Charolais or Angus

[lsutiger2011]

what's your opinion.......most producers use Charolais or Angus sires on crossbred cattle here is Louisiana...what's the differences seen between the performance of the calves? In a terminal system it seems weaning weight would be the biggest goal....charolias cross calves usually wean heavier so do Angus users make up the loss in weight across the scales by selling black hided calves?

 

[xbred]

what makes you think they make up the loss?

 

[lsutiger2011]

what makes you think they make up the loss?

don't know if they make all the difference up or not...just see plenty of Angus bulls standing in pastures breeding xbred cattle in terminal systems

 

[cmf1]

What kind of cows are you crossing them on?

 

[lsutiger2011]

What kind of cows are you crossing them on?

xbred set of heifers...average frame...an assortment of angus, Hereford, and charolias type crosses with a touch of brahman influence in each. Thinking about bull selection for the future, this first round I'm using a low bw angus

 

[LauraleesFarm]

I'm wondering all those same things myself.

Right now, with our Angus bull, we get polled black calves that develop quickly. All of them hit the ground alive and without assistance. They jump up and nurse and do well.

I would like heavier weaning weights, though, and have considered switching to charolais. My cows for that pasture are all crossbred, most with some ear.

It would only take losing one calf to dystocia and that would eat up the difference in profits.....

 

[JWBrahman]

I'm wondering all those same things myself.

Right now, with our Angus bull, we get polled black calves that develop quickly. All of them hit the ground alive and without assistance. They jump up and nurse and do well.

I would like heavier weaning weights, though, and have considered switching to charolais. My cows for that pasture are all crossbred, most with some ear.

It would only take losing one calf to dystocia and that would eat up the difference in profits.....

Thinking those same thoughts myself, especially because so much of the weight difference looks like the Char influenced calves have more bone than meat. Gelbvieh would be my choice as a more refined and moderate terminal/Continental breed. Charolais are the definition of coarse.

 

[lithuanian farmer]

Charolais will increase size of calves much more than Angus, but I can't agree that Char produce more bone than meat, I saw some really impressive Charolais bulls and I'm sure that you could find the meaty one too.Would suggest to search for a bull with French roots. They're really meaty, some looks as muscular as BB, but have bigger bones.
About Angus I'd say that their weanlings are smaller and that cost money. That's from my experience. When we've used 1/2 Angus his calves were much lighter when we sold them. While Charolais bull calves are much faster growing and bigger, but muscular too, mostly more muscular than AngusX bull calves.

 

[JWBrahman]

Charolais will increase size of calves much more than Angus, but I can't agree that Char produce more bone than meat, I saw some really impressive Charolais bulls and I'm sure that you could find the meaty one too.Would suggest to search for a bull with French roots. They're really meaty, some looks as muscular as BB, but have bigger bones.
About Angus I'd say that their weanlings are smaller and that cost money. That's from my experience. When we've used 1/2 Angus his calves were much lighter when we sold them. While Charolais bull calves are much faster growing and bigger, but muscular too, mostly more muscular than AngusX bull calves.

Charolais bulls are more likely to wipe out an entire section of fence to breed your neighbor's cows. The Charolais sired cattle in my experience are less docile and more likely to run like a frightened deer when you go to check on them. Not trying to knock the Charolais breed, but money is calculated in many different ways, not just the price you get when they are sold. If lsutiger's Charolais bull busts the fence and breeds his neighbor's cows and kills his neighbor's bull, he/she could be out of business before he even got started.

 

[Taurus]

In my opinion that a good Charolais bull on commercial cows of either British or composite eared breeds will give you calves that mesh the weight scale at the sale barn.

 

[Cabo]

Gelbvieh would be my choice as a more refined and moderate terminal/Continental breed.
/quote]

Plus a black Gelbvieh bull will keep most of the calves black which in this part of the country means a lot to the numbers on the sale barn check. Pounds don't mean as much as dollars. Not to mention personal safety around a lot of Charolis. Been there done that.

 

[Bigfoot]

In my opinion that a good Charolais bull on commercial cows of either British or composite eared breeds will give you calves that mesh the weight scale at the sale barn.

