Buying Hay

[txag]

Hey, Caustic....you quit making your own hay, what will you have to complain about all summer?

 

[Caustic Burno]

Hey, Caustic....you quit making your own hay, what will you have to complain about all summer?

I am quite sure I can come up with something while setting on the porch in the rocking chair.
I will still get the son to cut mine and I am sure I can find plenty to give constructive feedback on.

 

[bear]

It seems that if you are maximizing your carrying capacity and gross income was the only concern, it would not matter if you had 10 acres or 10,000 acres, everyone in the cattle business should buy hay.
Everybody in the cattle business sells their hay equipment, demand and cost of new hay equipment goes down, hay demand goes up, hay costs go out the roof. I think I got it. Now all you need to do is decide who is going to be in the cattle business and who is going to be in the hay business!
Bear

 

[Angus Cowman]

It seems that if you are maximizing your carrying capacity and gross income was the only concern, it would not matter if you had 10 acres or 10,000 acres, everyone in the cattle business should buy hay.
Everybody in the cattle business sells their hay equipment, demand and cost of new hay equipment goes down, hay demand goes up, hay costs go out the roof. I think I got it. Now all you need to do is decide who is going to be in the cattle business and who is going to be in the hay business!
Bear

No there is a point in which putting up your own hay because feasible
if you are hiring it done it is around the 300 to 500 bale mark if you can get it done in the first cutting
in owning your own hay equipment it is around the 1200-1500 bale mark that you can justify having newer equipment and the fertilization and labor cost then you still need to be able to do at least 70% of that number on the first cutting

it is kinda like a plumber who is small and may only need a backhoe 1 time a week compared to a plumber tha uses his backhoe 3 days a week
the small guy can't afford to own his backhoe and supply the labor,fuel,transportation and insurance to justify owning it he can get his digging done cheaper by a custom hoe service
it is the same way with hay if your only doing small amounts you can't justify the expense and upkeep it cost compared to having your hay baled

 

[dun]

Nobody into consideration the value of the recreation of haying. If you would be out going to a flick or going to dinner, taking a vacation etc., haying becomes a reasonably priced alternative!

 

[Angus Cowman]

Nobody into consideration the value of the recreation of haying. If you would be out going to a flick or going to dinner, taking a vacation etc., haying becomes a reasonably priced alternative!

but look at it this way Dun if you weren't haying you could spend that time chasin Mrs Dun around the bedroom :lol: :lol:

 

[dun]

Nobody into consideration the value of the recreation of haying. If you would be out going to a flick or going to dinner, taking a vacation etc., haying becomes a reasonably priced alternative!

but look at it this way Dun if you weren't haying you could spend that time chasin Mrs Dun around the bedroom :lol: :lol:

But then I'ld exhaust my brain trying to figure out what to do once I caught her

 

[hayray]

Thats why my summers seem so easy, I must be recreating the whole time?

 

[1982vett]

Nobody into consideration the value of the recreation of haying. If you would be out going to a flick or going to dinner, taking a vacation etc., haying becomes a reasonably priced alternative!

Isn't that why we do this cattle thing anyway.....most of us dam sure aren't making aliving from it (apart from the tax reasons what else could it be).....AND I DID SAY MOST...

 

[Stocker Steve]

Nobody into consideration the value of the recreation of haying. If you would be out going to a flick or going to dinner, taking a vacation etc., haying becomes a reasonably priced alternative!

I have two neighbor who operate this way. One keeps a cooler full of beer in his cab, the other one splits his time between haying during the day and square dancing at night. Neither one wants anything to do with livestock...

 

[bear]

I fully understand your comparison to a backhoe. A point was made during this topic about maximizing carrying capacity, gross income and not having to fertilize as often using rotational grazing. I was jokingly making the point that if by self producing hay and a carrying capacity of (in our area) 2.5-3 acres/pair and you can increase your carrying capacity to .75-1.50 acres/pair, reduce overhead on hay equipment and reduce fertilizer costs using rotational grazing, can anyone big or small truly justify producing their own hay?

As dun stated there is a recreational, friends and family gathering factor. For some it is like opening day of deer season. For most, I am sure it is a feeling of being more in control by having their own hay equipment. Particularly if hay is not available in their area.
Bear

 

[TexasBred]

For most, I am sure it is a feeling of being more in control by having their own hay equipment. Particularly if hay is not available in their area.
Bear

Most likely if there's no hay to buy in the area there is not a lot for you to cut with your own equipment either, unless you were lucky to catch a couple of spotty rains.

 

[Angus Cowman]

I fully understand your comparison to a backhoe. A point was made during this topic about maximizing carrying capacity, gross income and not having to fertilize as often using rotational grazing. I was jokingly making the point that if by self producing hay and a carrying capacity of (in our area) 2.5-3 acres/pair and you can increase your carrying capacity to .75-1.50 acres/pair, reduce overhead on hay equipment and reduce fertilizer costs using rotational grazing, can anyone big or small truly justify producing their own hay?

