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Checkoff Poll

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Anonymous

Guest
> I'm just curious as to why those
> that voted YES or NO did so?

> I voted yes, because I believe the
> Checkoff works! How can you prove that the check off is working?

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OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
How can you tell that the check off is working?

Look at the increase in beef demand Look at the increase in beef advertisement on radio, TV, etc. That all comes from check off dollars. To pay $1/hd is not such a bad sacrafice for national advertisement.
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
> I'm just curious as to why those
> that voted YES or NO did so?

> I voted yes, because I believe the
> Checkoff works!

Check-offs are probably a necessary part of doing business today. Historically, I think folks in several industries utilized this approach because they know an industry will initially approve of this method of promoting their product. The dollar per head used in the cattle industry was probably good to get things going, but I think this needs to be reduced to .25-50 cents a head now. It is taking too much needed money out of the hands of the producer and I am a little concerned about true and accurate accountability and I don't mean anyone is being dishonest, but the system may have some faults. Animals in Texas are sold and resold which generates numerous dollars, certainly more than one dollar per head, for the checkoff. I realize advertising etc. is very expensive, but keeping and creating jobs for administrative cost is a less priority at present when the livestock producer is struggling to survive. As for foreign exports of beef, if a country wants to keep U.S. beef out they will find a way, no matter how good the product or how much it is promoted. Are we really getting the biggest bang for our bucks? There will be those that disagree with me, and I certainly respect anyone who sees this differently. I am not against the check off just refining it.

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OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
Phil, if you will buy and read my new book, you will never vote yes again for the Beef-check-off.

"PAST,PRESENT and how we can survive for the FUTURE in the beef cattle business"

>

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OP
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Anonymous

Guest
Hello Benjamin,

Nice to hear from you again. Tell us more about your book. Where can we find it? Robert McCaskill

> Phil, if you will buy and read my
> new book, you will never vote yes
> again for the Beef-check-off.

> "PAST,PRESENT and how we can
> survive for the FUTURE in the beef
> cattle business"

[email protected]
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
Where did you vote? I definitely support the checkoff. The last few years, especially, I think it has really helped sell our beef.

> I'm just curious as to why those
> that voted YES or NO did so?

> I voted yes, because I believe the
> Checkoff works!

[email protected]
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
> Where did you vote? I definitely
> support the checkoff. The last few
> years, especially, I think it has
> really helped sell our beef.

Frankie,

This site had a poll on the front page a week or so ago and that's where I voted!

Phil in MS

[email protected]
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
> Phil, if you will buy and read my
> new book, you will never vote yes
> again for the Beef-check-off.

> "PAST,PRESENT and how we can
> survive for the FUTURE in the beef
> cattle business"

I never said the Check-Off was perfect, but it's the only thing I see that we have going! As far as a vote I wish we would go ahead and have one so that we could put this behind us!

As for the LMA action, they are against the check off but haven't suggested any kind of replacement!

IMHO, without these funds, I believe that there are many groups that are against the beef industry ( and other food producing industries) and they simply don't care about facts, food or hunger!

I believe the Check-off gives beef producers a war chest when these fringe groups attack the industry and that allows us to provide a source of funds to provide facts and show that beef, along with other food items are safe to our consumer!

When you give me a possible program that will replace the Check-off with but assist in promoting beef at the same time I will be interested in seeing what is suggested! I don't believe, however, in turning off the water without and alternate source of water!

Thanks,

Phil in MS.

