Cattle farmers not cashing in..............

[pnw-farmer]

Hard to ask people who are hardly making ends meet, who've had 1 year of good prices in the last 20 (and quite possibly had a small herd because of a drought the previous year) to make sacrifices. Rising land prices with people having mortgages/equipment payments due is one of the biggest screws they can tighten on everyone to make sure that no one can afford to hold out and will have to sell regardless of if it's profitable or the right time.

I've learned about how the lobbyists work through the right-to-repair legislation that's been heard in many states, I've posted about it here and despite it being kinda important to us, it totally falls on deaf ears here as well.
Lobbyists absolutely fearmonger the lawmakers.... your phone will EXPLODE if you change the battery! an independent repair shop will install Tiktok on your phone and steal all your data and you'll have stalkers that'll rape you in the underground parking lot if you let someone fix the broken screen on your phone (there is not ONE instance of this having happened)

Guess I should have reworded that. My intent with the sacrifice statement was people can undercut others to benefit themselves.

 

[Lucky]

We keep talking about taking risks as producers but the packers are taking risk as well. One of us might have million invested and risk a quarter million a year but that's pocket change to the amount Tyson or JBS has on the line every day. They have huge plants with a ton of equipment and employees to deal with. They've got all these Cattle contracted with rising feed cost. The ranchers, USDa, Peta, the public, and fake meat are constantly bombarding them with BS. I'm definitely not defending them but that's the one way window everyone looks through. I don't care if the packers make a 100% profit, I only care about my profit margin. When you trailer wean a calf the packers aren't interested in it. Some guy that's going to get it to 750# is going to sell it to some joker that'll get it to 825-950 # and then sell it to a feedyard that'll contract it to a packer. 3 or four people plus sale barns and trucking companies will probably make a profit on that calf if he survives all the turn arounds. He'll get a round of Draxxin at $60 a shot from all those guys plus $10 worth of wormer. We won't add the feed and yardage in. The days of going in the pasture and rounding up a few big ones to carry to the local sale are over if you want to make any money. It's sad but that's just the way it is.

A man told me a few weeks ago he took a couple 400# calves to the sale and I think he said they brought $600 each. He was pretty happy but wished it was better. I couldn't survive @ $600 a head and I run pretty lean. To each his own I guess.

 

[Dave]

A man told me a few weeks ago he took a couple 400# calves to the sale and I think he said they brought $600 each. He was pretty happy but wished it was better. I couldn't survive @ $600 a head and I run pretty lean. To each his own I guess.

I did pretty good on calves that only brought $600 a head. But that was part of my one and done old cows. I only owned the cows for about 8 months. The cows brought more to kill than they cost to buy. That is 4 months that I didn't feed the cows. Over half the money made would have been spent on pasture and feed had I owned them for an entire year.

 

[Lucky]

I did pretty good on calves that only brought $600 a head. But that was part of my one and done old cows. I only owned the cows for about 8 months. The cows brought more to kill than they cost to buy. That is 4 months that I didn't feed the cows. Over half the money made would have been spent on pasture and feed had I owned them for an entire year.

Would've done better putting a little time and feed in them and selling them at $1,150.

 

[Lee VanRoss]

I did pretty good on calves that only brought $600 a head. But that was part of my one and done old cows. I only owned the cows for about 8 months. The cows brought more to kill than they cost to buy. That is 4 months that I didn't feed the cows. Over half the money made would have been spent on pasture and feed had I owned them for an entire year.

You are comparing apples to oranges. The guy you referred to told you he did all right on $600. calves. (I don't doubt he said it but.....)
You on the other hand said you did pretty good on calves that only brought $600 a head but that was apparent only when you added
the income from the sale of the cows. Perhaps I should have said he was playing checkers while you were playing chess .
Correct me if I missed something .. Thanks

 

[504RP]

Tyson one of the big four but not the biggest, spent over $500,000 on political contributions, and over $1.2 million lobbying. That is just in one year. They do this every year.

Tyson Foods Profile: Summary

Tyson Foods organization profile. Contributions in the 2024 cycle: $1,007,791. Lobbying in 2024: $1,270,000. Outside Spending in the 2024 cycle: $0.

www.opensecrets.org

A ragtag bunch of hard headed cattlemen that can't get together to put 40 steers on a truck don't have a prayer.

It would be safe to assume packers spend over $5 million per year paying politicians and another $10 million per year bending their ear and writing legislation. These are just my own personal guesses. For those of you that don't know, lobbyist, working with friendly staffers write most legislation. The elected just have to vote for it.

Call you Senator and ask him to visit with you. See how that works out. You might get an audience with your representative, but try your Senator.

My Senator lives about a mile from me and I have talked with him on ocassion's.

