As I have stated many times, I am a hay virgin.I have always bought my hay. I just purchased some land next to my cattle farm and plan to bale hay. I can tell you anything you want to know about Brangus,Epd's,mating decisions,carcass data, but when it comes to hay I am a self proclaimed idiot. I am not mecanically enclined to fix anything either. The 2 kind of doesn't make for a cattle farmer some would say. What are some tips for buying hay equip. I plan to buy some good used equip and make a go of it. I would like a net wrap baler. any tips welcome
buying hay equipment
- Thread starter plbcattle
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CowgirlUpNY
Well-known member
We're beginners ourselves, and my husband would probably be better suited to answer this post, but I'll let you know what I've learned doing hay with him. (He works on the equipment so I don't know how much help I'll be)
Are you familiar with this field? Is it hayed already?
The equipment we bought when we started was a JD hay combine, JD kicker baler, rake, tetter. We've recently bought a round baler, and we are now looking for a discbine (sp?) and the belt feed/drive (don't know if that's exactly what its called) square kicker baler.
Get manuals!! either from the previous owner or from the Mfg.
Make sure that you have a tractor with enough HP to run your equipment.
It doesn't seem like I was much help, but hopefully you'll come away with something.
Are you familiar with this field? Is it hayed already?
The equipment we bought when we started was a JD hay combine, JD kicker baler, rake, tetter. We've recently bought a round baler, and we are now looking for a discbine (sp?) and the belt feed/drive (don't know if that's exactly what its called) square kicker baler.
Get manuals!! either from the previous owner or from the Mfg.
Make sure that you have a tractor with enough HP to run your equipment.
It doesn't seem like I was much help, but hopefully you'll come away with something.
DiamondSCattleCo
Well-known member
plb, you may wish to reconsider. Haying equipment, no matter what breed, color or variety is going to eventually break down. Its as sure as the earth going round and round. Balers blow bearings, haybine teeth break, chains break and sprockets wear out eventually.
So if you're going to end up hiring someone to do your fixing, you'll probably be cheaper having your hay custom baled.
Having said all that, if you're still intent on doing it, M&W balers are pretty much as maintenance free as you'll get. Keep the pressure turned to the middle, and a good used 5506 will crack out thousands of bales before needing work. If you need more capacity than a softcore, I like New Holland hard cores.
On the mower side, I prefer a mower/conditioner. The NH haybines work extremely well, but the MacDon units are tougher.
Rod
So if you're going to end up hiring someone to do your fixing, you'll probably be cheaper having your hay custom baled.
Having said all that, if you're still intent on doing it, M&W balers are pretty much as maintenance free as you'll get. Keep the pressure turned to the middle, and a good used 5506 will crack out thousands of bales before needing work. If you need more capacity than a softcore, I like New Holland hard cores.
On the mower side, I prefer a mower/conditioner. The NH haybines work extremely well, but the MacDon units are tougher.
Rod
Mechanic work ain't rocket science, but if you feel that way about it you'd be best off having someone else take care of the hay. Plus you can watch and learn, then decide if you'd like to stick your neck out that far.
cfpinz
cfpinz
CowgirlUpNY
Well-known member
Oh yea, I forgot to mention......IT'S HARD WORK!!!!! You never know what's going to happen, or when!! All those rocks you thought you knew about in the field, ya, well they have offspring!!! Nothing like breaking down in the middle of a field cutting and needing to fix it and get it done! Last season, husband caught a stump or rock or something with the combine, lets just say the combine went one way and the tractor went the other. Thank goodness it was our last field and not essential to get in. We ended up welding that puppy back together!! Oh yea, and when your kicker breaks down and you have to drop bale, that sucks too!! Because inevitably there will be rain in the forecast and you will NEED to get that hay out of the field and in the barn.
And a little lunch bag full of parts can sometimes run you $200 and up. Hoping they still make the parts you need. Depends on the age of your equipment.
All that said, we did what DJ had suggested, found someone selling all their equipment, and walked away with a pretty good deal, but remember, the deal always come with headaches.
And a little lunch bag full of parts can sometimes run you $200 and up. Hoping they still make the parts you need. Depends on the age of your equipment.
All that said, we did what DJ had suggested, found someone selling all their equipment, and walked away with a pretty good deal, but remember, the deal always come with headaches.
The Bachelor
Well-known member
cfpinz":12feiodv said:
I agree here. My hay equipment breaks down two or three times a cutting (In defense of the stuff, I think the newest piece is from the 1970's). I average about 2 hours of downtime fixing the stuff (tjat doesn't include the 5 minutes of cursing right after I get off the tractor).
