let's say that using the CIDRs did work for you program. About how many head of cattle would make using CIDRs too time and cost INeffective?

I'll leave that for the folks that use them and have had success with them. It's too dependent on what you're time is worth for me to comment on.

 

[novatech]

I do not use them, so there may be something that I am not aware of. I cannot understand why there would be any cost or time increase on a per cow basis. Generally speaking the more one does something the more efficient they become at it. Secondly the more of an item you purchase the less it should cost. In reality I would think your question should be; How much time and money can one save by doing more cows with CIDRs?

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Don't think any of us would have that kind of answer for you. Sync programs are only cost affective "IF" you don't have the time to heat check your cattle and you are trying to improve your calf crop thru AI, than turn out a clean up bull.
I don't sync any of my cattle. Not cost affective to sync 1 cow in our operation. Like Dun, I only use Lut or Cyctorellin when there is a problem. I tried Cidrs on heifers once & was not happy with results.

 

[Angus In Texas]

We use CIDR's in a timed AI protocol because we don't have the time with day jobs, to be able to heat detect and AI on natural heats. CIDRs run $9.50 a piece and drugs around $11.... so we have roughly $20 in synchronization.

As far as how many head would be considered inneficient???? well when I worked in Idaho we synched up over 500 head of recips using CIDRs so it is all dependent upon the goal of the operation and considering the cost of the CIDR is a per head cost and not a lump sum cost that is not dependent on number of animals, you can't say that 100 head is effiecient and 101 is not. You must look at the return generated by having calves sired by AI bulls as well as the importance of a tight calving season. You also have to keep in mind the extra costs of cows that don't respond or settle on first service...... will you reimplant a CIDR and try again, breed on natural heat, or turn out the clean up bull?

So if it were me doing a report I would have to put in it that there is no set number as to wether it is efficient or not and should be based more on the goals of the breeding program at hand.

 

[bandit80]

Well hello everyone! Many of you may not recognize me, but I used to frequent the boards a while back. Ever since I've been in college, though, I haven't had much time to stop by and post and such...but every once in a while I do try to browse the boards to see what's going on and to pick up extra knowledge.

I'm working on a project for my Reproductive Physiology class and I had a question for those of you familiar with the use of CIDRs to synchronize estrus in a breeding program. In my research, I found that it costs about [EDIT] $12 per head to use CIDRs; that is purely the cost of the CIDR and the CIDR applicator. With time and facility requirements set aside, when do you think it would NOT be cost effective to use CIDRs to synchronize estrus in your females? (As in, how many females would you have to have for it to be cost INeffective to use CIDRs to synchronize estrus?)

Thanks!
Jay

I have used CIDRs extensively the last three years on my registered cows, and last two years on my heifers. I have had great success with them. I use the timed AI protocol for my heifers, and the last two years I have been able to have 15 out of 18 heifers conceive through the timed AI. This is above the average, and I suspect the average will catch up with me at some point, but it is what it is. Of the three heifers that did not conceive, they all had their calves on the next cycle, being bull bred. That is approximately 3 weeks after the AI due date, the other three calved.

I have not had near the success with conception rates with my cows, but there are many unseen benefits from getting yours cows synchronized. The last three years, I have use the CIDRS and timed AI on 69 head. I have gotten 32 head of AI calves the last three years. Now this is below 50%, but as with the heifers, I get a huge number of calves in about 3 weeks after the AI due date. Therefore, it appears the cows all respond to the CIDR, but just don't settle to the AI. It has helped me have almost 80% of my calves in the first 3 weeks of calving season, and be essentially done by week 6.

If you are using the CIDR and a timed AI, you will have about $35-40 wrapped up in the cost of the CIDR, drugs, and the semen. It has been cost effective for me because it leads to improved genetics on bulls and replacement heifers through AI, and a bigger and more uniform calf crop come weaning.

 

[bandit80]

So if it were me doing a report I would have to put in it that there is no set number as to wether it is efficient or not and should be based more on the goals of the breeding program at hand.

I think that sums it up pretty well.

 

[jaydill]

Thank you all for your responses! I was thinking I might get a pretty good range of opinions, and I have, so I really appreciate this input.

Thanks again for your time!
Jay

 

[JMichal]

Well hello everyone! Many of you may not recognize me, but I used to frequent the boards a while back. Ever since I've been in college, though, I haven't had much time to stop by and post and such...but every once in a while I do try to browse the boards to see what's going on and to pick up extra knowledge.

I'm working on a project for my Reproductive Physiology class and I had a question for those of you familiar with the use of CIDRs to synchronize estrus in a breeding program. In my research, I found that it costs about [EDIT] $12 per head to use CIDRs; that is purely the cost of the CIDR and the CIDR applicator. With time and facility requirements set aside, when do you think it would NOT be cost effective to use CIDRs to synchronize estrus in your females? (As in, how many females would you have to have for it to be cost INeffective to use CIDRs to synchronize estrus?)

