Baldy breeding - suggestions wanted

[moses388]

I am used to breeding cattle that are a single color - Angus, Limousin, Lincoln Red, and Murray Grey. However, there is one baldy cow; this cow is out of an Angus bull. As you can see in the photo, I have bred her to some things including Murray Grey.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/14MXgos7eysNoPQNHicJEMLvDCk8dG9s7/view?usp=sharing

I have not found any of these matings appealing, but this Spring she had a baldy Angus heifer. I think she looks good. I am not sure I want to start breeding white faced cattle, because you never know how the face will look.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1fHnasmwsDlPdMD4Es1-l2zkRR2R-Zw_8/view?usp=sharing

Is there a method to breeding baldy cattle? The matings I have used on my other cattle, do not work on the baldy cow. I have taken a brown-colored Murray Grey and bred her to Red Angus to get a black calf. On the baldy cow the calf will be black, red or black does not matter. When bred to Red Angus, you lose most of the white face and get a brockle face calf. When bred to Murray Grey, you get a baldy silver calf like you see in the photo above.

If I would keep the calf for breeding, I might try a baldy Simmental: LMF Revenue Z24 ASA# 2670825. Suggestions, comments, opinions?? Thanks.

 

[Rafter S]

I have to ask the obvious question. If you want baldy calves from solid color cows why not breed to a Hereford bull? You'll still get some mottle-face or blaze-face calves, but less than from any other breed.

 

[M.Magis]

Not sure I understand what the goal is here? Why so much worry about the facial markings of one cow's calves?

 

[Little Joe]

Calves look good I wouldn't worry too much about the markings on the face or changing bulls for just one cow.

 

[moses388]

I have to ask the obvious question. If you want baldy calves from solid color cows why not breed to a Hereford bull? You'll still get some mottle-face or blaze-face calves, but less than from any other breed.

I am not trying to breed baldy calves from solid color cows. Out of all the cows it just happens that I have one that is a baldy. And it just happens that for the first time in 4 years, this cow gave birth to an attractive looking heifer. So my options are to keep the heifer for a replacement or sell her as a feeder calf. Sell or keep - what do you think?

I am saying that if I retain the heifer, I would use a baldy AI sire so as not to lose the baldy face. Is it too complicated to manage solid color cows and baldy cows together?

 

[MurraysMutts]

Well. I think the method of breeding would be up to the breeder in what he is trying to achieve.
I like the lil black baldy heifer u posted a picture of.
Why not keep her?
Are u trying to match her calves up to what your other calves look like?
Just like to experiment?

 

[Rafter S]

I am not trying to breed baldy calves from solid color cows. Out of all the cows it just happens that I have one that is a baldy. And it just happens that for the first time in 4 years, this cow gave birth to an attractive looking heifer. So my options are to keep the heifer for a replacement or sell her as a feeder calf. Sell or keep - what do you think?

I am saying that if I retain the heifer, I would use a baldy AI sire so as not to lose the baldy face. Is it too complicated to manage solid color cows and baldy cows together?

I guess I wasn't clear on what you're trying to achieve, and I'm not sure I do now either, but I'll try to help. To answer the highlighted question, it depends on your goal. If you want uniformly colored calves, then I wouldn't keep her. If you want to keep the heifer because you like her markings (and I don't have any issue with that), then go ahead and keep her, but accept the fact that her calves will likely not match the other ones.

 

[Ky hills]

I'm still not sure what the goal is either, I don't have much white face knowledge other than from a Hereford. We use Hereford bulls with black cows and the calves come out with a range of markings from solid white face to brockle faces and a few with very little white. If we retain those heifer calves and breed them back to an Angus bull for 3/4 Angus calves, some will still have the range of white on their face and some will be solid black, doesn't matter to us as black and BWF calves sell well together.

 

[Rafter S]

I'm still not sure what the goal is either, I don't have much white face knowledge other than from a Hereford. We use Hereford bulls with black cows and the calves come out with a range of markings from solid white face to brockle faces and a few with very little white. If we retain those heifer calves and breed them back to an Angus bull for 3/4 Angus calves, some will still have the range of white on their face and some will be solid black, doesn't matter to us as black and BWF calves sell well together.

