Any chance these guys will work.

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dun":3tfwi6hn said:
S.R.R.":3tfwi6hn said:
S.R.R.":3tfwi6hn said:
Strike 1
Strike 2

Mod1

:roll: Not again :shock: Dang I am sorry Mod1 but there is nothing wrong with me expressing a few be nice thoughts about the fact we as ranchers have got way off track when we start new breeds of cattle based on nothing more then their color. It is a disgrace to think we now start breeds for black. Not good musceling, good growth ect.!!!!!

If this isn't the first time, with any luck it will be the last. You've been around here long enough to know what's allowed and what isn't. I saw it before it was deleted and that definitly isn't allowed.

dun

Yeh you and the Modster were right. I will try and keep it toned down for the tender ears of "some" of our board members! ;-)

Back on topic. Does anyone know how the founding cattle of this BH breed were picked and who they were? Also do we know if only the best black and white calves were kept or was any black calf that came out considered a keeper?
 
S.R.R.":17nlpzwl said:
dun":17nlpzwl said:
S.R.R.":17nlpzwl said:
S.R.R.":17nlpzwl said:
Strike 1
Strike 2

Mod1

:roll: Not again :shock: Dang I am sorry Mod1 but there is nothing wrong with me expressing a few be nice thoughts about the fact we as ranchers have got way off track when we start new breeds of cattle based on nothing more then their color. It is a disgrace to think we now start breeds for black. Not good musceling, good growth ect.!!!!!

If this isn't the first time, with any luck it will be the last. You've been around here long enough to know what's allowed and what isn't. I saw it before it was deleted and that definitly isn't allowed.

dun

Yeh you and the Modster were right. I will try and keep it toned down for the tender ears of "some" of our board members! ;-)

Back on topic. Does anyone know how the founding cattle of this BH breed were picked and who they were? Also do we know if only the best black and white calves were kept or was any black calf that came out considered a keeper?

As I read it, I do believe that to be registered any foundation black bull has too be approved by a committee. He then can be registered as a "Black Hereford" and used on registered Herefords to produce new 'Black Herefords'
 
Beefy":pp3a34rp said:
how bout that new black hereford advertisement in the "progressive" farmer this month??

I was wondering if anyone else saw that. The way I see it, if that's the nicest looking bull they could find to put in a national ad, the breed won't be around very long.

Everyone is free to raise whatever breed that tickles their fancy, but for me I'll take my herefords red, along with my gelbvieh, simmi, etc....

cfpinz
 
These pics are off the Americam Black Hereford Association site, you tell me how are they different from a Black Baldy? Besides the obvious baldies are 50/50 crosses, but more the meat quality and marbling.

http://www.blackhereford.com/photos.html

Note the top "color that you can count on" these were bred for color and CAB.

Alan
 
Yeah, I thought it was ironic that this discussion on black herefords was going on, then I get my Progressive Farmer or Yuppie Farmer as it should be named and there's an ad for black Herefords. They look ok to me, I probably wouldn't try to get into them myself. If I were going to go to Herefords, which I really like, I'd go for Horned Herefords, red of course. But, I see what they are aiming for. Black calves with Hereford markings which still doesn't sound any different to me than any of the other breeds that have gone black to cater to the Black market. Of course these breeds all had to add Angus genetics to get the black color. So what's the difference? They've (Black Hereford) started their own association. Either like em and use em or don't.
 
Rustler9":wpc9wn00 said:
Yeah, I thought it was ironic that this discussion on black herefords was going on, then I get my Progressive Farmer or Yuppie Farmer as it should be named and there's an ad for black Herefords. They look ok to me, I probably wouldn't try to get into them myself. If I were going to go to Herefords, which I really like, I'd go for Horned Herefords, red of course. But, I see what they are aiming for. Black calves with Hereford markings which still doesn't sound any different to me than any of the other breeds that have gone black to cater to the Black market. Of course these breeds all had to add Angus genetics to get the black color. So what's the difference? They've (Black Hereford) started their own association. Either like em and use em or don't.

I applaud them for their honesty. I wish that Simmental, Gelbvieh, and Limousin had forced the black breeders to create their own seperate registries.
 
One of the many problems with allowing a breed to startup and be reg. based on color only is that next year when some new rancher comes along and wants to start raising cattle they may pick the BH. Now you have some poor sole wondering why his cattle have such a poor body structure and look like crap? No one bothered to tell him that the kind of cattle he chose to raise was developed not on a foundation of good forage ability, good muscling, good marbling, or good mothering ability's, but rather nothing more then the fact they were black and white!!!
 
Alan":3h4phmi1 said:
These pics are off the Americam Black Hereford Association site, you tell me how are they different from a Black Baldy? Besides the obvious baldies are 50/50 crosses, but more the meat quality and marbling.

http://www.blackhereford.com/photos.html

Note the top "color that you can count on" these were bred for color and CAB.

Alan

In the above website, one of the icons is "Why go black?".

They answered. Not what I would have liked to hear though. Nothing about quality. Only mentioned that red calves would not sell for as much as black.

Kind of disappointing when the reason for the breed is to not be red (or be black).

If they have to be around - which ofcourse they have a right to make a registry, I hope they focus on quality, not just color.
 
cypressfarms":3ll6ebj6 said:
I hope they focus on quality, not just color.
From the looks of some of the photos it doesn't seem that they are focusing on quality.
 
We have a calf looks like a black hereford..out of a cross bred cow and bull. I'm not knocking these calves they look fine.. but they are still crossed. We have a black baldie cow, a cross bred.. that has a calf looks like a hereford... can i call it a hereford now.

Cattle people make up the registration requirements. Since we do not own registered cattle and operate a commericial operation it doesn't matter. And we are happy with what we do.

