A
Anonymous
i am crossing angus cattle with a beefmaster bull which would be the best bull to breed back to braunvieh or simm. on the beefmaster angus cross cows.
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OP
OP
Anonymous
I'd go with simmental. i have experience with this 3way but none with braunvieh. simmentalXangus crosses are readily accepted at the sale here but braunviehs not so much. plus with simm you could go either way to have black calves or white faced calves, whichever is more acceptable there. my opinion.
OP
OP
Anonymous
Until Braunvieh seedstock producers start producing enough bulls with reliable and unbiased EPDs I would stick with Simmenthals.
dun
> i am crossing angus cattle with a
> beefmaster bull which would be the
> best bull to breed back to
> braunvieh or simm. on the
> beefmaster angus cross cows.
dun
> i am crossing angus cattle with a
> beefmaster bull which would be the
> best bull to breed back to
> braunvieh or simm. on the
> beefmaster angus cross cows.
OP
OP
Anonymous
> i am crossing angus cattle with a
> beefmaster bull which would be the
> best bull to breed back to
> braunvieh or simm. on the
> beefmaster angus cross cows.
Simmentals and Braunvieh offer similar advantages: -both breeds produce good replacement heifers that milk well (be careful not to select too high of milk EPDs) -both breeds will increase carcass yield -both breeds will improve weaning and yearling weights.
In general Braunvieh cattle marble better than Simmental and may have a slight advantage on fertility (based on MARC data).
You may also want to consider Gelbvieh cattle. They offer similar advantages to Braunvieh and Simmental.
> beefmaster bull which would be the
> best bull to breed back to
> braunvieh or simm. on the
> beefmaster angus cross cows.
Simmentals and Braunvieh offer similar advantages: -both breeds produce good replacement heifers that milk well (be careful not to select too high of milk EPDs) -both breeds will increase carcass yield -both breeds will improve weaning and yearling weights.
In general Braunvieh cattle marble better than Simmental and may have a slight advantage on fertility (based on MARC data).
You may also want to consider Gelbvieh cattle. They offer similar advantages to Braunvieh and Simmental.
OP
OP
Anonymous
> Simmentals and Braunvieh offer
> similar advantages: -both breeds
> produce good replacement heifers
> that milk well (be careful not to
> select too high of milk EPDs)
> -both breeds will increase carcass
> yield -both breeds will improve
> weaning and yearling weights.
> In general Braunvieh cattle marble
> better than Simmental and may have
> a slight advantage on fertility
> (based on MARC data).
> You may also want to consider
> Gelbvieh cattle. They offer
> similar advantages to Braunvieh
> and Simmental.
why do you not want a bull with a high milk epd's you never said wich one you would choose and why
> similar advantages: -both breeds
> produce good replacement heifers
> that milk well (be careful not to
> select too high of milk EPDs)
> -both breeds will increase carcass
> yield -both breeds will improve
> weaning and yearling weights.
> In general Braunvieh cattle marble
> better than Simmental and may have
> a slight advantage on fertility
> (based on MARC data).
> You may also want to consider
> Gelbvieh cattle. They offer
> similar advantages to Braunvieh
> and Simmental.
why do you not want a bull with a high milk epd's you never said wich one you would choose and why
OP
OP
Anonymous
> I'd go with simmental. i have
> experience with this 3way but none
> with braunvieh. simmentalXangus
> crosses are readily accepted at
> the sale here but braunviehs not
> so much. plus with simm you could
> go either way to have black calves
> or white faced calves, whichever
> is more acceptable there. my
what is it they dislike about the braunviehs. and how did you work this three way cross
> opinion.
> experience with this 3way but none
> with braunvieh. simmentalXangus
> crosses are readily accepted at
> the sale here but braunviehs not
> so much. plus with simm you could
> go either way to have black calves
> or white faced calves, whichever
> is more acceptable there. my
what is it they dislike about the braunviehs. and how did you work this three way cross
> opinion.
OP
OP
Anonymous
> Until Braunvieh seedstock
> producers start producing enough
> bulls with reliable and unbiased
> EPDs I would stick with
> Simmenthals.
> dun
do you fill the same even if you are ai your cows
> producers start producing enough
> bulls with reliable and unbiased
> EPDs I would stick with
> Simmenthals.
> dun
do you fill the same even if you are ai your cows
OP
OP
Anonymous
> why do you not want a bull with a
> high milk epd's you never said
> wich one you would choose and why
Calves eat both grass and milk while with their mothers. It takes more grass to produce enough milk for a calf to gain a pound than it takes for a calf to gain a pound on grass alone.
Now, that being said, early in a calf's life he needs nutrients from both the cow's milk and from grass, but later on the calf can do just fine with minimal or no milk.
Consequently, why have heavy milking cows that consume more grass than necessary to produce more milk than is needed by the calf. Also, cows that milk heavy typically have a harder time staying in condition and often don't breed back as easily as cows with less milk production (because they put so much energy into making milk).