Thanks!
Jay

DITTO :tiphat:

I have used CIDRs extensively the last three years on my registered cows, and last two years on my heifers. I have had great success with them. I use the timed AI protocol for my heifers, and the last two years I have been able to have 15 out of 18 heifers conceive through the timed AI. This is above the average, and I suspect the average will catch up with me at some point, but it is what it is. Of the three heifers that did not conceive, they all had their calves on the next cycle, being bull bred. That is approximately 3 weeks after the AI due date, the other three calved.

I have not had near the success with conception rates with my cows, but there are many unseen benefits from getting yours cows synchronized. The last three years, I have use the CIDRS and timed AI on 69 head. I have gotten 32 head of AI calves the last three years. Now this is below 50%, but as with the heifers, I get a huge number of calves in about 3 weeks after the AI due date. Therefore, it appears the cows all respond to the CIDR, but just don't settle to the AI. It has helped me have almost 80% of my calves in the first 3 weeks of calving season, and be essentially done by week 6.

If you are using the CIDR and a timed AI, you will have about $35-40 wrapped up in the cost of the CIDR, drugs, and the semen. It has been cost effective for me because it leads to improved genetics on bulls and replacement heifers through AI, and a bigger and more uniform calf crop come weaning.

 

[milkmaid]

Hey Jaz,

Welcome back to the boards! sure haven't seen you around in awhile. How's college treating you? what kind of classes are you taking?

I'm in Wyoming... still on the prevet route. Mostly taking alot of pre'req classes for now.

Claire

 

[Double R Ranch]

We also use CIDRs. We purchased 13 new heifers last year and sync'd them all using CIDR's. Our Semen provider sells the CIDR's at $9.50 a "plug".
Out of 13 heifers Sync'd 9 took first time. Now being this was the first time using a sync program we AI'd 72 hours after the CIDR was pulled. This was what was recomended by the semen salesman. Two heifers we re-sync'd and they both came in at 24 hours after removal. Explains why they didn't take the first time. The other two heifers haven't shown signs of heat to date. Feeding them out on pasture til prices get a bit better then they will grow wheels.
I think this year we will do the same sync program but breeding on 12 hours after observed standing heat. At whatever time that may be.
Our reasoning for using a sync program is because atleast in our area a calf crop that is uniform is worth way more at sale time. We feel we will make our money back when it comes time to sell and we don't use a clean up bull. We will be using this program on our entire herd this year so hopefully it will work just as well.
In school (AI school) they talked about doing ranches that had hundreds of thousands of head of cattle. Sync'd them with CIDR's ,lute and GNRH. Pull calves for atleast 48 hours before breeding to greatly boost fertility. They (the school) and the ranchers love it! Claim it is worth every penny. Short calving season uniform calf crop to offer and less work for them to AI at a certain time.
Just my opinion. Will look forward to Sync'in my whole herd this year! Worth every penny to us!
Take care
Double R

 

[Sage]

It doesn't really matter if it is 1 or 1000 head, figure about $20.00ea for the cidr and shots and a few pennies for the labor. We use cidrs with very good results, last year everything was timed AI but we try to heat detect a little from the time cidrs are pulled till breeding. The 72hr period there is always a few that will come in that would be missed just by time breeding. We had a 73% AI conception rate last year on a one service breeding this way. This is on 150hd cow herd. We then use a clean up bull put in a couple weeks after breeding for about 30 days. Open cows (2 this year) are sold and late calvers(2nd heat with the bull) need to get it together or they are gone by the next year(one this year). This works very well for us and helps out for a quick calving season, cosistant calf crop and a very fertile cow herd.

 

[Keren]

Hi and welcome back! Good to see you again

I can give you a different perspective on CIDRs, but I'm not sure whether its relevant.

I am familiar with the sheep and goat CIDRs as well as the cattle CIDRs, but I thought I would comment on the sheep ones because the pros and cons of the cattle ones have been stated already.

The sheep and goat CIDRs have worked very well for us. You may or may not know that AI in sheep and goats is commonly done surgically, via a laparoscopic incision, and the semen is deposited directly into the uterus. It has to be done by a vet. For these reasons, estrous HAS to be synchronised. You can use this method of AI and use natural detection. CIDRs work well for this.

I am also using CIDRs to allow for stud services for particular goats. I am able to identify the particular goat or goats I want bred, put CIDRs in them, then I put them in the trailer, take them out to where the stud sire is, and remove the CIDRs. It gives me better fertility than the AI, and generally works better if the stud sire is relatively close by, and of the same Johnes status.