We are in total agreement. Bet you never thought you'd hear that.

 

[Taurus]

In my opinion that a good Charolais bull on commercial cows of either British or composite eared breeds will give you calves that mesh the weight scale at the sale barn.

We are in total agreement. Bet you never thought you'd hear that.

I would also say that lot of 4Hers and FFA entered registered Charolais and Char x for the cattle shows. Never noticed them being snorty and highhead. I, too showed a Charolais x Black Angus yearling heifer in 4H for someone. Never had any issue with her.

 

[greybeard]

Charolais bulls are more likely to wipe out an entire section of fence to breed your neighbor's cows. The Charolais sired cattle in my experience are less docile and more likely to run like a frightened deer when you go to check on them. Not trying to knock the Charolais breed, but money is calculated in many different ways, not just the price you get when they are sold. If lsutiger's Charolais bull busts the fence and breeds his neighbor's cows and kills his neighbor's bull, he/she could be out of business before he even got started.

The aggressive fence crashing, river crossing, pond swimming, pen breaking super libido breeding I agree with 100%.
But......
The only way the Char cows run here is straight toward ya to see if you have a few cubes in your pocket, and don't even think of getting a 5 gal bucket of oil out of the back of your truck anywhere around them..

 

[lithuanian farmer]

Charolais will increase size of calves much more than Angus, but I can't agree that Char produce more bone than meat, I saw some really impressive Charolais bulls and I'm sure that you could find the meaty one too.Would suggest to search for a bull with French roots. They're really meaty, some looks as muscular as BB, but have bigger bones.
About Angus I'd say that their weanlings are smaller and that cost money. That's from my experience. When we've used 1/2 Angus his calves were much lighter when we sold them. While Charolais bull calves are much faster growing and bigger, but muscular too, mostly more muscular than AngusX bull calves.

Charolais bulls are more likely to wipe out an entire section of fence to breed your neighbor's cows. The Charolais sired cattle in my experience are less docile and more likely to run like a frightened deer when you go to check on them. Not trying to knock the Charolais breed, but money is calculated in many different ways, not just the price you get when they are sold. If lsutiger's Charolais bull busts the fence and breeds his neighbor's cows and kills his neighbor's bull, he/she could be out of business before he even got started.

All CharolaisX cattle we've are very docile, never had any problems like their character. I even could say that they are one of the calmest cattle. Just need to choose the wright bull and leave just docile heifers.

 

[Dale L]

I am not as experienced as others but if weaning weights are your biggest concern I wonder if a black bull of some other breed would be better suited. I know around here you usually get knocked on price if your calves are grey, white, cream colored etc. What about a black Simmental, Limousin, Gelbvieh, or something along those lines? You may have more calving problems with Char also. I know the ones I have seen were not known for calving ease especially when bred to angus and Hereford type cows.

 

[Son of Butch]

ANGUS
From the limited number of reports I've seen Angus Bulls beat Charolais Bulls on pounds of calf weaned per cow exposed.

 

[randiliana]

This would be my answer

We calved 160 3 year olds this spring that were bred Charolais. I think we assisted 2 head. I'm pretty sure you could find Black Angus bulls that calve harder than some Charolais... Just pay attention to your EPD's and you should be fine.

 

[deenranch]

ANGUS
From the limited number of reports I've seen Angus Bulls beat Charolais Bulls on pounds of calf weaned per cow exposed.

I'd like to see those reports!

We just weaned our bull calves off of momma and grass only. Avg BW of purebred calves was 82# and the avg WW on this set was 765#. All at 6.5 months old. And this is in TX in the middle of a drought.

 

[Bigfoot]

ANGUS
From the limited number of reports I've seen Angus Bulls beat Charolais Bulls on pounds of calf weaned per cow exposed.

I'd like to see those reports!

We just weaned our bull calves off of momma and grass only. Avg BW of purebred calves was 82# and the avg WW on this set was 765#. All at 6.5 months old. And this is in TX in the middle of a drought.

You beat me. I sold 20 some odd half char calves this week 740 pound average. Weaned 7 some at 8 months. Kept them about 5 weeks after weaning.