[email protected]
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
> Check-offs are probably a
> necessary part of doing business
> today. Historically, I think folks
> in several industries utilized
> this approach because they know an
> industry will initially approve of
> this method of promoting their
> product. The dollar per head used
> in the cattle industry was
> probably good to get things going,
> but I think this needs to be
> reduced to .25-50 cents a head
> now. It is taking too much needed
> money out of the hands of the
> producer and I am a little
> concerned about true and accurate
> accountability and I don't mean
> anyone is being dishonest, but the
> system may have some faults.
> Animals in Texas are sold and
> resold which generates numerous
> dollars, certainly more than one
> dollar per head, for the checkoff.
> I realize advertising etc. is very
> expensive, but keeping and
> creating jobs for administrative
> cost is a less priority at present
> when the livestock producer is
> struggling to survive. As for
> foreign exports of beef, if a
> country wants to keep U.S. beef
> out they will find a way, no
> matter how good the product or how
> much it is promoted. Are we really
> getting the biggest bang for our
> bucks? There will be those that
> disagree with me, and I certainly
> respect anyone who sees this
> differently. I am not against the
> check off just refining it.

I will not deny that the Check-off may need some fine tuning!

One of the compliants that producers may have is they don't see where the money is going! Well most of the ads are used in consumer magazines or other consumer media, that I as a producer don't use or even see!

I don't wish to see the ads in cattle magazines! We're trying to sell beef and that means the ads should be in the consumer media outlets! These ads also tell the good and healthy side of beef!

Now due to inflation over the past 10 years, our Check-off dollar will not go as far as it did in 1986! IMHO I would consider an increase per head by a .25 or .50, but I would not want to see a reduction at this time! Maybe later when more people see these fringe groups for what they are!

Phil in MS.

Phil in MS.

ph[email protected]
 
OP
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Anonymous

Guest
Well I guess it would be very difficult to swear that it is beneficial, but if you look at beef demand increasing in the last several quarters at a time when FMD and BSE are in the media daily, I believe that increase is due to Check-Off influences! Those infuences would be advertising in TV and print media and point of sale literature and cooking helps in the beef counter! Though it may not seem like much to you and me, many meat counter's are being restyled to include cuts of beef by cooking method and time, which is aiding the consumer in selecting various cuts and most importantly helping them prepare the cut so that they get the best flavor and taste! I believe this is bringing them back again and again!

Even my wife is sold on some of the new microwave dishes that are precooked and only require 4 minutes to heat and serve! Hormel has two or three excellent tasteing items and now I get beef on weeknights, instead of chicken, chicken and more chicken!

Talk to you later, Curtis!

Phil in MS.

[email protected]
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
> I'm just curious as to why those
> that voted YES or NO did so?

> I voted yes, because I believe the
> Checkoff works!

I voted yes because I believe in the overall program. I have just read all of the responses here and they all make a lot of sense (except Benjamin C. Roberts but he probably did not get the biggest lolly pop in 1st grade either). I am in full agreement that a small cow/calf operation like mine cannot afford the kind of advertisement campaign that I see in the media. Some seem to think that the ads for micro wave dishes and the quick meals will benefit the meat wholesalers alone, but where are they getting the beef to put in their products? My benefit may be indirect but that does not lessen its value to me.

There are two areas where my check off dollar is used that I did not see mentioned in any of the previous responses. (1) Half of my check off dollar stays in the state where I sell my calves. That means that the money is used at home for local education, research and promotion. (2) While promotion and research were both at least alluded to, there has not been anything said about the educational benefits. Part of my check off dollar goes to the educational system. These dollars will go a long way in providing a stronger customer base for our product in years to come, as well as helping the youth of our nation plan for a healthier lifestyle.

One other thought and then I am gone. Some one mentioned that an individual animal may be sold several times and therefore will put maybe $5.00 or $6.00 into the program. My first reaction to that is to retain ownership. While my operation is to small to do that, it is an option. At the same time, the argument does not hold water because when I sell the calf, I pay $1.00 and I am finished with that animal. If it sells 50 times after that, it does not affect me except to add another $49.00 to a program that is working for my benefit.

So much for my opinion, thanks for listening.