He is a cattleman his self along with his kid's and grand kids. They have a pretty big operation and seem to be doing real well off of it. Better than i would think an operation of that size could do. They went from a dairy farm to strictly cattle.

Between the senator's herd and his and his grandsons herd and the son-in-law herd They would be pushing it to have 300 head among the 3 herds.

Looking at the homes and equipment, new vehicles, it's hard to see how they live as well as they do off of the income from their cattle operation.

The senator is the only one with a job outside of the family farm.

I wouldn't call a 300 head family cattle operation an extremely large operation. I have a feeling he wouldn't agree that anything is wrong the way the cattle market is now.

He has been in politics since 2005. Can't remember how big of hand outs the grandson and son-in-law got in that cash give away the government sponsored earlier this year but noticed their names were on the list.

So i wouldn't count on much more than a great big politicians grin from any politician while he is listening to you or count on them to help change the way things are going in marketing cattle.

 

[Dave]

Would've done better putting a little time and feed in them and selling them at $1,150.

Hay is extremely scarce and very expensive here this winter. And we are having winter this year. There are times when you just take your profit and run. Know when to hold them, know when to fold them.

 

[Stocker Steve]

Hay is extremely scarce and very expensive here this winter. And we are having winter this year. There are times when you just take your profit and run. Know when to hold them, know when to fold them.

This is true in 2021-2022 for large parts of the west and the north central regions. This may also be true for 2022-2023...

Some small time operators here are trimming a few cows, trying to limp thru the winter w/o buying more hay. There are very thin cows showing up on CL.

How are the BTOs dealing with this in your area?

 

[Lucky]

Dave, Regional differences play a huge roll in strategy and It's hard to know what other producers are dealing with. Do you guys up North ever keep a barn full of hay in case of a drought? I've finally got about 2 1/2 years worth stored up but wouldn't do that if I couldn't keep it in a barn. How about supplements, anyone that has a medium size operation around here has feedbins and buys in bulk to save money.

 

[u4411clb]

Chart proves one thing for sure.....rain is more important than politics. ......

Keep telling yourself that. This is why things will never change. Corn guys made more than ever growing for ethanol which reduced cotton and bean acres making them more profitable as well but farmers wanted them out even though they made more money in those years than anytime in their lives.

 

[callmefence]

These guys are tearing it up.

Home - National Farmers Union

The Latest from Farmers Union Fact Sheets The Farmer's Share Of The Retail Dollar Farmers and ranchers receive just 14.3* cents of the consumer food dollar. Join NFU Today! Our Vision is of... A world in which farm families and their communities are respected, valued, and enjoy economic...

nfu.org

Think about it.

Say we had this great association that acted as "our single voice" representing our interest, standing up to packers. Then the day comes and the Beef Union says "Don't Sell!" - 250 days later they are still saying, "Don't Sell!!!"

How long can you wait?

Keep telling yourself that. This is why things will never change. Corn guys made more than ever growing for ethanol which reduced cotton and bean acres making them more profitable as well but farmers wanted them out even though they made more money in those years than anytime in their lives.

I don't think you got it....

 

[simme]

I was pretty happy in 2015.. when the price of cattle had actually finally caught up with the price increases of everything else over the previous 20 years.

Sorry, couldn't help myself
View attachment 11702

Chart proves one thing for sure.....rain is more important than politics. ......

Keep telling yourself that. This is why things will never change. Corn guys made more than ever growing for ethanol which reduced cotton and bean acres making them more profitable as well but farmers wanted them out even though they made more money in those years than anytime in their lives.

I had thought that the high prices several years ago were due to low supply. Low number of brood cows due to the selloff of the herd due to the drought in previous years. I did not recognize that it was related to who was on the throne in the big house. I am just a dummy when it comes to some of these issues.
Can someone explain why the packers allowed the cattlemen to make more money in 2015? Did they suddenly lose their ability to manipulate and dominate in 2015? And regained it the next year?
Will government actions improve the market? Should we lobby for production limits - allotments on number of calves that can produced/sold? Government price controls, min and max with government purchasing beef and storing in low price periods and releasing when prices creep up? Government subsidizing calf prices? Government to limit the number of head or pounds that each packer can process per year? More tax on packer profits and distribute that money to cow calf guys so that they can produce more? Any of those sound good? Seriously, what specific actions need to be taken to improve the situation?
Lay it out for me in simple terms so that I can understand.

 

[Dave]

How are the BTOs dealing with this in your area?

Here locally (my little valley) nearly all grow enough hay of their own that they don't have to buy hay. We had plenty of irrigation water here and all the hay here is grown on irrigated ground. The one guy who normally buys some hay bought a lot of straw and baled corn stalks. Cows are all being preg checked this year and open cows get a quick ride to town.