The point being, if your not willing to fix it yourself, custom baling might be the way to go.
sjr725
Well-known member
Just know your equipment only breaks when you use it.
Your Equipment only needs fuel when you use it ($2.00+ here for off road delivered bulk)
You only use it when you need it.
Hay won't wait until you get around to fixing the equipment. If you break down in the middle of haying, you'll have to rent equipment or pay someone else to finish - if you can't get the parts you need for a week!
When it's time to cut hay - it needs to be cut NOW.
When it's time to bale - it needs to be baled NOW.
When it's baled - it needs to hauled off the field NOW.
Then you can start all over again getting up at 4am to go change the wheel lines - that is if you pump doesn't breakdown!
There you have it, the short course in hay farming! I don't know about there, but here we usually sell about half our hay but this year, we bought kept some feeders for the winter- I'm not selling hay for less than it cost me to put up. Between electricity and diesel - you just can't make ends meet at $70 a ton hay.
Your Equipment only needs fuel when you use it ($2.00+ here for off road delivered bulk)
You only use it when you need it.
Hay won't wait until you get around to fixing the equipment. If you break down in the middle of haying, you'll have to rent equipment or pay someone else to finish - if you can't get the parts you need for a week!
When it's time to cut hay - it needs to be cut NOW.
When it's time to bale - it needs to be baled NOW.
When it's baled - it needs to hauled off the field NOW.
Then you can start all over again getting up at 4am to go change the wheel lines - that is if you pump doesn't breakdown!
There you have it, the short course in hay farming! I don't know about there, but here we usually sell about half our hay but this year, we bought kept some feeders for the winter- I'm not selling hay for less than it cost me to put up. Between electricity and diesel - you just can't make ends meet at $70 a ton hay.
john250
Well-known member
PLB
How much hay will you be making? That has everything to do with what equipment you can justify. If it is small acreage or unproductive, you won't make enough tons to justify any equipment. Cost per bale will be higher than buying.
If you commit to a set of tools, commit to fertilize and control weeds also. The more bales you produce the less your equipment cost per bale.
A satisfactory agreement with a custom baler will get you more for less risk.
In my area, rainfall comes about every 4 days, most years. You can make good hay in 3 days, but everything has to work. Too much equipment is usually about right.
How much hay will you be making? That has everything to do with what equipment you can justify. If it is small acreage or unproductive, you won't make enough tons to justify any equipment. Cost per bale will be higher than buying.
If you commit to a set of tools, commit to fertilize and control weeds also. The more bales you produce the less your equipment cost per bale.
A satisfactory agreement with a custom baler will get you more for less risk.
In my area, rainfall comes about every 4 days, most years. You can make good hay in 3 days, but everything has to work. Too much equipment is usually about right.
Caustic Burno
Well-known member
plbcattle":zxa2t15q said:
Hay equipment can make a preacher cuss. It only breaks down in the field with a rain coming tomorrow.
I hate hay you will go nuts with one tractor trying to make hay.
There is one the cutter never comes off of another with a rake and the third has the baler hooked up to it. You can bet one of those tractors will be down when you need it.
OP
OP
plbcattle
Well-known member
the hay field is 60 acres of improved bermuda. I have bought hay out of the field before. It usually makes 4 and if we get good rainfall and it's fertilized right can make 5 bales per acre.. I bought it just to gaurentee I would have quality hay.I will make a go of it anyway. It seems all the responses to raising cattle or cutting hay, everyone on here says not to. They say you can't make any money at raising cattle. I have found a lucrative market for top end registered Brangus genetics. I enjoy doing stuff around the farm, it's a stress reliever. I plan to buy either new or good used equipment. If it's a pain, I will sell the equipment and hire it done. I will post my progress, Stay tunes, there might be some good hay equip for sale. LOL
auctionboy
Well-known member
Thinks you have to look at is:
Can you fix it if it breaks
How much can you buy hay for( number 1).
Do you have the lbor, or back for it
and as said befor if you grassed the land and bought hay how would it effect the bottom line?
My new ay of looking at things is buy the cheapest hay and buy the equipment to make garss silage. You have to do your own math but with making your own silage weather doesn't effect as much if you supplement with a small amount of very highly nutrietous silage and maybe a pound or so of grain you maybe more economical. It is for me, do your own math and see just how cheap you can buy low quality roufage for.
Can you fix it if it breaks
How much can you buy hay for( number 1).
Do you have the lbor, or back for it
and as said befor if you grassed the land and bought hay how would it effect the bottom line?