[email protected]
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
> I voted yes because I believe in
> the overall program. I have just
> read all of the responses here and
> they all make a lot of sense
> (except Benjamin C. Roberts but he
> probably did not get the biggest
> lolly pop in 1st grade either). I
> am in full agreement that a small
> cow/calf operation like mine
> cannot afford the kind of
> advertisement campaign that I see
> in the media. Some seem to think
> that the ads for micro wave dishes
> and the quick meals will benefit
> the meat wholesalers alone, but
> where are they getting the beef to
> put in their products? My benefit
> may be indirect but that does not
> lessen its value to me.

> There are two areas where my check
> off dollar is used that I did not
> see mentioned in any of the
> previous responses. (1) Half of my
> check off dollar stays in the
> state where I sell my calves. That
> means that the money is used at
> home for local education, research
> and promotion. (2) While promotion
> and research were both at least
> alluded to, there has not been
> anything said about the
> educational benefits. Part of my
> check off dollar goes to the
> educational system. These dollars
> will go a long way in providing a
> stronger customer base for our
> product in years to come, as well
> as helping the youth of our nation
> plan for a healthier lifestyle.

> One other thought and then I am
> gone. Some one mentioned that an
> individual animal may be sold
> several times and therefore will
> put maybe $5.00 or $6.00 into the
> program. My first reaction to that
> is to retain ownership. While my
> operation is to small to do that,
> it is an option. At the same time,
> the argument does not hold water
> because when I sell the calf, I
> pay $1.00 and I am finished with
> that animal. If it sells 50 times
> after that, it does not affect me
> except to add another $49.00 to a
> program that is working for my
> benefit.

> So much for my opinion, thanks for
> listening.

Mack, I have a difficult time understanding why you say my opinion on one animal generating multi dollars for the check off doesn't hold water. My point was that a million head of cattle may generate 5-10 million dollars for the check off not just one million. The check off is a money hungry machine that just takes too many dollars out of the producers hands. My other concern is that saying that the multiple sale of one animal doesn't effect you or I but once may be tunnel vision on your part and mine too. We concentrate on how things affect each of personally and not on the big picture of how much money this takes from producers as a whole. I do appreciate your opinion and don't disagree with you except on this one point. Check offs are used in the ag commodity (crop ) industry and unless the industry has a very vision oriented board of directors alot of funds are wasted or not used for the purpose(s) that they were intended. Just my opinion.

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OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
> Mack, I have a difficult time
> understanding why you say my
> opinion on one animal generating
> multi dollars for the check off
> doesn't hold water. My point was
> that a million head of cattle may
> generate 5-10 million dollars for
> the check off not just one
> million. The check off is a money
> hungry machine that just takes too
> many dollars out of the producers
> hands. My other concern is that
> saying that the multiple sale of
> one animal doesn't effect you or I
> but once may be tunnel vision on
> your part and mine too. We
> concentrate on how things affect
> each of personally and not on the
> big picture of how much money this
> takes from producers as a whole. I
> do appreciate your opinion and
> don't disagree with you except on
> this one point. Check offs are
> used in the ag commodity (crop )
> industry and unless the industry
> has a very vision oriented board
> of directors alot of funds are
> wasted or not used for the
> purpose(s) that they were
> intended. Just my opinion.

Mike

Some one in this series said that the program probably needs some fine tuning. I agree with that and your point is well taken. In an ideal world, (??) I would like to think that the 5-10 million dollars you talked about, would be used for bigger and better ads to promote OUR product. We both know that it will seldom work that way and we would be well served to be able to place some checks and balances on the system. When some one comes up with a plan to do that, I will be in line to support it. In the mean time, I do not want to throw out the baby with the bath water. We have a good system that is doing a good job of promoting our product. I understand and appreciate what you are saying about taking mega bucks out of the producers hands, but on a cow to cow basis, I only sell my calves one time. This spring, I sold some cow calf pairs and the cows were young. It cost me $2.00 per pair and that is all it will ever cost me. The cows may be sold 2 or 3 more times in their life time and we know the calves will be sold at least 4 or 5 more times. That is the decision of the new owners. We could exempt the feed lots from the program but why should he be exempt any more than the producer? We could exempt the producer that sells the calf for the first time but would that be fair to the backgrounder? My point is, when you talk about each animal producing multiple check off dollars, who gets the break? I am open to improvements in the system but we need to be sure they are quality improvements and not just eye wash and lip service to satisfy the mercenary desires of a few. I honestly believe, Mike, that you and I are on the same track, we just have a minor variance on this one point. One other consideration that has a bearing on this discussion. I believe that actors and athletes are way over paid, but the big names sell products whether it is shaving cream or steak. Just maybe,; those extra check off dollars are paying for the big names. Best regards,

