Broadcast Seeding Wheat or Cereal Rye.

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nap

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This is similar to BigBull thread which I didn't want to high jack, thus the new thread.

I need a forage that will help bridge the gap between mid Jan. and late Feb. in Southwest AR. Both wheat and cereal rye have been brought up as possibilities in an earlier post. My question is can either one or both of these be broadcast seeded effectively? I don't own a no till seeder or a drill, and I don't want to buy an expensive seeder at this time. At the same time I don't want to waste seed in a futile effort. I could possibly rent a seeder but I'm curious if I can get by with broadcasting.
 

skyline

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I'm in the same dilema. I have been told you will not get good results by broadcasting cereal grains. The seed has to be deeper and I haven't heard of a way you can overseed by broadcasting and get it uniformly deep enough. So, I'm keeping my eyes open for a CHEAP used drill. They are hard to find in East Texas.
 

bigbull338

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i know that you cant broadcast wheat in a pasture.an i doubt you can broadcast ceral rye.for those you need a notill drill.you shouldve broadcast rye grass seed in oct.an you wouldve had grazing by now.
 

Douglas

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I broadcast cereal rye every year. I straighten the disc to almost straight and cover it up. Rye will come up from various depths and in a bed of dust within 4 or 5 days. I add ryegrass and clover on top and cultipack. As long as you get the cereal rye covered up with some soil it will do fine, you couldn't keep it from coming up if you tried. Cultipacking helps seed/soil contact and gives the cows’ better footing but shallow disking, broadcast, disc and drag and you are good to go. Need to do it much earlier than ryegrass overseeding to help you any, say by the end of Sept. If your grass is still growing, that is a problem for cereal rye. Look for a field you can convert to winter pasture every year. You can graze rye in Nov-Dec, rye/clover in Feb-March and ryegrass march- June all in the same field. That is 7 months; I doubt you have other pasture that productive. This set up is where I do the crabgrass as well for another 3 months. It takes some time and several days on the tractor, but that is another positive for me, a day on the tractor is awesome.
 

Douglas

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One caution of course to all of this is rainfall. If the fall is dry you might not make anything till the spring, crabgrass needs summer rains as well. Bermuda will produce better in a dry summer; Here in North Carolina we generally get sufficient thunderstorms to make the system work, but not every year.
 

Arkieman

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Nap -

I'm in central part of the state and I'm 0-3 with broadcasting wheat and/or rye. Sometimes I get a stand, but then a short period of heat or a period of dry weather and it withers up and dies. I will NEVER (again) broadcast anything into unbroken ground!!
 

Douglas

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bigbull338":2lwr4rlv said:
i know that you cant broadcast wheat in a pasture.an i doubt you can broadcast ceral rye.for those you need a notill drill.you shouldve broadcast rye grass seed in oct.an you wouldve had grazing by now.

Your right. Maybe nap could broadcast ryegrass early and stockpile for Jan-Feb, but i would try to do it earlier like mid Sept.
 

dun

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The only thing we've had success broadcasting in other then a prepared seed bed is clover. Tried fescue, brome, Marshall ryegrass, OG and timothy.
 

1982vett

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nap":2gqiyx3d said:
This is similar to BigBull thread which I didn't want to high jack, thus the new thread.

I need a forage that will help bridge the gap between mid Jan. and late Feb. in Southwest AR. Both wheat and cereal rye have been brought up as possibilities in an earlier post. My question is can either one or both of these be broadcast seeded effectively? I don't own a no till seeder or a drill, and I don't want to buy an expensive seeder at this time. At the same time I don't want to waste seed in a futile effort. I could possibly rent a seeder but I'm curious if I can get by with broadcasting.
I think it would be difficult to get one type of pasture to grow grass for all seasons without the need of one seasons grasses causing problems for another seasons grasses. Just as one utilizes rotational grazing you can have pastures with grasses that you can rotate to throughout the seasons (In a lot of places). You are looking for something to bridge a gap from now to the end of February. Ryegrass will do that down here. As bigbull and others have said, ryegrass pasture in your area could have been started as early as September, October for sure. With just a little planning in your pasture rotation you have to pick a plot and do your planting so when January rolls around it its ready to receive your grazers. The only thing that needs to be considered is economics. Is prepairing winter pastures worth the expense.