My new ay of looking at things is buy the cheapest hay and buy the equipment to make garss silage. You have to do your own math but with making your own silage weather doesn't effect as much if you supplement with a small amount of very highly nutrietous silage and maybe a pound or so of grain you maybe more economical. It is for me, do your own math and see just how cheap you can buy low quality roufage for.
plbcattle":1e8ndpt7 said:
Even brand spanking new equipment WILL break down - almost always according to Murphy's Law, I might add. Factor in a newbie to hay operating it, and you're better off buying your hay. If you're absolutely dead set on learning to hay, hire on with a custom hay outfit and find out what you're up against first hand with no financial loss to yourself.
littleboss
Active member
I bought a 335 (4x4) JD round baler. I had it for 10 years and made 500-600 bales per year. In those 10 years, I had to untwist a belt and replace one chain. Other than that no repairs other than everytime I tried baling with too high of a moisture content having to cut hay off of the starter roll and unplugging the baler.
1. If you buy new qaulity equipment and maintain it, it will give you very little trouble.
2. If you don't know what you are doing you will have trouble. I knew that that the hay was too wet but was always fighting rain so I baled it anyway. If you want to NOT be stressfree try unclogging a baler in 100 degree Texas sun and the baler is full of fire ants.
My only other point is: the main benefit of having your own baler is baling when you need to. For example, if you have coastal you should bale it every 4 weeks for max protein. If you wait until 8 weeks you are just as well to let a custom hay baler do it when he can.
1. If you buy new qaulity equipment and maintain it, it will give you very little trouble.
2. If you don't know what you are doing you will have trouble. I knew that that the hay was too wet but was always fighting rain so I baled it anyway. If you want to NOT be stressfree try unclogging a baler in 100 degree Texas sun and the baler is full of fire ants.
My only other point is: the main benefit of having your own baler is baling when you need to. For example, if you have coastal you should bale it every 4 weeks for max protein. If you wait until 8 weeks you are just as well to let a custom hay baler do it when he can.
Double A Ranch
Well-known member
You do whatever you want to do and can afford to do Plb. Its plain rediculous to think that you have to have 3 tractors to bale your own hay like some people say. Having 2 GOOD tractors does make it nice, though. But you can sure do it with 1 if you have to. It just takes more work changing equipment over.
Since you can afford it, my advice is to find a reputable local dealer to buy your used equipment from. That way you can be sure that somebody will feel responsible tio help you out when you break down and you WILL break down. LOL. I'll talk to hubby tonight and see if he has any more GOOD advice for you. Sometimes this forum is so full of negative peopel that it makes you wonder why anyone EVER gets in the cattle business.
Since you can afford it, my advice is to find a reputable local dealer to buy your used equipment from. That way you can be sure that somebody will feel responsible tio help you out when you break down and you WILL break down. LOL. I'll talk to hubby tonight and see if he has any more GOOD advice for you. Sometimes this forum is so full of negative peopel that it makes you wonder why anyone EVER gets in the cattle business.
Iowa237
Active member
I LOVE your response to these people! When I started farming everyone said WHY??? You don't want the headaches!!! You can't make any money!!! Well I'm here to tell you that it seems as if you have what it takes! Go for it! Sharpen your pencil and see what works for you! It's all on how you market your animals and you seem to know that bottom line! Don't get me wrong... I purchased some new equip. last year and it breaks down just as much right when the rain is coming. But if you don't like what your doing Don't do it! GOLLY!!! I've never asked myself why I got into the business! Just why didn't I stick my neck out sooner!
Anywho... I'd suggest a Hesston or New Holland discbine. Vermeer round baler (605M) ,but depending on your budget and your growth plans you may want to reconcider my input. Look for something that has the least moving parts and something basic enough that you can see how it works and that your comfortible with! Tractor horsepower plays a big part on the newer discbines and balers. Another thing is what parts are closer for you. Tractor House and iron search are great internet sites to maybe give you some ideas. Enjoy the experience.
Anywho... I'd suggest a Hesston or New Holland discbine. Vermeer round baler (605M) ,but depending on your budget and your growth plans you may want to reconcider my input. Look for something that has the least moving parts and something basic enough that you can see how it works and that your comfortible with! Tractor horsepower plays a big part on the newer discbines and balers. Another thing is what parts are closer for you. Tractor House and iron search are great internet sites to maybe give you some ideas. Enjoy the experience.
AngusLimoX
Well-known member
Given what you say, would it cost you better than $6000 a year in custom costs? ( Your local pricing ).