Heavy milking cows also tend to have more udder problems, so heavy milking cows typically don't stay in the herd for as many years of production as moderate or low milking cows.
I prefer Gelbvieh over Simmentals and Braunviehs. According to data from the Meat Animal Research Center (MARC) in Nebraska Gelbviehs wean more pounds of calf per cow exposed to the bull than Simmentals. This is huge when determining profitability of the cow herd.
I prefer Gelbviehs over Braunvieh because there EPDs are likely more accurate due to a much larger number of Gelbviehs in the Gelbvieh database than Braunviehs in the Braunvieh herdbook.
> high milk epd's you never said
> wich one you would choose and why
Calves eat both grass and milk while with their mothers. It takes more grass to produce enough milk for a calf to gain a pound than it takes for a calf to gain a pound on grass alone.
Now, that being said, early in a calf's life he needs nutrients from both the cow's milk and from grass, but later on the calf can do just fine with minimal or no milk.
Consequently, why have heavy milking cows that consume more grass than necessary to produce more milk than is needed by the calf. Also, cows that milk heavy typically have a harder time staying in condition and often don't breed back as easily as cows with less milk production (because they put so much energy into making milk).
Heavy milking cows also tend to have more udder problems, so heavy milking cows typically don't stay in the herd for as many years of production as moderate or low milking cows.
I prefer Gelbvieh over Simmentals and Braunviehs. According to data from the Meat Animal Research Center (MARC) in Nebraska Gelbviehs wean more pounds of calf per cow exposed to the bull than Simmentals. This is huge when determining profitability of the cow herd.
I prefer Gelbviehs over Braunvieh because there EPDs are likely more accurate due to a much larger number of Gelbviehs in the Gelbvieh database than Braunviehs in the Braunvieh herdbook.
OP
OP
Anonymous
With AI it's the same, non proven reliable bulls available. Many of the Braunvieh seedstock producers also seem to follow the flavor of the month club. Last year the big deal was the first homozygous black, polled Braunvieh bull.
dun
> do you fill the same even if you
> are ai your cows
dun
> do you fill the same even if you
> are ai your cows
OP
OP
Anonymous
We are using a charlois/braunvieh cross now on out angus/char cross and simm/char cross cows. I would personally chose the braunvieh if your confident in your breeder. I'll agree with Dun and say that a bunch of these breeders tend to be biased. Simmentals are an excelent breed for most of the same reasons such as growth and milk but we have in run in to problems with rattails out of the angus/simm cross. The only other thing I have to say is that it depends on your preference and the market your working with... good luck
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OP
OP
Anonymous
they dont like the marking around the nose, looks like a dairy breed. also they dont tend to be too keen on brindles either unless in the females.
we had some angus cows and crossed with beefmaster and got some great fertile milking cows and then used a simmental on those cows and got some greatheifers and now we are going back with angus and/or beefmaster bulls because we just really like the beefmasters and the buyers here dont care as long as the calves are black and long. so we keep all the heifers and will be marketing them as beefmaster crosses or we may get them E6 papers, i havent decided yet. sometimes we use charolais instead of simmental, infact a lot of our base cows before we used beefmastes were angusXcharolais. they seem to like charolais cross here.
we had some angus cows and crossed with beefmaster and got some great fertile milking cows and then used a simmental on those cows and got some greatheifers and now we are going back with angus and/or beefmaster bulls because we just really like the beefmasters and the buyers here dont care as long as the calves are black and long. so we keep all the heifers and will be marketing them as beefmaster crosses or we may get them E6 papers, i havent decided yet. sometimes we use charolais instead of simmental, infact a lot of our base cows before we used beefmastes were angusXcharolais. they seem to like charolais cross here.
OP
OP
Anonymous
they dont like the marking around the nose, looks like a dairy breed. also they dont tend to be too keen on brindles either unless in the females.
we had some angus cows and crossed with beefmaster and got some great fertile milking cows and then used a simmental on those cows and got some greatheifers and now we are going back with angus and/or beefmaster bulls because we just really like the beefmasters and the buyers here dont care as long as the calves are black and long. so we keep all the heifers and will be marketing them as beefmaster crosses or we may get them E6 papers, i havent decided yet. sometimes we use charolais instead of simmental, infact a lot of our base cows before we used beefmastes were angusXcharolais. they seem to like charolais cross here.
we had some angus cows and crossed with beefmaster and got some great fertile milking cows and then used a simmental on those cows and got some greatheifers and now we are going back with angus and/or beefmaster bulls because we just really like the beefmasters and the buyers here dont care as long as the calves are black and long. so we keep all the heifers and will be marketing them as beefmaster crosses or we may get them E6 papers, i havent decided yet. sometimes we use charolais instead of simmental, infact a lot of our base cows before we used beefmastes were angusXcharolais. they seem to like charolais cross here.