For example, I have 50 acres I plant in oats between mid-September and October, burr clover and ryegrass volunteers on these plots. Depending on rains I can start grazing them by Thanksgiving. The are usually grazed down by about this time of the year when they are let on 50 acres of bermuda hay fields that ryegrass and clover has volunteered (or been seeded) on. This carries them to the end of February to mid-March when they are fertilized for hay production. Meanwhile the main pastures (which are a mix of KR bluestem, bermuda, clovers, rescue, ryegrass, bahaia, and anything else that grows here) are beginning to green up and the oats has had time to grow a bit and they are back on them till it plays out. Around June the oats long gone, the ryegrass and clover has had a chance to reseed and it gets chiesel plowed to get ready for fall. Hay is made off the bermuda and regrowth of ryegrass, fertilized and bermuda is taken again. If more hay is needed I will fertilize again if weather co-operatates other wise the cows will get to graze it till August when weather is re-evaluated. Fertilize then if I think it will rain and can still bale into October and November.

Long story short. I have three types of pasture. One is tilled for cool season forage. Another is for hay production and cool season forage. And the last is to go from spring to fall. Summer pastures are about 35 acres each, Hay is about 10 - 15 acres each, and oats are 8 - 10 acres each.
 

Jogeephus

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I don't know how far north you are but here is something you might want to try as it will be cheap and it won't require a drill. Take a chain drag and hook it to your draw bar with a piece of 10 foot chain. Then broadcast rape over the grass. If you flip the drag over so it is digging some this will put the rape seed in contact with bare dirt. Rape is like turnip seed and doesn't have to have a lot of dirt on it. If it will grow in your location, this will fill the gap nicely for you as it will produce roughly 10,000 lbs of forage with 50 units of N.
 
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nap

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Thanks to all for the input and great ideas. Since I don't have a cultipack, drill or no drill seeder it looks like my options are limited. Jo's chain drag with rape seed sounds like an interesting idea. I wonder if chain dragging would also work with cereal seed in my situation. Can anyone describe what they are using to chain drag. I have old chain link fencing that I can use but I'm just not sure how to construct the frame. I have also used old bed box springs to smooth roads. Would they work for preparing a seed bed over grass?
 

1982vett

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Nap, I had an old shop made gate that had chainlink fixed to it. I drug it behind when I drilled my oats. I now have a cattle panel welded on it.

Tieing on some crossties or something to add weight might work in a pasture situation. But I really think you will need something that will get down and scratch the earth such as the chain harrows or old style section harrows.
 

Running Arrow Bill

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Two of the most important things when broadcasting seed: (1) Broadcast in slightly moist soil and then hope for more rain over the next 2 weeks. (2) Hope the birds don't find your seed!

In our area about the only thing I have success with broadcasting is Ryegrass (not cereal rye) seed. It is small seed and drops down into the grass thatch or small holes in ground. When I've tried broadcasting small grains (e.g., oats), the blackbirds eat the seed as fast as they hit the ground...seems birds can find a seed from 10,000 feet altitude or 2 miles away!! LOL! Other than that, I will water the ryegrass seed in good using portable sprinkler units for a week or so.
 

jedstivers

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nap":11se2owr said:
jedstivers":11se2owr said:
Nap, are you talking about sowing into grass or worked up ground?

Jed, I'm thinking about sowing it into grass similar to the way I sow rye.
sorry to be so long getting back, but wheat doesn't do good sown into grass. It would do ok if sown late right before frost but then you won't have enough growth until spring. When no-tilled early into sod it will come up but the grass keeps it chocked out.
 

Jogeephus

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1982vett":145o22dk said:
But I really think you will need something that will get down and scratch the earth such as the chain harrows or old style section harrows.

I'm with Vet on this. I think cereal rye would be hit or miss depending on the weather cause it really needs to be planted deeper than turnips, clover or rape.
 
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