Dave, Regional differences play a huge roll in strategy and It's hard to know what other producers are dealing with. Do you guys up North ever keep a barn full of hay in case of a drought? I've finally got about 2 1/2 years worth stored up but wouldn't do that if I couldn't keep it in a barn. How about supplements, anyone that has a medium size operation around here has feedbins and buys in bulk to save money.

No hay barns here at all. About a third of the hay gets a tarp on the top of the stack. No supplements fed. The cows get grass hay and alfalfa. It is all raised on irrigate fields in the valley. Again we have pretty reliable irrigation water from the river. There is a reservoir up stream which holds 30,000 acre feet. Spring run off out of the mountains is captured and slowly metered out all summer. The guy who is feeding straw and corn stalks is feeding some sort of pellet this year for the first time. They are coming in ton tote bags by the semi load.

The regional hay shortage is sort of a prefect storm of a number of issues. Some areas with sub irrigated hay meadows didn't grow because of the drought. Some of the irrigated grown had less water than normal for a number of different reasons. They produced but total volume was reduced. In some of the very productive reliable irrigated area alfalfa is a rotation for potatoes and other crops which are their main money makers. As it worked out they had less acres in hay so production was down.

 

[Lucky]

If I remember correctly the year Cattle prices were through the roof is the same year oil prices were higher than ever. Allot of people were making more money than they knew what to do with and bought cattle and horse ranches. The following year oil prices fell and most of those guys lost everything. Fuel is high now and Cattle prices are up some and holding. I think it's been along time since the man in the corner office gave a second thought about ranchers or farmers. Sure they romanticize it and make people think we're out riding the wide open spaces on our ponies but that's about it. It's hard for the public to feel bad for a guy living on a big spread driving his pick of pickups or $100,000 tractors and getting govt subsidies. Of course it's not true but I think that's the perception. Look at Instagram or Tic Tok, none of the ranchers or farmers on there seem to be hurting or suffering from low prices. They all look to be living the dream.

 

[TexasRancher]

Start a cattle producers union covering all 50 states. Elect experienced,honest leaders. Then take it to the limit!

You know...that wouldn't be hard to do....signing up small-medium producers in all 50 states, WHO wouldn't want to get aboard that ship!!!
We just need the media-country wide funding and our first good experienced Cattleman Union Leader/s in all states voted-in and attached to the protected sale of cattle.
That would send a strong signal if all the small producers...could trust the newly formed cattlemen Union across each state...for decisions...and there was a small service-fee upon your yearly cattle-calf sale at the barn.
I don't know all the in-roads...but i know i would sign up to protect small cattle producers that treat cattle better...and pay yearly fees to protect our industry.

 

[Dave]

You know...that wouldn't be hard to do....signing up small-medium producers in all 50 states, WHO wouldn't want to get aboard that ship!!!
We just need the media-country wide funding and our first good experienced Cattleman Union Leader/s in all states voted-in and attached to the protected sale of cattle.
That would send a strong signal if all the small producers...could trust the newly formed cattlemen Union across each state...for decisions...and there was a small service-fee upon your yearly cattle-calf sale at the barn.
I don't know all the in-roads...but i know i would sign up to protect small cattle producers that treat cattle better...and pay yearly fees to protect our industry.

There is already an organization in existence. It is the U. S. Cattlemen's. The NBCA is by far the biggest but too much influence by the packers for me. There is R-Calf which is to sue happy for me. The U.S. Cattlemen is somewhere in between. I have never joined but certainly considered it.

 

[greybeard]

If I remember correctly the year Cattle prices were through the roof is the same year oil prices were higher than ever. Allot of people were making more money than they knew what to do with and bought cattle and horse ranches. The following year oil prices fell and most of those guys lost everything. Fuel is high now and Cattle prices are up some and holding. I think it's been along time since the man in the corner office gave a second thought about ranchers or farmers.

It was high but not the highest ever.

 

[jltrent]

What made cattle prices high was people replaced cattle with corn when the ethanol thing started. The cattle numbers were down and the price went up. What brought it down was the South American cattle market was opened up and flooded the markets and cattle fell like a rock and been that way since. At the retailer prices are up now, but now the processors have leverage on the producer and retailer, plus the imports to bring in.

 

[greybeard]

 

[Ky hills]

What made cattle prices high was people replaced cattle with corn when the ethanol thing started. The cattle numbers were down and the price went up. What brought it down was the South American cattle market was opened up and flooded the markets and cattle fell like a rock and been that way since. At the retailer prices are up now, but now the processors have the leverage plus the imports. IMO you either put up with the BS or change to another occupation. Some say you can make it, I am calling BS unless you have other income or need a hobby. With current inflation, all the input cost going up no way you can live. Health insurance, all insurance and taxes alone will put you out of business. Our property taxes are fixing to double and I would say others will too.

That's unfortunately my take on it too.