Birdsfoot Trefoil for Permanent Pasture ?

[Stocker Steve]

I found some re published permanent (10+ year) pasture renovation articles going back to the 40s. They mirrored some of my experiences. For a small increase in DM - - but a large increase in beef#/acre:

Test the pasture soil. Apply P & K & 50% of lime recommended.
Work with a disk and or a spring tooth.
Seed with BFT and a less competitive OG or timothy grass mixture. Expect the native blue grass to fill in.
Clip for weeds during establishment, leaving at least a 3" residual.

What do you think ?

 

[Nesikep]

Haven't been applying any NPK around here except through the cow manure, but we have a field that's going on 25 years since replanting, and the birdsfoot trefoil has crept in.. 15 years ago there was just one plant by the fence, and it's spread through most of the field. We harrow every spring and fall, otherwise just irrigate and graze.. I try to graze it fairly mature so it has a chance to set seed, and the cows trample it into the ground. The other plants are timothy, OG, Alfalfa, and DC red clover for the most part. It's not the most productive field, but when (if) I hay it, it is the most wonderful horse hay you can imagine.

 

[pdfangus]

ah...to be in a climate where we could raise Birdsfoot trefoil and Blue Grass and Timothy...just too hot and dry here....Orchardgrass is almost an annual crop the last few years....

if you have the climate they are great forages...

 

[toughntender]

Birdsfoot trefoil just doesn't seem to produce the tonnage that the clovers or alfalfa do. I've had much better luck using red clover in my permanent pastures. If I'm reseeding a piece I'll put in alfalfa and some RC along with the other grasses.

 

[Stocker Steve]

Birdsfoot trefoil just doesn't seem to produce the tonnage that the clovers or alfalfa do. I've had much better luck using red clover in my permanent pastures. If I'm reseeding a piece I'll put in alfalfa and some RC along with the other grasses.

How tall do you graze them and how long do they last?

 

[Aaron]

Broadcast elemental sulfur fertilizer and BFT seed this fall, sit back and wait.

 

[Stocker Steve]

USDA say "careful management" is required since BFT buds from lead axils, rather than a crown. They suggest leaving a 4" to 6" stubble and having a 60 day (go to seed) rest period every 3rd year.

BFT did not persist well in my previous mixes. My rotational rest periods were long enough - - but I think the residual height favored clovers, I did not do the 60 rest period, and the fescue grasses are pretty aggressive.

 

[Bigfoot]

Looks promising

http://extension.missouri.edu/p/g4640

 

[Nesikep]

toughntender is certainly right in saying BFT doesn't produce the tonnage, but I don't think it would cause bloat as easily as clover and alfalfa. We have a long rotation in our field, so it does mature out nicely, but it does get grazed down to the crown.

 

[Stocker Steve]

Looks promising

http://extension.missouri.edu/p/g4640

Excellent article. Sounds like my previous practice of mixing BFT with several other aggressive legume "weeds" is a issue.

Has anyone had success with mixing BFT and white clover for a grazing only paddock ?

 

[toughntender]

Stocker Steve- What are you trying to accomplish with this pasture? Are you trying to get maximum gain per acre or per head? I have grazed my alfalfa,clover(white & red), perennial ryegeass, tall & meadow fescue, festulolium, and orchard grass pastures just about every way possible. I have yet to have a problem with bloat. I am still trying to get a handle on high stock density grazing, but it holds a lot of promise. The only place I have any BFT is on one south facing sidehill that grows very little of anything. I just don't think it can compete with much else. As far as broadcasting elemental sulfur, only do that if your soil PH is super high. Gypsum would be a better choice for the sulfur.

 

[Stocker Steve]

I have yet to have a problem with bloat. The only place I have any BFT is on one south facing sidehill that grows very little of anything. I just don't think it can compete with much else.

Yes - the bloat boogie man is way way over rated.
Yes - BFT does not compete well in some mixes.
Yes - BFT does not compete well with short stubble heights or short rest periods.

But it does not make sense for a cow/calf operation to spend $500+ per acre to establish alfalfa everywhere. So I think there is a place for permanent BFT. Where BFT seems to shine is by providing high ADG in a low OH and/or low input grazing operation like leased land or acid meadows or bluegrass sod. I am trying to improve some low productivity native bluegrass hill sides and I think it may work well there. I prefer not to spray them out. I have tried picking enough rocks so you could drive over it, scratching the surface, and then bale grazing. I got a bumper crop of quack and Canada thistle. The next idea is adding some beet lime, scratching the surface, and applying a BFT/OG blend. I am tempted to include some white clover.

 

[toughntender]

Okay I understand now. I think it will work in that situation. Try grazing that area really hard this fall. Beat the crap out of it. Frost seed your mix and then stay off of it next spring until it looks strong enough to graze. I still think you should put a pound or two of red clover in the mix just in case.

 

[toughntender]

What is beet lime by the way? I'm not familiar with it.

 

[AllForage]

Nice thing about BFT is it can spread. It tolerates poorer soils and wetter soils than alfalfa. While I certainly favor alfalfa, BFT has its place.

Personally taking grazing and seed advice over the web seems a bit foolish. Everyone is a premier pasture manager online. I like to see places with my own eyes. Just drove to OK and back and funny thing is I saw a lot of @400 pound calves and skinny cows. Lots of false perceptions of reality in agriculture. Also lots of pastures reduced to putting greens.

 

[pdfangus]

Nice thing about BFT is it can spread. It tolerates poorer soils and wetter soils than alfalfa. While I certainly favor alfalfa, BFT has its place.

Personally taking grazing and seed advice over the web seems a bit foolish. Everyone is a premier pasture manager online. I like to see places with my own eyes. Just drove to OK and back and funny thing is I saw a lot of @400 pound calves and skinny cows. Lots of false perceptions of reality in agriculture. Also lots of pastures reduced to putting greens.

true enough.... :cowboy:

 

[toughntender]

I totally agree! Grazing management is something that needs a lot of work in this country.

 

[Stocker Steve]

I ran into some old studies where there was an interaction between lime and phosphorus for most legumes. The more lime you added - - the less the response there was from P. Soil ph started the mid 5s.

They avoided any economics, said responses varied even with similar starting ph, and suggested 3 tons of lime per acre seemed like a good idea. Have you every seen any economic data that supported lime application for BFT or clovers ?

 

[Dave]

I ran into some old studies where there was an interaction between lime and phosphorus for most legumes. The more lime you added - - the less the response there was from P. Soil ph started the mid 5s.

They avoided any economics, said responses varied even with similar starting ph, and suggested 3 tons of lime per acre seemed like a good idea. Have you every seen any economic data that supported lime application for BFT or clovers ?

The reason that adding lime reduced the response from added P is that raising the soil pH will make P that is already in your soil more plant available. At a lower pH there is a significant amount of P that is tied up tightly in the soil and not plant available. This is true of other nutrients too.