As far as I know, if you want straight white-faced calves, and not brindles or blaze faces, you need to stick with straight Herefords (sire and dam).

 

[Ky hills]

As far as I know, if you want straight white-faced calves, and not brindles or blaze faces, you need to stick with straight Herefords (sire and dam).

That is correct in theory but for what ever reason possibly outside breed genetics in some purebred cattle some F1 Hereford Angus cross calves can have varied black markings on their faces.

 

[Rafter S]

That is correct in theory but for what ever reason possibly outside breed genetics in some purebred cattle some F1 Hereford Angus cross calves can have varied black markings on their faces.

Yes, that's why I said to reliably have solid white face calves both the sire and dam should be Hereford, not just one. Maybe I wasn't clear.

 

[Ky hills]

Yes, that's why I said to reliably have solid white face calves both the sire and dam should be Hereford, not just one. Maybe I wasn't clear.

Sorry, I misread your post. Yes I agree with your statement with 2 Herefords.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Even with two Herefords, you can get goggles or mottle faced.
If you breed white face to a white face, you open the door to get white on bellie, face, legs, tail.
Your cow is carrying the red gene and the diluter gene. All her offspring will carry 1 red gene from her. It will be black if bred to a homozygous black bull (calf will be heterozygous black - 1 black & 1 red gene). The "black" factored calf may be black, grey, chocolate, silver, mouse colored if it inherits the diluter gene. If you breed to a red bull, calf will be red and even if the calf inherits the diluter gene, you won't be able to tell by the calf's color.
I believe we are all still confused as to your goals. "If" you are looking for a solid white face from this cow, you will never get 100% solid white face calves.
Personally, I love the variation of white markings on the face. Mottled, blaze, crooked blaze, star, snip, etc. Love it! Full white face (baldie) is the least of my likes.
You sure can ID your cattle easier. LOL

 

[MurraysMutts]

Hereford heifer.
Black white face bull.
Prime example...


Solid Black cow.
Hereford bull.

I've gotten brockles/mottles/goggles/masks
Some have white on the belly. Some do not.

As an aside.. I plan on keeping at least a couple of these heifers w white in em. Maybe breed em to a black bull?

 

[moses388]

This year for the first time, the brown white face cow had an all-black calf. image_link

If this calf is kept for a replacement, would the offspring be all-black?

 

[Warren Allison]

Is there a method to breeding baldy cattle?

Black baldies are 1/2 Hereford and 1/2 Angus. If you have Hereford cows, then get a homozygous for black....BB... reg black angus bull, and you will always have black baldy calves. If you have a commercial, Angus cow herd, you may have some black cows that are heterazygous for black..bb.. and breeding to a Hereford bull would result in some red calves. This is why the Black Hereford breed was developed. You can get a reg homozygous for black Black Hereford bull, to breed to them, and all the calves will be black baldies.

 

[Warren Allison]

This year for the first time, the brown white face cow had an all-black calf. image_link

If this calf is kept for a replacement, would the offspring be all-black?

Only if she were breed to a homozygous black bull.

 

[Warren Allison]

I am saying that if I retain the heifer, I would use a baldy AI sire so as not to lose the baldy face. Is it too complicated to manage solid color cows and baldy cows together?

A baldy AI sire? Does anyone collect grade, cross bred bulls for AI? There are people who keep and breed their black baldy heifers for sure, but I haven't heard of anyone leaaving a black baldy bull calf uncut, and trying to use him as a sire much less collect to sell semen.

 

[Brute 23]

A baldy AI sire? Does anyone collect grade, cross bred bulls for AI? There are people who keep and breed their black baldy heifers for sure, but I haven't heard of anyone leaaving a black baldy bull calf uncut, and trying to use him as a sire much less collect to sell semen.

Its call a Black Hereford.

 

[Ky hills]

A baldy AI sire? Does anyone collect grade, cross bred bulls for AI? There are people who keep and breed their black baldy heifers for sure, but I haven't heard of anyone leaaving a black baldy bull calf uncut, and trying to use him as a sire much less collect to sell semen.

We left two BWF calves intact last week when we worked our calves.
Used a BWF 3/4 Angus 1/4 Hereford bull some last year and getting ready before long to turn him out with cows again soon.