Not all Brangus have the attitude that yours do. and any other cow of any other breed can have the same or worse. Beefmaster., Braford, Brangus, Santa Getrudis, are all 3/8ths Brahma.
Beefmaster vs braferd
- Thread starter georgiabob
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Yep. Though he said this time he was breeding for replacement heifers, the black hided heifers will make him a better brood cow\, as they will be more likely to have black calves. And, the ones he decides not to keep will sell for more than any from a Beefmaster bull.
georgiabob
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Beefmaster are 50 percent
Caustic Burno
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Brahman or Brahman composite cattle are dog gentle and you can lead them anywhere if raised by someone who knows how to handle Brimmers.
You can lead them anywhere, they don't play cowboy and they remember any perceived mistreatment for a long time.
You can lead them anywhere, they don't play cowboy and they remember any perceived mistreatment for a long time.
georgiabob
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I don't play cowboy and i am around my cows every day. The only one i still have that i have to watch in a tight space is a brangus. I've got two cows that were flat abused and were run by cattle dogs and probably used for roping practice that will come into a corral with me if they think they might get a snack or some scratching. I agree that they remember if they think you wronged them but i think some just get their feelings hurt easier than others.
You brought up the good point about the musle of the black one. Look for that muscle, no paint, and cleaner lines. There is no reason to settle. Look for a bull that has all those qualities.
I'll throw a little some thing one the side. In Beefmasters I prefer solid colors like a solid red all the way to a dun color. Some will almost get white. I dont worship at the altar of the black hide but dont want to cut myself short with paint up the sides and what not if I can prevent it. The deep reds, duns, etc will help when crossing back later on for terminal calves.
On the temperament any of these breeds being talked about can be hot headed. You will have to make that a priority on the bull you buy that he is good tempered. My family has ran Beefmasters for years. Some are really easy going... some are not. We were sorting through some heifers a couple months ago to hold replacements and sifting out any thing that was high headed. When I went to load out the culls one decided she had had enough and was flat out after me. She got in my hip pocket several times. I was sore the next day from trying to run so hard. I ended up getting her to chase me to a smaller pen where we could put some other calves with her and force her on the trailer.
TwoByrdsMG
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georgiabob- if those are your two choices I'd maybe keep looking. The black/chrome bull is dang near dragging his pecker though he sure packs a volume punch. The red one doesn't scream "bull" to me- I'd castrate that fella.
I have to agree, Caustic, about them being some of the gentlist cattle you can have. Not sure what you mean by "cowboying", but like any other cattle I have fooled with, I won't get in a fence, corral pen or anywhere around them or any cow, without being horseback. In my life I bet I have spent maybe 60-80 hours total working with cattle on foot, vs 1000's of hours on horseback. Any Brahmas or BR x's I have had or helped someone with, have always responded very well to being handled on horseback.. Any I have had or fooled with...knock on wood... would allow one to ease through the herd, ride right up to a new-born calf, sort the cattle, , pen them, heel the calves and drag them to the fire, ., etc., without breaking into a run, or getting wild-eyed and snorting, etc. I have seen them be more nervous and flighty, once in the pens, with men on foot. But as you say, you have to know how to handle them. They are not necessarily afraid of closed spaces, confinement, etc. no more so than any other cattle. Every Friday and Saturday night all over America, during rodeo season, Brahma-cross bulls are loaded, unloaded, confined in pens, and ultimatley, run into bucking chutes, which are about as confining as you can get. Yeah, I have had to catch some wild Brahma cows before, just like I have had to catch Herefords or Jereseys. Brahmas are no where near as fast as a Longhorn, and no where near as strong as a Continental beef cow. They can be roped and caught as easy as any others. Well., none of them are easy, no matter the breed, but if you have horses and men who know what they are doing, they are no more problem than any others.
About 45 years ago, there was a neighbor's kid, 12 or so, whose father and uncles were all big row crop farmers. Lil Billy( his dad was called Big Bill) wanted to get some cows, so they got him about 20-30 mostly angus cows. Lil Billy sluing a fit to get a Brahma bull after he saw one at the fair, so they got him one... grey, polled and huge. He named him General Lee. Lil Bill could walk out into the pasture when General Lee was lying down, and just sit there on his back with him, or lay beside him and use him for a pillow. When he wanted to get the cows up, he could put his hand under the bull's chin, or take him by an ear, and lead him to the barn, and the cows would follow.
Caustic Burno
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I quit hay burners decades ago for a white bucket.
If they don't come running when I call them their checkout date is the next trip to the barn.
Life is too short to put up with bad cattle.
If they don't come running when I call them their checkout date is the next trip to the barn.
Life is too short to put up with bad cattle.
Use what ever the cows are use to. If they are use to being on foot... be on foot... if they are use to horses... use horses... if they are use to pink barbie jeeps... use pink barbie jeeps.
Being horseback gives some people a false sense of security. When your horse gets thrown out of the working pens you will think twice about being horseback.
Especially with Brahman cross cattle always ask how they work them and insist on getting in a pen with them on foot if that how you plan to work them. Walk behind them and make sure they will turn their butt to you and walk away. Look for high heads right when you step foot in the pen. Make sure they dont square up to you and try to do that backing mess while looking at you. See how big their flight zone is.. no flight zone is just as bad as a huge flight zone.
That all goes back to buying cattle from operations who operate like you do... or in my case... where I want to be.
Being horseback gives some people a false sense of security. When your horse gets thrown out of the working pens you will think twice about being horseback.
Especially with Brahman cross cattle always ask how they work them and insist on getting in a pen with them on foot if that how you plan to work them. Walk behind them and make sure they will turn their butt to you and walk away. Look for high heads right when you step foot in the pen. Make sure they dont square up to you and try to do that backing mess while looking at you. See how big their flight zone is.. no flight zone is just as bad as a huge flight zone.