Mack

[email protected]
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
> Mike

> Some one in this series said that
> the program probably needs some
> fine tuning. I agree with that and
> your point is well taken. In an
> ideal world, (??) I would like to
> think that the 5-10 million
> dollars you talked about, would be
> used for bigger and better ads to
> promote OUR product. We both know
> that it will seldom work that way
> and we would be well served to be
> able to place some checks and
> balances on the system. When some
> one comes up with a plan to do
> that, I will be in line to support
> it. In the mean time, I do not
> want to throw out the baby with
> the bath water. We have a good
> system that is doing a good job of
> promoting our product. I
> understand and appreciate what you
> are saying about taking mega bucks
> out of the producers hands, but on
> a cow to cow basis, I only sell my
> calves one time. This spring, I
> sold some cow calf pairs and the
> cows were young. It cost me $2.00
> per pair and that is all it will
> ever cost me. The cows may be sold
> 2 or 3 more times in their life
> time and we know the calves will
> be sold at least 4 or 5 more
> times. That is the decision of the
> new owners. We could exempt the
> feed lots from the program but why
> should he be exempt any more than
> the producer? We could exempt the
> producer that sells the calf for
> the first time but would that be
> fair to the backgrounder? My point
> is, when you talk about each
> animal producing multiple check
> off dollars, who gets the break? I
> am open to improvements in the
> system but we need to be sure they
> are quality improvements and not
> just eye wash and lip service to
> satisfy the mercenary desires of a
> few. I honestly believe, Mike,
> that you and I are on the same
> track, we just have a minor
> variance on this one point. One
> other consideration that has a
> bearing on this discussion. I
> believe that actors and athletes
> are way over paid, but the big
> names sell products whether it is
> shaving cream or steak. Just
> maybe,; those extra check off
> dollars are paying for the big
> names. Best regards,

> Mack I could be wrong about this and if I am it won't be the first time, but I understand that not all transfers require the $1.00 per head check-off when it is a order buyer that is buying for others! How that works I'm not sure, but the producer pays a $1 and then when the calf settles at it next home and that grazier/stocker sells another $1 is paid! A $1 is paid by the feeder when he sells to the packer and I would think that would be the last time a $1 is paid! I'm not sure that packers pay when product is shipped to groceriers? I could be wrong however!

Phil in MS.

[email protected]
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
> Phil in MS.

Phil,

I think you are absolutely right. As I understand it, a cattle buyer is not an owner so he does not pay the check off dollar. The man he is buying for will be the new owner and therefore will pay the check off dollar. Typicaly, a buyer will sit in a sale barn and bid on the cattle that his employer is looking for. When the sale is over or the buyer has a semi load, then he settles up at the sale barn office and they will send the bill to the new owner, who pays the sales commission, any handling fees AND the check off dollar. The buyer, who is just an agent, is paid for his services by the new owner.

There is another scenerio that will put a whole new spin on it. There are speculative buyers in my area that will go to sale barn in county "A" on Saturday and buy 6 or 8 calves. They will turn them out on pasture and watch the market for a couple of weeks and take them to a sale barn in county "B" and turn a small profit. Another spec. buyer may buy some of the same calves and do the same thing. In the course of 3 or 4 months, the same calf could be sold 6 or 8 times and he is still not ready to go to the feed lot. There is $6.00 -$8.00 in check off money in the coffers plus what will be collected by the final backgrounder, the feed lot and the finisher.

