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BAHIA GRASS AND SAND BURS

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BRYANT

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I would like to know if any one knows any thing about this ; I was at a place the other day where a man had planted Bahia grass to get rid of sand burs and ever place he had planted Bahia there was no sand burs but where there was no Bahia it was covered with sand burs He said Bahia thrives on sand burs is this true? might be help full to know we are in central Okla. and this year we have a bumper crop of sand burs
 

novatech

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Most other grasses will choke out grass burrs in time when fertilized and has enough water. Grass burrs do equally as well growing with Bahia or coastal. I have a pasture with coastal, Bahia, bluestem and grass burs. Where the other grasses are thick there are few to no burs. Where the burs are thick I am sprigging in Tif 85.
On another note, I have watched my cattle eat it, burs and all. I have even baled it.
Last year I had a bumper crop of burs. This year I had very few. But we were in drought this year so had very little of anything.
 
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Im lucky - I dont have any grass burs. But I do know that straight Bahai chokes out most everything. In fact, it is becoming very common for people who are renovating CRP ground or very rough pastures to plant Bahai and let it do most of the work for them.
 

mnmtranching

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What I've noticed in sand burrs [at least in our Northern variety] Sand burrs need full sunlight and worked soil. Get shaded out easily and won't compete with perennials. So with a sand burr problem plant a grass variety that grows fast and thick and it should eliminate the sand burrs.
 

Jogeephus

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I've been thinking on this thread for a bit and I can't say I've ever noticed sand spurs in bahia grass. I've always been told if you have good fertility then the spurs won't live. This is not true cause I got some in a bermuda field that has wonderful fertility and they are spreading like wildfire. So the only thing I can think of is that bahia begins its spring growth earlier than bermuda and has a jump on choking the seedlings out before they can get established. Only reason I can think of, somebody please feel free to shoot holes in this thought.
 

msscamp

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mnmtranching":xbdk6x81 said:
What I've noticed in sand burrs [at least in our Northern variety] Sand burrs need full sunlight and worked soil. Get shaded out easily and won't compete with perennials. So with a sand burr problem plant a grass variety that grows fast and thick and it should eliminate the sand burrs.

Sounds good in theory, but doesn't work worth a flip in reality. Sand burrs are a grass plant, and they can keep pace with most any grass as far as growth is concerned. Alfalfa will shade them out, but it has been our experience that very few grasses will.
 

mnmtranching

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msscamp":3i7ehk8t said:
mnmtranching":3i7ehk8t said:
What I've noticed in sand burrs [at least in our Northern variety] Sand burrs need full sunlight and worked soil. Get shaded out easily and won't compete with perennials. So with a sand burr problem plant a grass variety that grows fast and thick and it should eliminate the sand burrs.

Sounds good in theory, but doesn't work worth a flip in reality. Sand burrs are a grass plant, and they can keep pace with most any grass as far as growth is concerned. Alfalfa will shade them out, but it has been our experience that very few grasses will.

Siberian Hay Millet did a good job of out growing it and shading it out. No noticeable burrs except edges and field roads. :nod: and I don't see it hardly at all in the perennial hay fields :D So this is not a theory. I would call it the results of another fact finding. "mnmt study" :cowboy:
 

Jogeephus

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You may have something there since the millet grows so tall. I have trouble with it in a Tift 85 field and it can grow about 2 feet tall before falling over. I was told if I kept it fertilized well it would crowd and/or shade it out. Unfortunately, this hasn't been the case cause when the grass weeps over the spurs stay prostrate. I will get rid of these things this spring one way or the other once I emplent another "Jogee Experimental Study". :lol2: Now all I gotta do is find some grant money for this valuable research I'm fixing to conduct. Bear in mind I do not object to any love offerings or donations from anyone. ;-) :mrgreen: :lol2:
 

mnmtranching

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Joe, I would think that with all the wisdom I've shared here on CT With the "mnmt fact finding studies" CT members and administration would have by now sent me some $$ to work with. Couple mil would get me going at it full time. :D :cowboy: I would of course cover a large geographical area, busy doing studies here and there according to game available and time of year etc. The local wildlife has so much to do with cattle ranching. :nod: And I'm sure I will need a partner You know? :compute:
 

Jogeephus

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That sounds like a good plan to me. I've always wanted to take some forage samples in grouse and pheasant habitat. Also wanted to do some TDN studies in the forages frequented by moose and mulies. Definitely would be worth someone investing in this type research for sure. I'd be willing to bet their last dollar on it. :mrgreen:
 

mnmtranching

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As long as ALL understand, WE go North for studies in June-July, West Sept-Nov and South to do the studies the rest of the year.
AND we accept cash. :welcome:
 

