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Black Simmental

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Anonymous

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We have a small commercial herd of about 90 total cattle. We are wanting to get black inserted into our herd. Our question is this. How profitable can Black Simmental bulls be with a set of mixed cows?

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A

Anonymous

Guest
depends on what is the main breed of your mixed herd, if the your cows are good milkers try Black Limo (it will give you lbs.), if they don't stick with Black Simmental (it will improve you herd far most for being a dual purpose breed)

> We have a small commercial herd of
> about 90 total cattle. We are
> wanting to get black inserted into
> our herd. Our question is this.
> How profitable can Black Simmental
> bulls be with a set of mixed cows?



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A

Anonymous

Guest
> depends on what is the main breed
> of your mixed herd, if the your
> cows are good milkers try Black
> Limo (it will give you lbs.), if
> they don't stick with Black
> Simmental (it will improve you
> herd far most for being a dual
> purpose breed) Alot of our herd is Simmy-x cows. We like the length and development of the calves we get. But, we have had trouble with disposition. I personally enjoy the flashiness of the Simmy Breed. any suggestions or comments would be appreciated



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Anonymous

Guest
Go with the Simmies, I like them too, maybe later you will use Black Limo or Black Angus(to increase hybrid vigor) if you have your herd in a commercial basis. Personally I like Reds.



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Anonymous

Guest
Black Simmental has been seeing a steady increase in demand in our area. I would caution to try and stay away from the grey calves...you could accomplish this by breeding diluted cows (yellows and greys) to red bulls.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
> Black Simmental has been seeing a
> steady increase in demand in our
> area. I would caution to try and
> stay away from the grey
> calves...you could accomplish this
> by breeding diluted cows (yellows
> and greys) to red bulls.

That is about what we do now. (Red Bulls to diluted cows.) We tend to get alot of mixed colored calves. With an operation of only about 90 head we need as much profit per calf as possible. Tell me if I am wrong, but it seems like nowadays black is what everyone is looking for. If we can combine black color with good simmy calves dont you think it would be more profitable?



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Anonymous

Guest
Yes, I agree...in a good market the greys do not get hit much, but in a down market, the buyers really seem to hammer them....We pay real close attention to the color history of our lighter cows, and, believe it or not, we have a few cows that I would call yellow that consistently have black calves. I am very partial to Simmentals, and the black color is also still in demand by the feeders, though the red purebreds are selling just as well as the blacks in the breeding stock market.
 
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A

Anonymous

Guest
A way to get some hybrid vigor and still and keep a good amount of simmy style, would be to use a simmy-angus bull. This way the calves are black with have good growth and carcass numbers. Also finding a black simmental with some Fleckvieh influence would also work. You will get growth and carcass and still be breeding with all Simmental. There are several Fleckvieh breeders who are doing this.

Matt Bar M Ranch Magnolia, TX

> We have a small commercial herd of
> about 90 total cattle. We are
> wanting to get black inserted into
> our herd. Our question is this.
> How profitable can Black Simmental
> bulls be with a set of mixed cows?



[email protected]
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
I would suggest good quality angus bulls Preferably black. You will get hybrid vigor and good quality replacement stock. If you go with a Black Simmi check on how much angus he has in is background. I am not saying that all black simmi's are part angus but the majority of the ones in my area are.

> Yes, I agree...in a good market
> the greys do not get hit much, but
> in a down market, the buyers
> really seem to hammer them....We
> pay real close attention to the
> color history of our lighter cows,
> and, believe it or not, we have a
> few cows that I would call yellow
> that consistently have black
> calves. I am very partial to
> Simmentals, and the black color is
> also still in demand by the
> feeders, though the red purebreds
> are selling just as well as the
> blacks in the breeding stock
> market.
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
> A way to get some hybrid vigor and
> still and keep a good amount of
> simmy style, would be to use a
> simmy-angus bull. This way the
> calves are black with have good
> growth and carcass numbers. Also
> finding a black simmental with
> some Fleckvieh influence would
> also work. You will get growth and
> carcass and still be breeding with
> all Simmental. There are several
> Fleckvieh breeders who are doing
> this.

> Matt Bar M Ranch Magnolia, TX

Matt S., When you talk about Simmy/Angus-x how much Angus influence do you get. I want to stay away from that as much as possible. It`s not that I dislike the Angus, but we are looking for something distinct with our herd. We want to stand out. In our area (Far NW Oklahoma) there are very few if any Black Simmy herds. We believe that something new would excite people and provide more profit. Also, would you explain the Fleckvieh breed for me. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thank You, Brad Z.

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A

Anonymous

Guest
I've seen the newest Tarentaise journal, and I can suggest the use of Tarentaise bulls in your herd, I didn't suggeted before because I'm new with Tarentaise and didn't know they also have Blacks (I prefer Reds) you could have more info. <A HREF="http://www.usa-tarentaise.com" TARGET="_blank">www.usa-tarentaise.com</A>

> We have a small commercial herd of
> about 90 total cattle. We are
> wanting to get black inserted into
> our herd. Our question is this.
> How profitable can Black Simmental
> bulls be with a set of mixed cows?