You already have 65 - 75 horse or better tractor?
I'd say go for it. I paid $7200 cdn for a used NH 688 haybine $12000 for a used NH 634 baler and too much for a new NH tedder!
I see you are following the post in grasses pastures board so you will see I am partial to my used NH316 square baler, but you may better steer clear of that if you don't like tinkering with knotters.( Although small squares will give those boys of yours strong backs big pipes without them messing with your gym gear!! :lol: ).
The haybine needs guards and sections with some regularity, but a monkey could do that. Changing the drive belt is another story, but it has only needed that twice in 5 years.( Got the time down to just over an hour last time, only a few bolts left over :lol: ).
Make sure parts are handy for whatever your gonna buy, because you will need them.
Excellent suggestion earlier about the owners manual. Maintain the equipment to the highest standard, and get it out early in the season to check it over and make sure it is put away clean.
Having a tedder has saved me a lot of hay. Not sure of your drying conditions.
For that size of field I would steer clear of disckbine unless you have a lot of gopher holes etc.. Make sure the conditioning rolls are straight on your haybine.
As with any machinery look for bends, cracks, welds, recent paint, and ask about it.
Size your machinery to your field and tractor.
Nice to see and hear something clicking over if you can before you buy. Chains and bearings on the baler. Net wrap sounds nice, never used it though. Depends on what you want to spend.
The main thing with getting your moneys worth out of the equipment is making great hay. May be easier said than done, depends on your conditions, but with your own stuff, you control whether that will happen to a greater degree.
Good Luck
ALX
You already have 65 - 75 horse or better tractor?
I'd say go for it. I paid $7200 cdn for a used NH 688 haybine $12000 for a used NH 634 baler and too much for a new NH tedder!
I see you are following the post in grasses pastures board so you will see I am partial to my used NH316 square baler, but you may better steer clear of that if you don't like tinkering with knotters.( Although small squares will give those boys of yours strong backs big pipes without them messing with your gym gear!! :lol: ).
The haybine needs guards and sections with some regularity, but a monkey could do that. Changing the drive belt is another story, but it has only needed that twice in 5 years.( Got the time down to just over an hour last time, only a few bolts left over :lol: ).
Make sure parts are handy for whatever your gonna buy, because you will need them.
Excellent suggestion earlier about the owners manual. Maintain the equipment to the highest standard, and get it out early in the season to check it over and make sure it is put away clean.
Having a tedder has saved me a lot of hay. Not sure of your drying conditions.
For that size of field I would steer clear of disckbine unless you have a lot of gopher holes etc.. Make sure the conditioning rolls are straight on your haybine.
As with any machinery look for bends, cracks, welds, recent paint, and ask about it.
Size your machinery to your field and tractor.
Nice to see and hear something clicking over if you can before you buy. Chains and bearings on the baler. Net wrap sounds nice, never used it though. Depends on what you want to spend.
The main thing with getting your moneys worth out of the equipment is making great hay. May be easier said than done, depends on your conditions, but with your own stuff, you control whether that will happen to a greater degree.
Good Luck
ALX
HAY MAKER
Well-known member
plbcattle,If you have the money to take hay makin lessons.......I say go for it 
the argument of makin hay as opposed to buying again,depends on a mans personal circumstance,many varibles in that argument..............good luck
PS There is a deep feeling of satisfaction leaning on your gate,looking at a freshly baled field,with your tractor idling as the sun is setting,what's it worth ?
the argument of makin hay as opposed to buying again,depends on a mans personal circumstance,many varibles in that argument..............good luckPS There is a deep feeling of satisfaction leaning on your gate,looking at a freshly baled field,with your tractor idling as the sun is setting,what's it worth ?
littleboss
Active member
Double A Ranch":acyp3hrx said:
Who says that the advice given is negative? Have you ever cut 60 acres before? And 3 or 4 times per year? It does take lots of time to do all of this. Does the original poster know that it will take him from 10 -20 hours to cut that 60 acres ONE time? Does he have the time? Even if he breaks it up into 3 twenty acre tracts to cut, it will take about one week to cut, rake, bale and haul it, then it's time for the next tract. Over and over again, all summer long...... Plus each piece should be fertilized as soon as possible. Have you ever put on the mower one day, the rake the next and then the baler; every week for 3 months straight, well I have....... It's a full time job....... And yes, 2 tractors are a necessity. Do you want to have a field of hay ready to bale, a broke tractor and rain coming? Do you know that that one field may have $1000 worth of fertilizer on it for each cutting?
If you ain't gonna do it right, why do it at all?
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