I work at an apartment for seniors. And one lady talked about her cattle experience..they had hereford or white face cattle, but as soon as they bred the white faces out and made them black they were allowed to register them as angus. She liked black cattle. I would like what ever brings in the money. This person was probably running cattle in 1950.

This is just something new like then... sorry to get off subject a little, but I can see how it applies.
Donna
 
donnaIL":fki7s6pr said:
We have a calf looks like a black hereford..out of a cross bred cow and bull. I'm not knocking these calves they look fine.. but they are still crossed. We have a black baldie cow, a cross bred.. that has a calf looks like a hereford... can i call it a hereford now.

Cattle people make up the registration requirements. Since we do not own registered cattle and operate a commericial operation it doesn't matter. And we are happy with what we do.

I work at an apartment for seniors. And one lady talked about her cattle experience..they had hereford or white face cattle, but as soon as they bred the white faces out and made them black they were allowed to register them as angus. She liked black cattle. I would like what ever brings in the money. This person was probably running cattle in 1950.

This is just something new like then... sorry to get off subject a little, but I can see how it applies.
Donna

IF they had REALLY wanted to muck things up, they would have called them "Herefords" started a seperate registry, range registered a bunch of commercial Herfs, and sold registration papers to ANYTHING with Hereford blood in it allowing them too turn black supposedly "by accident" thru the grading up process.
 
donnaIL":spd5txrw said:
as soon as they bred the white faces out and made them black they were allowed to register them as angus.
I don't think so. :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
la4angus":3d4eccvn said:
cypressfarms":3d4eccvn said:
I hope they focus on quality, not just color.
From the looks of some of the photos it doesn't seem that they are focusing on quality.

that is a sorry looking bull in the advertisement for sure. he doesnt even look real. it looks like someone had their pet baldy steer stuffed when it died and then someone came back later and sewed some balls on him. he is lacking in length and his butt is hideous. on top of that his eyes look alienlike.
 
It's hard to believe that the Powers that be in the Black Hereford Assn. would even let that bull be what they are promoting. It doesn't matter that his calves may be 10 X better than he is, they are still using him to promote their assn. Those guys must have more money than sense. Jeeeees.
 
la4angus":5mrln0dv said:
It's hard to believe that the Powers that be in the Black Hereford Assn. would even let that bull be what they are promoting. It doesn't matter that his calves may be 10 X better than he is, they are still using him to promote their assn. Those guys must have more money than sense. Jeeeees.

To top it off there is no such breed. Cattlemen have been crosssing Angus and Herefords for years to get the baldy.
It's a crossbreed no matter how you slice it.
If it was a true breed they wouldn't have had to made up their own association.
 
Caustic Burno":17dajl6a said:
la4angus":17dajl6a said:
It's hard to believe that the Powers that be in the Black Hereford Assn. would even let that bull be what they are promoting. It doesn't matter that his calves may be 10 X better than he is, they are still using him to promote their assn. Those guys must have more money than sense. Jeeeees.

To top it off there is no such breed. Cattlemen have been crosssing Angus and Herefords for years to get the baldy.
It's a crossbreed no matter how you slice it.
If it was a true breed they wouldn't have had to made up their own association.
True. I never said it was a breed. Some guy wanted to be a wheel so he starts an assn to promote some crossbred cattle that have been doing a pretty good job on their own. Any decent cattleman in the country knows that the black baldy is about as good a beef animal as you gonna find.
 
la4angus":1hhgk9ho said:
Caustic Burno":1hhgk9ho said:
la4angus":1hhgk9ho said:
It's hard to believe that the Powers that be in the Black Hereford Assn. would even let that bull be what they are promoting. It doesn't matter that his calves may be 10 X better than he is, they are still using him to promote their assn. Those guys must have more money than sense. Jeeeees.

To top it off there is no such breed. Cattlemen have been crosssing Angus and Herefords for years to get the baldy.
It's a crossbreed no matter how you slice it.
If it was a true breed they wouldn't have had to made up their own association.
True. I never said it was a breed. Some guy wanted to be a wheel so he starts an assn to promote some crossbred cattle that have been doing a pretty good job on their own. Any decent cattleman in the country knows that the black baldy is about as good a beef animal as you gonna find.

Dang I did not get my post up fast enough! O.K. I will admit you said black baldy first but you did not reg. it so I do not owe you a thing! ;-)
 
for anybody who didnt see the advertisement (if you can call it that) it says:

Color You Can Count On
http://www.blackhereford.com
Since the 1930's black-baldie calves have topped local sales across the country. Red-baldies off the same set of cows are sorted and sold at a discount. Eliminate that loss with a Black Hereford bull on your black-hided cow herd. We have breeders in 12 states. Contact a breeder near you from the list on our website.

American Black Hereford Association
 
Caustic Burno":3v4ec1b2 said:
To top it off there is no such breed. Cattlemen have been crosssing Angus and Herefords for years to get the baldy.
It's a crossbreed no matter how you slice it.
If it was a true breed they wouldn't have had to made up their own association.

A "breed" is whatever the breeder says it is......in an ideal world after 40 years of linebreeding, rigorous culling, and intensive selection. All "registered" means is that an association of breeders somewhere were willing to give me a piece of paper on this particular animal. I have seen people with horses registered by something called the ~'ranch horse association' basically a western outfit that will register your grade horses on the theory that the word "registered" adds value to the animal. All breeds start by someone promoting a set of animals as somehow superior or unique and other people buying into that theory. Herefords themselves were once a set of mongrelized crossbred cows in Herfordshire England. People literally spent their lifetimes improving those foundation cattle. It is possible that 150 years from now 'Black Herefords' COULD be the best set of cows in the world.......that doesn't look very likely right now, but their breeders control their own destiny.
 

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