Best business model when unable to winter cattle?

[Xgymnast27]

Hello all!

My parents just offered hubby and I free use of their 300 acre pasture, as long as we cover the $500/year cost of the electricity to the well (along with any other electricity costs) and keep up with the fencing. We are still discussing ideas of what we want to do with the pasture, but I wanted to pick everyone's brains here since you guys have been there, done that. Right now the pasture is mostly set up for spring/summer/fall use, and I need to look into the water situation (there is a creek plus the well), but my dad didn't sound like it was recommended for winter.

First off, pasture is right next to my parents' place but they aren't going to check on anything for us, other than probably letting us know if a cow is out wandering around on the road. It's about 30 miles one way from our house to the pasture, but we visit my parents fairly often and I show horses and use the indoor arena just down the road from my parents' often. I wouldn't want to be out to check the pasture daily, but it could be done one or twice weekly. Hubby and I have 2 acres where we keep our show horses, and if needed, could calve out heifers, bring a cow to be doctored, etc. to our place as needed. I am a horse gal with minimal cattle knowledge (but learned a lot while dating a rancher a couple years ago) and hubby knows nothing. We want to start small so we can learn without making huge financial mistakes. We each have our own separate jobs that bring in a steady income, so this is more of a hobby for us, but it would sure be nice if we could at least break even or even make a small profit (to make up for the money lost to the horses, haha!).

Our thoughts right now are to buy some bred cows in the early spring, let them calve and pasture them all summer, then sell them in the fall (before Labor Day is what I've read?). Is it better to start with short term cows, regular bred cows or bred heifers? Should we pick up a bull to breed the cows back to, and then sell them as bred cows in the fall with or without their calves as pairs? I have also wondered about buying a heifer bull (that could be wintered at my house), buying yearlings in the early spring, breeding them, feeding them all summer and then selling them as bred heifers in the fall? What other business models should we consider?

We would love to hear all your tips, hints and things we should know before we jump into this!

Thank you!

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

You have some good ideas. But, not having any experience with cattle, I would suggest purchasing feeder steers/heifers in the spring. Let them graze/grow and sell in the fall. First thing before you purchase cattle, you should have some way to catch and treat them. Facilities are the first and utmost importance. Cattle are not like horses. You are not going to be able to put out a pan of feed & slip a halter on them. You need a catch corral with a work chute. Doesn't have to be fancy, just sturdy.
This way, you buy in the spring, sell in the fall and have nothing on the land in the winter.

 

[Xgymnast27]

Yes, headcatch will be purchased. Is there anything else we should get? We can build pens as needed too.

Would it be better to buy steers and pasture them in the summer and sell in the fall? Or is the heifer/bred cow idea a sound one? Thank you!

We do have many friends that know cattle inside and out, as we are in a very heavy cattle ranching area.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

I am a purebred breeder, so I am not the best to advise about buying & selling. That is a totally different game than what I do to make a living. I'll let some commercial cattlemen chime in. there are several on this board that buy & sell.

 

[chaded]

If it was me and I wasn't wintering anything I would buy some feeder calves in the spring and sell in the fall. If I did do the bred cow thing I wouldn't be doing it with bred heifers. Ultimately, if this is a hobby then you should do what you think you will enjoy (this can change as well) or it isn't worth the hassle.

 

[BlondeD]

Start slow.....then you can work your way into the project. Work on the grass.....your primary resource..

 

[Dave]

In the right market doing the bred heifer thing is a money maker. Right now is not the right market. I did the older cow one and done thing for years. I always made money with it. Buying short breds in the spring and selling as fall pairs can work. Stockers work as well. Both of those last two as much money is made in the buying and selling as in the raising of them. The thing is to watch and study the market.

 

[bird dog]

What is your location and how is your grass? This would allow us to answer more accurately.

 

[Stocker Steve]

Best business depends on your skill and your grass and your location.

Marketing cattle can be an expensive skill to learn. Who, how, where, would you buy cattle for a start?

 

[sstterry]

A friend of mine is paid to graze 100 steers throughout the Spring and Summer. He gets paid by the pound of gain. Mid October the owner comes and gets them. No worry of wintering and hay. He does have to buy some hay during dry times.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Yes, I forgot about that option. Just let someone else own them, just feed them with your grass.

 

[Stocker Steve]

Where custom grazing gets semi interesting is ROI. It costs a pile to stock 300 acres on grass here.