As dun stated there is a recreational, friends and family gathering factor. For some it is like opening day of deer season. For most, I am sure it is a feeling of being more in control by having their own hay equipment. Particularly if hay is not available in their area.
Bear

I understood what you meant but alot of people don't really know what it cost them
but alot of people think that their hay is better because it is theirs which 90% of the time that is false or that because they can do it when they want it is better
what most people don't understand guys like me have hay in varying degrees of quality and it is priced accordingly
They also don't realize that what it takes them a week to do I can usually do in a day as I try to bale 250-300 bales a day when we get up and rolling
even on the farms that I do % of hay for the baling I don't do farms that don't produce and the guy that has 5 or 10 acres of hay that wants baled I Don'T bale for them guys as it isn't worth my time or effort

I only bale for 1 man that pays for all of his hay and he has 300 bales I try to go in and cut it all one day and then rake and bale it usually 2 days later depending on the weather he is the only one that throws me out of sync on getting things done as I have to move equipment to his place about 25 miles away but his cash money helps me keep rolling and pays operatimng cost for a little while till I start selling hay

when we get to rolling in hay season I will cut from about 7 in the morning til dinner and then we bale in the afternoon as we have enough acreage that I can be cutting in one field and have others in various stages of curing
I usually only bale about 5-or 6 hrs a day

 

[Caustic Burno]

Nobody into consideration the value of the recreation of haying. If you would be out going to a flick or going to dinner, taking a vacation etc., haying becomes a reasonably priced alternative!

Isn't that why we do this cattle thing anyway.....most of us dam sure aren't making aliving from it (apart from the tax reasons what else could it be).....AND I DID SAY MOST...

When it comes to baling hay a hay baler could make a preacher cuss. I have always prayed if I get to heaven the good Lord doesn't punish me, by making me bale his hay field for eternity with my old Krone baler.

 

[Caustic Burno]

I fully understand your comparison to a backhoe. A point was made during this topic about maximizing carrying capacity, gross income and not having to fertilize as often using rotational grazing. I was jokingly making the point that if by self producing hay and a carrying capacity of (in our area) 2.5-3 acres/pair and you can increase your carrying capacity to .75-1.50 acres/pair, reduce overhead on hay equipment and reduce fertilizer costs using rotational grazing, can anyone big or small truly justify producing their own hay?

As dun stated there is a recreational, friends and family gathering factor. For some it is like opening day of deer season. For most, I am sure it is a feeling of being more in control by having their own hay equipment. Particularly if hay is not available in their area.
Bear

I understood what you meant but alot of people don't really know what it cost them
but alot of people think that their hay is better because it is theirs which 90% of the time that is false or that because they can do it when they want it is better
what most people don't understand guys like me have hay in varying degrees of quality and it is priced accordingly
They also don't realize that what it takes them a week to do I can usually do in a day as I try to bale 250-300 bales a day when we get up and rolling
even on the farms that I do % of hay for the baling I don't do farms that don't produce and the guy that has 5 or 10 acres of hay that wants baled I Don'T bale for them guys as it isn't worth my time or effort

I only bale for 1 man that pays for all of his hay and he has 300 bales I try to go in and cut it all one day and then rake and bale it usually 2 days later depending on the weather he is the only one that throws me out of sync on getting things done as I have to move equipment to his place about 25 miles away but his cash money helps me keep rolling and pays operatimng cost for a little while till I start selling hay

when we get to rolling in hay season I will cut from about 7 in the morning til dinner and then we bale in the afternoon as we have enough acreage that I can be cutting in one field and have others in various stages of curing
I usually only bale about 5-or 6 hrs a day

A/C I fully understand where you are coming from. This is the reason I baled my own for years, I needed a 130 to 150 rolls that was it. I had four hay fieds that would kick out 30 to 40 rolls, it wasn't worth the customer balers time which is perfectly understandable. My old neighbor has cut down to about 50 head on 400 acres and is baling the rest. I have got the custom boys baling mine as well on that hay field that adjoins his place for 20 bucks a roll. I am going to get my son to bale my field at the house just to keep the equipment from setting up and buy the rest if I need to. Since I am dowm to 12 cows and bull I only need 50 rolls and I will get 40 off the custom field in one cutting and 15 to 20 off mine. I was thinking until I seen cow prices the other day pick up S/S heavies in the winter with the extra hay and sell them both in the fall. Old man with a bad back and diabetes doesn't have any business in the hay field by himself. Days like today cold and rainy I can hardly move anymore makes me want to get out of the business. Then I think I wouldl go ahead and die if there is not a cow on the place to keep my blood pressure up.

 

[bigbull338]

i found a new jd 458 baler for $15,600.so the baler pay off would be 2yrs at 300 bales a yr.based on $25 a bale.an you still say 300 bales aint enough.cutter will take 1yr to pay for.rake pay for in 1 cutting.but hey we all think differant.

 

[novaman]

i found a new jd 458 baler for $15,600.so the baler pay off would be 2yrs at 300 bales a yr.based on $25 a bale.an you still say 300 bales aint enough.cutter will take 1yr to pay for.rake pay for in 1 cutting.but hey we all think differant.

You are figuring a 2 year payoff on the baler but you are putting ALL of your money towards the baler and nothing else for those 2 years. There is fuel, twine/net, rake, mower, labor, parts, etc etc to include with the cost of your baler EVERY year. I agree we all think different but it seems like far too often we overlook a lot of the expenses and give ourselves a false sense of justification. I can't put a number out there on what I feel it takes to make owning hay equipment worthwhile. To me it is more than just the number of bales. I have to take quality into consideration along with the quantity because higher quality hay is always more valuable.

 

[dun]

Then I think I wouldl go ahead and die if there is not a cow on the place to keep my blood pressure up.

That's why I've retired from the business never to get back into it half a dozen times now. Finally given up and figure I'll do it till they throw dirt on me. Now I just keep my copule of 2 or 3 dozen cows around for company. If I added more, we could run another 75 head with no problem, then it would be WAY to much work to keep up with

 

[bigbull338]

if you figured everything it would be a 5yr pay off.

 

[Angus Cowman]

if you figured everything it would be a 5yr pay off.

the way you figure everything I should be a millionaire