As I understand it, the check off dollar is collected on every LIVE animal sold. Thus the slaughter house pays it but if they sell the carcass to a packer, it will not be collected again. Some interesting thoughts and more fodder for discussion. Best regards,

Mack

[email protected]
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
> Phil,

> I think you are absolutely right.
> As I understand it, a cattle buyer
> is not an owner so he does not pay
> the check off dollar. The man he
> is buying for will be the new
> owner and therefore will pay the
> check off dollar. Typicaly, a
> buyer will sit in a sale barn and
> bid on the cattle that his
> employer is looking for. When the
> sale is over or the buyer has a
> semi load, then he settles up at
> the sale barn office and they will
> send the bill to the new owner,
> who pays the sales commission, any
> handling fees AND the check off
> dollar. The buyer, who is just an
> agent, is paid for his services by
> the new owner.

> There is another scenerio that
> will put a whole new spin on it.
> There are speculative buyers in my
> area that will go to sale barn in
> county "A" on Saturday
> and buy 6 or 8 calves. They will
> turn them out on pasture and watch
> the market for a couple of weeks
> and take them to a sale barn in
> county "B" and turn a
> small profit. Another spec. buyer
> may buy some of the same calves
> and do the same thing. In the
> course of 3 or 4 months, the same
> calf could be sold 6 or 8 times
> and he is still not ready to go to
> the feed lot. There is $6.00
> -$8.00 in check off money in the
> coffers plus what will be
> collected by the final
> backgrounder, the feed lot and the
> finisher.

> As I understand it, the check off
> dollar is collected on every LIVE
> animal sold. Thus the slaughter
> house pays it but if they sell the
> carcass to a packer, it will not
> be collected again. Some
> interesting thoughts and more
> fodder for discussion. Best
> regards,

> Mack

Let's also add that imported beef is also charged based on a slaugther weight formula that I don't know! Knida like $1 per 1000 lbs of imported fresh or frozen beef! This is not likely the correct amount but one should understand that imported fresh meat or frozen gets to pay a comparable $1!

One other item as you stated above the slaughter house pays it! I don't think that is correct because they collect it from the feeder! Now when the fresh meat goes to groceriers, if a check-off is collected, then the slaughter house pays! At least that's what I think may happen! The person selling pays, and the person or enitity buying does the collection and submits payment of funds on a monthly basis!

Phil in MS

[email protected]
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
> Let's also add that imported beef
> is also charged based on a
> slaugther weight formula that I
> don't know! Knida like $1 per 1000
> lbs of imported fresh or frozen
> beef! This is not likely the
> correct amount but one should
> understand that imported fresh
> meat or frozen gets to pay a
> comparable $1!

> One other item as you stated above
> the slaughter house pays it! I
> don't think that is correct
> because they collect it from the
> feeder! Now when the fresh meat
> goes to groceriers, if a check-off
> is collected, then the slaughter
> house pays! At least that's what I
> think may happen! The person
> selling pays, and the person or
> enitity buying does the collection
> and submits payment of funds on a
> monthly basis!

> Phil in MS

Phil,

You are right again. I mis-stated it when I said the the slaughter house pays. It is always the seller that pays the $1.00. I found a web site that may be of interest to you and I found several answers to things we were talking about. First of all, I learned that the processor and the retailer are not obligated to pay the check off, yet they are the ones that benefit most directly. I also just happened upon the formula that you aluded to for imported beef products. At the inception of the program, they determined that 509 pounds of beef product was equeal 1 cow. That was based upon the average yeild of a beef carcass at that time. The figure was subject to periodic re evaluation as the average changed but I do not know what the current figure is. At that time, 509 pounds of beef product would require $1.00 check off payment.

The web site, if you want to look it up is . I read the whole thing but it takes some patience, and unless you are a lawyer, you can get bogged down in the legal terminology. I skipped over most of it in an effort to get to the facts. Have fun and best regards.

Mack

http://www.beefcheckoff.com
[email protected]
 

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