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OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
you will be very impress with the Tarentaise crosses

> I've seen the newest Tarentaise
> journal, and I can suggest the use
> of Tarentaise bulls in your herd,
> I didn't suggeted before because
> I'm new with Tarentaise and didn't
> know they also have Blacks (I
> prefer Reds) you could have more
> info. <A HREF="http://www.usa-tarentaise.com" TARGET="_blank">www.usa-tarentaise.com</A>



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A

Anonymous

Guest
Brad, Fleckvieh is not a breed. It is a strain of Simmental originating back to imports from mainly Germany and Austria. They generally are looser made cattle (some with a little more leather), moderate in frame and most are horned. We have had a few but with a higher demand for polled genetics are breeding mostly PB red and black Simmental. Hope that helps.

> Matt S., When you talk about
> Simmy/Angus-x how much Angus
> influence do you get. I want to
> stay away from that as much as
> possible. It`s not that I dislike
> the Angus, but we are looking for
> something distinct with our herd.
> We want to stand out. In our area
> (Far NW Oklahoma) there are very
> few if any Black Simmy herds. We
> believe that something new would
> excite people and provide more
> profit. Also, would you explain
> the Fleckvieh breed for me. Any
> advice would be greatly
> appreciated. Thank You, Brad Z.
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
> you will be very impress with the
> Tarentaise crosses

Since I posted my original message about Black Simmental`s a few days ago there has been alot of interest shown. I have another question. How popular are Black Simmy`s to the buyers and how good do they grade out at the packing plant? I appreciate everyone`s help and enjoy hearing everyone`s different opinion. Brad Z.

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A

Anonymous

Guest
you ask about how well does Black Simmental will grade, remember that your cow herd is commercial and mainly Simmental crosses. Purebred Simmental as for my experience grade at least low choice (mines are reds) so at least you will have the same with Blacks, but remember you need to check the EPD's of the bulls you will be using.

> We have a small commercial herd of
> about 90 total cattle. We are
> wanting to get black inserted into
> our herd. Our question is this.
> How profitable can Black Simmental
> bulls be with a set of mixed cows?



[email protected]
 
OP
A

Anonymous

Guest
> you ask about how well does Black
> Simmental will grade, remember
> that your cow herd is commercial
> and mainly Simmental crosses.
> Purebred Simmental as for my
> experience grade at least low
> choice (mines are reds) so at
> least you will have the same with
> Blacks, but remember you need to
> check the EPD's of the bulls you
> will be using.

Alejandro, thank you for all your posts. You made reference to me talking about our commercial herd. And, about following the EPD`s of the bulls we use. I wonder what you think about EPD`s. When you run the calves in the pen no one sees the EPD`S and when peopele eat the meat they dont see them either. I have seen alot of our own cross calves look and produce just as good as registered calves. I guess it is all just of the personal preference of the producer. What do you think?

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Anonymous

Guest
Epd's gives you an Idea of what you can expect in the future calves, but I think that it's just an idea. For the last 70 years my family have never used Epd's and we have been raising excellent registered cattle and we have been selling excellent beef. In the American market, the inconsistencies of the Angus breed have influenced all the breeds. I personally will never use a Black whatever breed in my herd specially in my commercials, I will prefer to use Fullbloods or Purebreds with the original characteristics of it's breed, not a Black Limo or Black Simmie or Black whatever, but if you will use a Black just check the Epd and see if it's progeny is what you are looking for.

> Alejandro, thank you for all your
> posts. You made reference to me
> talking about our commercial herd.
> And, about following the EPD`s of
> the bulls we use. I wonder what
> you think about EPD`s. When you
> run the calves in the pen no one
> sees the EPD`S and when peopele
> eat the meat they dont see them
> either. I have seen alot of our
> own cross calves look and produce
> just as good as registered calves.
> I guess it is all just of the
> personal preference of the
> producer. What do you think?



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A

Anonymous

Guest
> I raise mostly Texas Longhorns, some beef crosses and I'm not very familiar with all these black varieties of Limousin, Simmental etc. I see them advertized but I don't know much about them. In an earlier post it was mentioned to see how much Angus the black Simmental had in him-if it's not Angus influence that's giving the black color then what would it be? Also, I saw in the classifieds at this site that someone has a reg. Angus heifer bred to a Reg. Black Simmental bull to sale-they said that the calf would be eligible to be registered as a Simmental. What's this about? Do these associations allow you to register crosses? Is this part of a breeding up program? I don't mean to ask alot of questions-just curious. Thanks.

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Anonymous

Guest
I think you may be talking about my ad on cattle today. You can register half bloods in the Simmental Association. The black in Simmentals probably did come from Angus. If you want to know how much Angus that a Simmental has in it just look at the papers and it will tell you. Long ago they bred herefords into simmentals...i've got some cows with HH on their papers for horned hereford.

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