That all goes back to buying cattle from operations who operate like you do... or in my case... where I want to be.
bird dog
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If you do end up with some good mama cows of either breed, I would then consider a straight Angus bull instead of the Brangus. The Brangus may put to much ear in the calves or at least that is what I have seen with my group. This is only if at that time you are looking to raise marketable stocker calves. The angus will also give you mostly black calves and knock the horns off.
Where he is located... here in Georgia... a part Brangus won't get docked. A homozygous for black, BB, bull... Angus or Brangus... will always throw a black calf.
Never have found anything false about the security of being horse back myself. And, I never met the cow or bull yet that could throw one of my horses out of a pen!! Maybe 50 years ago I might could climb or jump up on a corral panel to get away from a cow, but not now. I have, however, ran over a bovine or two that had someone pinned down or against something before. Stomp their ass one good time with your horse, and they will learn to respect them right quick.Use what ever the cows are use to. If they are use to being on foot... be on foot... if they are use to horses... use horses... if they are use to pink barbie jeeps... use pink barbie jeeps.
Being horseback gives some people a false sense of security. When your horse gets thrown out of the working pens you will think twice about being horseback.
Especially with Brahman cross cattle always ask how they work them and insist on getting in a pen with them on foot if that how you plan to work them. Walk behind them and make sure they will turn their butt to you and walk away. Look for high heads right when you step foot in the pen. Make sure they dont square up to you and try to do that backing mess while looking at you. See how big their flight zone is.. no flight zone is just as bad as a huge flight zone.
That all goes back to buying cattle from operations who operate like you do... or in my case... where I want to be.
One of my favorite cow ponies ever was a Mr. Gunsmoke stallion I had in the 80's and early 90's. One summer I was riding through the pasture with my helper in the truck, to go work on the fence in the back of the place. Saw a Braford cow stranding over something that I figured was a calf ( a surprise calf that time of year). Rode up close to it, and she took off all snorty and wild-eyed, with the calf trying to keep up. I saw where he had skinned his back in several places, and the flies were blowing it. I went to the barn, and got the stuff I needed to treat it, saddled up Smoke, and told my helper to follow me in my truck. His border collie/Aussie shephard jumped it and went too. Well, got back out to the bitch, and she took off like a bat out of hell, with that calf right on her heels. We came to a barb wire cross fence and she sailed over it flat-footed, and I heeled the calf right about the time he tried to jump through. His front legs got twisted between the bottom and next to the bottom strand, and I got off the tend to him. Smoke was working the rope good, and had it a little too tight for me to get the calves legs out. Calf bellowed like I was killing it, and here came Momma back over the fence, and tried to get in my pocket. Helper jumped out of the truck, got a fence post out of the back, and busted her in the face with it , as she ran over him and never slowed down. LOL. Dog jumped out and got in front of her, and she planted him too. I finally got the calves legs out about the time the cow got to me. When Smoke realized it was free, he spun around and got down cutting that cow better than any WGC I ever saw in Augusta. He was popping his teeth and snaking his head at her, trying his damndest to bite her. When she backed off a little. he turned his ass to her and went to backing her across the pasture, kicking the ever-loving daylights out of her. I put the calf in the back of the truck, and loaded what was left of the dog and my helper in too, and doctored the calf from there. Smoke wouldn't let that cow within 50 feet of the truck. Had we been on foot, the cow would have hurt us. Well, if I didn't have the horse, never could have caught that calf that day anyway.
I realize that everyone with cattle can't use horses, for several reasons; Can't afford them, dunno how to use them, don't have the pasture, hay etc for them. And I found out a long time ago, that you can teach a horseman to be a cattlemen, a HELL of a lot easier than you can teach a cow farmer to be a horseman!
I have seen cattle that you couldn't get in a pen on foot with, for sure. But never seen any of these yet that I couldn't settle down to using a horse with them. Never seen cattle though, that you couldn't work with a horse...if the facilities are built for working cattle... that you could safely work on foot. But to get back to the original discussion, I have found that Brahmas and Brahma crosses are no harder or no easier than any other breed to handle. I think they are like pit bulls...people tend to be scared of how they look. However, cocker spaniels account for more dog bites than pits do.
tex452
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I like the red one
Caustic Burno
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The black one is just the septic tank of Angus genetics.
Might as well run the real thing.
georgiabob
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yeah, a brangus bull for terminal crosses a couple of years down the road would be the plan. i'm not looking to run a giant herd just to dump all the calves at a sale barn. the prices are pretty good around here right now but i don't expect that to last forever. if i could sell 10-15 a year direct to the end consumer that would be fine with me. i'm old enough to not need to make a lot of money and a small herd would be something to do when i retire until i'm too old to do it anymore. then i can just sell the entire farm and live in a condo on a lake somewhere.
Jeanne - Simme Valley
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If, down the road, you decide you want to breed to black - you have lots of choices BESIDES Angus. PB Homozygous black, homozygous polled Simmental would do wonders on your herd.
And I agree on the bull selection. Don't settle for ONE trait that you like. You want muscling along with clean lines and temperament - and polled.
And I agree on the bull selection. Don't settle for ONE trait that you like. You want muscling along with clean lines and temperament - and polled.
georgiabob
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I'm not bent on angus at all. I watch which cows hunt shade trees and which are up grazing. The angus seem to draw more flies too. A nickel or a dime a pound at a sale barn probably can made up in weight and less chemicals in the summer.
Jeanne - Simme Valley
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We have great RED homo polled too!! LOL!!
