Black Herefords

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Anonymous

Hey Dun,
I'm a little confused on the black herefords, how they came about. Could you explain that in a way a blond would understand. It was your first post on the other black hereford topic. I would have went there but the coffee drinkers had this topic there, closed down, Just kidding guys!!!!
 
jcarkie":1ddcg547 said:
full blooded black hereford.
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No such thing!! :x These are composites; not herefords. As soon as the angus breed gets smart and changes the qualifications for CAB to angus-parentage instead of black hide, all the breeds who single-trait selected for black will wonder what to do with their pseudo-angus.
 
Let me take a crack at this and see if I can make sense of it for you. There is alot more to it than this but for simplicity sake lets talk about the black hide trait only. When you cross the angus and the hereford, The black fur color is dominant which we will label BL and the red color of the hereford is recessive which we will label bl. The white face is dominant on this cross mostly because there is such a depth of genetic information on the herefords that its hard to get rid of it. But the important thing is the hide color itself. On your first cross between a purebred angus and purebred hereford you will always get BLbl.

So your F1 cross is BLbl which is a black hide with calf with a recessive red hide gene.
if you take that BLbl calf and cross it back to a blbl (red hide hereford) your second cross will give you BLbl, BLbl, blbl, blbl or half black calves and half red calves but notice now that you have 3/4 hereford and 1/4 angus.
If you take those F2 BLbl calves and cross them back again with a blbl red hereford, you get the same combination of half black and half red calves but now you are at 7/8 hereford and 1/8 angus.
The next cross (F3) with the BLbl calves to a blbl red hereford gives you half black calves and half red calves but you are now up to 15/16 hereford and 1/16 angus.
If you breed your BLbl black 15/16 herefords calves back to other BLbl black 15/16 hereford calves your mix will look like this.

BLbl x BLbl = 25% BLBL, 50% BLbl , 25% blbl

Those BLBL calves are double black gene hereford cattle and every time you breed that back to a red hereford you will always get a calf that is BLbl or black hided and 31/32 hereford.

I hope that makes it a little clearer.

Trying to breed up recessive colors is alot tougher but there is a guy in Alberta breeding Black Charolais and the demand is far higher than his supply.
 
CRR, that did make it alot clearer to me. I wasn't thinking about it being a long process. So they are now a official breed???????????
 
Cattle Rack Rancher":1zg44vej said:
http://blackhereford.com/

This seems odd because Black Lims and Black Simms don't have their own breed as far as I know.
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Lims & Simms allow percentage cattle. Herefords don't. Therefore, to call them herefords, they had to make up their own breed. Basically anyone can make up a breed. Look at Roy Moseley with his herfsteins. Now all he needs is a website!!
 
Cattle Rack Rancher":1qd6wddx said:
http://blackhereford.com/

This seems odd because Black Lims and Black Simms don't have their own breed as far as I know.
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The NALF has started a "LimiFlex" program. They'll register Limousin/Angus crosses (of either color) as LimiFlex (hope that's spelled right). Gelbvieh has the "Balancer" program that's partly Angus. Maines have a "MainTainer" program that includes Angus. I guess the Simmentals will get around to it if they haven't already. The American Angus Association has even looked at starting a program for half blood Angus bulls.
 
Isn't the whole idea of a breed to give you a certain expected set of physical characteristics. For example with Black Angus, I expect a black hide, polled animal, with good marbling and relative calving ease. With a highlander I expect a hairy, long horned animal of smaller stature and excellent meat quality. Doesn't it take a long time to nail down these expected set of characteristics to get them consistent so you know more or less what to expect when you cross to another breed. Isn't this Herfstein thing just an F1 cross something like a Simm-Angus that will give you a variety of traits that may come from either parent but are not truly predictable? I know that its taken years to perfect the Speckle Park Breed and the Hays Converter to get an expected set of characteristics out of the calves.
 
Cattle Rack Rancher":orqww57x said:
Isn't the whole idea of a breed to give you a certain expected set of physical characteristics. For example with Black Angus, I expect a black hide, polled animal, with good marbling and relative calving ease. With a highlander I expect a hairy, long horned animal of smaller stature and excellent meat quality. Doesn't it take a long time to nail down these expected set of characteristics to get them consistent so you know more or less what to expect when you cross to another breed. Isn't this Herfstein thing just an F1 cross something like a Simm-Angus that will give you a variety of traits that may come from either parent but are not truly predictable? I know that its taken years to perfect the Speckle Park Breed and the Hays Converter to get an expected set of characteristics out of the calves.
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And these are some of the reasons that the Angus Association decided not to push a cross bred program. It's taken years to get the Angus EPD data base to where it is. IMO, it will take a lot more years of collecting data on these cross bred animals to get any sort of consistency.
 
Since the beginning of Angus there have been Red Angus. The attempt was to breed out the red and only have the black. They were not successful.

Tod


Ellie May":y566t74s said:
Black Herefords.....chuckle....that's like wanting to turn an Angus red. Well I guess they've done done that.
Ellie May
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Tod
There was many breeders trying to breed out the black gene. But It could not be done. For several decades there have been many prominent breeeders breeding Red Angus and they have done a very good job of breeding an excellent beef animal.
 
I checked out the website for the black herefords. You know it is sad we would rather change things than market them. I think I'll do a little on my own, when i sell freezer beef, get the word out," Nothin Better than Hereford Meat"! Sometimes people will take things like that and run with the word. (probably wishful thinking on my part, but somebodys got to do it) Never had anyone ask me what color my cows were yet, just wanted to know if i had any to sell. You think that's all there is to raising beef until you find cattle today, and boom, my what you learn!!! Can never get to much information, though! I do enjoy coming on here. Is there a chat room on here yet??? May God Bless you all!!!
 
Charlotte

That will probaly work. If you are selling a good quality fed beef you
will pprobaly be amazed at how many new orders you get. You probaly will not have enough to supply the demand.
 
t
charlotte4":zliy7v34 said:
I checked out the website for the black herefords. You know it is sad we would rather change things than market them. I think I'll do a little on my own, when i sell freezer beef, get the word out," Nothin Better than Hereford Meat"! Sometimes people will take things like that and run with the word. (probably wishful thinking on my part, but somebodys got to do it) Never had anyone ask me what color my cows were yet, just wanted to know if i had any to sell. You think that's all there is to raising beef until you find cattle today, and boom, my what you learn!!! Can never get to much information, though! I do enjoy coming on here. Is there a chat room on here yet??? May God Bless you all!!!
Click to expand...

I am staying red recently at sale I beat the black calves by 20 cents a pound. The angus people have an excellent job of marketing a good product. Some think that black hide is going to cure there problems. It's not about color it,s about quality. Cattlemen need to quit worring about color and improve the genetics of the herd. I will put my calves up against anyones, not bragging. This did not happen over night there are kick butt bloodlines out there. I have purchased quality herefords from all over the south, bulls from New Zealand. I origanally posted the first post about the Black Herefords because I was invited to the sale, curios on the reactions of cattleman on the breed.
 
is this black herford just a fad or is it here to sta. would they be worth investing into.
 

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