Jogeephus

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mnmtranching":17mdww0o said:
As long as ALL understand, WE go North for studies in June-July, West Sept-Nov and South to do the studies the rest of the year.
AND we accept cash. :welcome:

Sounds good to me. With all this interest in using kelp in the cattle bizness do you think we could talk Macon into helping us collect kelp samples when the tarpon are running.(I think this is the time kelp is at its peak) :nod:
 

mnmtranching

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Jogeephus":2g79761o said:
mnmtranching":2g79761o said:
As long as ALL understand, WE go North for studies in June-July, West Sept-Nov and South to do the studies the rest of the year.
AND we accept cash. :welcome:

Sounds good to me. With all this interest in using kelp in the cattle bizness do you think we could talk Macon into helping us collect kelp samples when the tarpon are running.(I think this is the time kelp is at its peak) :nod:

Kelp yeahhh! and once we have the Tarpon we need bet we can spend the whole Winter sitting in the shade/sun whatever, cold beverage in hand working out a plan to harvest the Kelp. I think we need to write up a grant. :nod: :cowboy:
 

Jogeephus

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Sounds like a plan BUT just as you did I have to put down one condition on the Tarpon run.(I think you'll be in agreement)

mnmtranching":3pl2mmqa said:
As long as ALL understand

.... that we can wear those Hawaiian shirts but we ALL have to leave our Speedos at the house. Cutoff's are mandatory.
 
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BRYANT

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Thanks for all the imput I have a real sticker ,sand burr , problem this year matter of fact most every one I have talked to around here does this year so I was kind of looking at some options I have about 30acres that I need to improve planing on sprigging bermuda in the spring but wanted some input about bahia
 

Jogeephus

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BRYANT":1db9603b said:
Thanks for all the imput I have a real sticker ,sand burr , problem this year matter of fact most every one I have talked to around here does this year so I was kind of looking at some options I have about 30acres that I need to improve planing on sprigging bermuda in the spring but wanted some input about bahia

If I had that situation and was going to sprig bermuda I would harrow the field early to level it and let it sprout the early weeds. I think you will find the sand spurs sprout pretty early in the year. I'd then spray with roundup and then sprig. Once sprigged if you keep the grass mowed this will make the grass spread faster and keep any late germinated sand spurs from bearing seed. If you will stay on top of this the first year the grass will be better and the spurs will be gone. JMO
 
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BRYANT

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Jogeephus":2fhfa1tz said:
If I had that situation and was going to sprig bermuda I would harrow the field early to level it and let it sprout the early weeds. I think you will find the sand spurs sprout pretty early in the year. I'd then spray with roundup and then sprig. Once sprigged if you keep the grass mowed this will make the grass spread faster and keep any late germinated sand spurs from bearing seed. If you will stay on top of this the first year the grass will be better and the spurs will be gone. JMO

This field does have sand burrs in spots but it has a lot of native grass I call broom grass that cattle won't hardly eat cause it gets tough the county said it takes 8 to 10 acres of it per cow so they will help me plant other grass they suggested to control burn it then offset disk it then sprig it.It was also suggested offset it now and let it freez then finish disk it in spring before I sprig it
I WELCOME ANY INPUT ON THIS
 

Jogeephus

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BRYANT":39vn1ihu said:
Jogeephus":39vn1ihu said:
If I had that situation and was going to sprig bermuda I would harrow the field early to level it and let it sprout the early weeds. I think you will find the sand spurs sprout pretty early in the year. I'd then spray with roundup and then sprig. Once sprigged if you keep the grass mowed this will make the grass spread faster and keep any late germinated sand spurs from bearing seed. If you will stay on top of this the first year the grass will be better and the spurs will be gone. JMO

This field does have sand burrs in spots but it has a lot of native grass I call broom grass that cattle won't hardly eat cause it gets tough the county said it takes 8 to 10 acres of it per cow so they will help me plant other grass they suggested to control burn it then offset disk it then sprig it.It was also suggested offset it now and let it freez then finish disk it in spring before I sprig it
I WELCOME ANY INPUT ON THIS

If it were me, I'd go ahead and spray it with roundup before it stops growing and let it die good before touching it. This will allow you to do a much better job when you put an implement in it. I like the idea of turning it but even when you turn it there is the chance of it clumping some if the grass roots are alive. Killed and aged is a different story - it will work just so much easier. I also like the idea of finishing it in the spring. Personally, I'd do this in early spring and allow enough time for the weeds to sprout then hit it again with roundup. This will get any of the spurrs that may sprout. Once you sprig it and pack it, spray the packed dirt with 2,4-D immediately. This will screw up texas millet and other weeds and not allow them to grow a proper root system.

Sandspurs in bermuda are a pain but thank goodness they are annuals so this is their achilles heel.
 

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