 

[darcelina4]

Since you are new to cattle I would not buy heifers. I think if you bought 3rd stage bred 3 to 8 year old cows in late feb/early march, calve them, buy a 2 year old black bull to breed them back, you might do ok selling in the fall. Dont wait too late. I agree that you need a chute and catch pens to doctor them. You might want to stop by the vet on your way home with them to work them (vaccines, deworm, multimin shot). I think you need to check on them every other day. That might be a nice de-stressing trail for your show horses too. I would tell you to buy all black cows. 300 acres can feed lots of cows but you might not want to get in over your head with the first bunch. You might want to see if you can find someone to bale hay off it on shares. You can never have too much hay piled up.

 

[farmerjan]

All of the ideas are good ones, in their own way. I would say that trying to find someone that is looking for pasture, and custom grazing is the least cost way to get some return. Couple of things. The animals are usually weaned, so not trying to go through fences looking for momma. They are already worked by the owner. If they are looking to pasture for rate of gain, you are getting paid for how much they gain in weight. You have no initial outlay, but need to be able to check on them several times a week and be able to get them in for any doctoring as has been said before. If the person is wanting you to graze heifers, many times if they are planning for them to be bred, they also supply the bull(s). We have a neighbor that does that, and they come in Spring, and will be going out by the middle of Nov. They are heifers that are put out with a bull to be bred. His business is selling bred heifers. He has been doing it for years and has a good reputation.

Definitely DO NOT start with bred heifers. There are just too many possible problems and you admitted you are new(ish) to this. I honestly would not even do bred cows as the markets are not great for feeder calves right now, and feeders do bring more in the spring than the fall. There is always a glut of feeders for sale in the fall as everyone that does not winter over calves is pulling calves off cows in the fall to sell.

As was stated, the money to be made is as much in the buying as the selling. You have to know what you are doing on the buying end. A good "buy" could result in a pen of "trailer weaned" calves that get sick in the transition from home, to stockyards, no mommas, to your place and need treatments.... time and money. If you lose one or 2 you have lost a major amount of profit. If you are still "green" you are not going to know if a pen of seemingly "cheap" calves is on the edge of getting sick.

Checking twice a week or so is not going to cut it with either calving cows or young weaned feeders; at least not for the first few weeks.
Example. Been in the cattle business a few years. I was checking on the first calf heifers daily and they were popping them out like popcorn. Small calves from a good easy calving bull. The very last one I noticed was off by herself and looking to calve . Went and hauled a load of water as the spring has been slow with our drought. Checked her again, and only 1 foot out. Called my son to get help to get her in the barn. Other foot was bent back at the knee, couldn't push it back in, had to pull it with me pulling the bent leg with my hand inside, and my son on the calf jack. Not a big deal, but she couldn't have it by herself. Calf was dead from being "stuck", and the sack had broken so it suffocated in the pelvis because there was no room for it to get out to breathe. An hour or so..... Can happen to a cow too. Just bad luck that the foot/leg didn't extend with the other one. She passed the afterbirth, looks good and will hopefully breed back. If I hadn't been watching, she could have been like that for a day, gotten paralyzed, gone down, or died or anything.

I like that you want to utilize this pasture. But I would suggest that having someone else's cattle, to only have to deal with them staying healthy and gaining weight, would be an easier way to get used to having cattle, and seeing what they need and all. Or, if you are surrounded by cattlemen, maybe doing a deal with one and working with them to get some practical experience???? Maybe you will find that cattle aren't your thing.

Right now the cattle business is going to break even in most cases if you are lucky. Prices are down, and things are not looking up for at least a year or more. There are too many variables with the trade deals and such too. For someone who doesn't have alot of experience in cattle, it is a real risk, and putting out a bunch of money with no good solid expectation of returns is tough.

 

[T & B farms]

I'm not sure where you are located, but I'm looking for somewhere to send some bred heifers. The guy that has been grazing mine from may 1 - oct 1 for the last several years retired and sold his ground.

 

[farmerjan]

Please post your general location. It might help you to connect with someone. Like T & B farms above, there is an opportunity to get your feet wet, get some experience, and not have any big initial outlay. Already bred heifers, or even heifers that someone is getting bred, like our neighbor does, require less "effort" than say calving cows, or young weaned cattle.

 

[snoopdog]

It seems as if we go through the location thing too often, maybe admin should listen. Nobody wants your address, but dang its different answers to these questions in south texas or wyoming, rant over. Good weaned and vacced feeder steers are your safest bet, if you want to own them, once or twice a week checking won't cut it.